mad bunny

Hi all,
In my opinion, Canada is both bizarre and barmy. Apparently the Canadian government sets annual immigration quota's which need to be met. Then the due process is that you need Canadian experience to get a job, and most international qualifications are ill considered.
I'm a nurse. Specifically a psychiatric nurse. 'G' grade nursing sister. I was an autonomous practitioner, I undertook individual as well as child & family counselling. I worked with addictions, and high risk groups. I took bloods, and regulated medications, I ran injection clinics. I cared for the elderly mentally infirm, both functional and organic. I worked in a nursing home as a Deputy Matron. I could go on and on, and bore all and sundry. My point is this...
Canada is experiencing a nursing shortage. The Canadian Nurses Association, have just implemented a 1 year study to research Internationally Educated Nurses. This includes, Registered Nurses
Registered Psychiatric Nurses, and licensed Practical nurses. Apparently the Canadian government recognises that immigration is one tatic to supply more nurses, especially in an aging society!
Beats me why they make is so damn difficult then for I.E. nurses. By the way the mental health component of the canadian nurse qualification is 6 weeks, as opposed to the U.K.'s 4 years. Then they can specialise in mental health. According to the Ontario Nurses Association however, they do not go on the floor unsupported! Try being nowhere bloody near it.! If it's a general orientation then stick to what you have been instructed in.
The general nurses are very good, as I learnt when my other half had his pace-maker (40). Only been over here bloody 4 months! Men they'll do anything for attention eh! I left my uniform at 'home'. What's a man to do, he says!
O.K now the Ontario government announce strategies for long term care reform, following a recent report that indicated basically a lot of these facilities were not up to scratch. It suggested a range in quality. Means a lot of them are shit! Recommendations, which should not be considered dynamic or progressive by any stretch of the imagination as; keeping couples together, even if hey have different need levels,encouraging visitors, a home like atmosphere. Not bloody rocket science is it!
Interestingly enough the report states that 64 percent of residents admitted for long term care have some form of dementia or other cognitive impairment, yet there are no educational standards for health care aides or personal suport workers. The report recommends training for staff in the area of dementia and other mental disorders.
I have been advised that I cannot even work as a peronal support worker without undertaking, at my cost of course, training of between 4-6months. The between is because they may give me some credit for my training! Bloody big piss take, and that's me swearing!
The report further recommends training for staff in the area of dementia and other mental disorders!
Am I missing something here! Please feel free to enlighten me!
Oh, it also suggests giving bonuses to facilities that provide dementia care!
As I've been out of nursing for over a year, I'm in the ridiculous scenario of having to go back to the U.K. to work. That leaves me having to leave the love of my life (soppy but true, hey at least lucky in love as they say), to go back to nurse in the U.K.
We actually gave up a hell of a lot to be here.
I think Canada has lost he plot big time. It's competing with countries like Australia and New Zealand who are currently fast tracking nurses from the U.K.
Arrogance or just sheer stupidity I'm not sure.
Wakey Wakey Canada!
Please nobody try to insert the 'N' WORD. I'm ahead of you boys!
Regards.
Julie.

paddythepilot

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This has been a very interesting post.......which I have been following very closely.

So, from what I can see, the general consensus is that Canada does not offer much really:- very difficult to find a job, (let alone a career), very short holidays, profesional qualifications not easily accepted, high taxation and a 'less than dynamic' working environment.

I see that the pass mark for Canada was recently lowered, so 'getting in' would now be quite easy for someone like me, Degree holder, mid-30s, native English speaker with 15 years work experience.

So would it be worth giving up a highly paid career in Asia, where taxes are 15% (maximum), we get 4 weeks paid holiday per-year and promotion prospects are prety good if you can prove yourself capable.................to immigrate to Canada?

Or, would it worthwhile to stay here, 10-15 more years, (save all the dosh), and then retire early to somewhere like Vancouver, and not worry about all these problems?

I love living in Hong Kong & Asia in general, but sometime I get struck by the 'maybe the gress would be greener in Canada' thing, (I'm sure many people get this from time to time).

I would deeply appreciate any views from Brits already in Canada.

Cheers.

Iain Mc

Interesting reading these posts, especially the one above re: nursing. My other half is a senior physio specialised in neurology and we're (well, she) is currently in the process of Canadianising her qualifications.

On the face of it, it SEEMS like in that speciality at least there is a recognition of qualifications, experience and some support. However, we're early in this process and the crunch will come when she can start applying for work.

Me, I'm going to learn a new trade altogether, get some Canadian qualifications and start from the foot of the heap that way. I was going to do this in the UK anyway (early mid-life crisis, career change) so in my mind I'm not losing out any. Hopefully starting at the foot of the ladder in this way will help alleviate the Canadian experience bias, which reading these forums and others appears to be pretty depressing (and self-defeating for the Canadian government).

Safest place to have a heart attack in Canada? In the back of a taxi, as your driver is probably a cardiologist.

Old joke, same old story.

Cheers, Iain

iaink

Its an interesting thread. Although there are certainly some valid issues raised here about getting started in canada and the "canadian experience requirement" it seems that, based on my experience and that of the expats I know it is a little on the negative side, but maybe that is the nature of the demographics of this group. Nearly all the expats I know around here (and lets face it, not many of the long term residents bother to report back here) are generally happy in there work and lifestyle and would not go back to the UK.

Quick survey...how many of those reading this, who have been in canada for at least two years, would now prefer to go back to the UK and that way of life, now they have hopefully got past the initial hassles?

I still stand by my often repeated statement that you should not be motivated to emmigrate by money or career advancement, but by the change in your day to day quality of life, and by the values of the country you are going to. Canada is a foreign country, despite having a common language with the UK. Things are different here. Nothing is going to change that, so embrace it.

Iain

gem03

easier said than done for alot of people. e.g my friend came from the uk in 97. She trained as a nursery nurse back home, had 11 years experience in high end private schools in the Uk. Worked her way up to managing nursery schools, came to Canada. Her choice of work was either work as a nanny- long , long hours, really just a slave job and unlike the UK, this very well to do family wanted her to also clean their huge house! Or work as an asst. nursery nurse in a daycare. NNEB not accepted in ontario.Great choices for someone who managed nusery schools, has special needs training - including sign lanaguage and worked in Japan with children. Why should she go back to school in Canada when she speaks, English, french and spanish. With all the immigrants coming to canada, don't you think her skills could be put to use helping newcomers with the vital early years development or young moms who want to return to work. Think about it, children are the future and what parent in their right mind would object to her working in their local school, with children who need help. A good idea would be for her to be assesed by a head of dept. or something, and get her going on the right path and she, along with many, many other have great skills to offer.
So, long story short, she hacks it for a few years then pisses off back to the Uk. Is she glad she came, yes, looks great on you cv back home, as Brits like it when people take a walk about, gain some 'canadian experience' ha ha. Shows you have get up and go - up side, she now has a better job !
Good example of young blood, with great skills and education gone to waste, especially as so many countries kill for Brit trained teachers.

mickj

Just another sad story on the "canadian experience malarkey". They will rather employ someone that is canadian and hasn't left the country, than employ someone that has seen the world and practised their trade in other countries.

Like you said, travels and experience plays a key. I know when i applied for jobs back in london, my travels always comes up, and they are more interested in where i have been and what i did, even if it just involved voluntary and teaching kids in Africa.

It does get to you at a certain point, but you just have to persevere, and go out there and knock on doors looking for work. I drove one of my friends round mississauga once, handing his resume to every company around, 2 weeks later, he had more than 10 interviews.

CalgaryAMC

I wouldn't move back if you paid me. Well, that's not true. But I would need to be paid substantially.

I wonder though, if I hadn't come over as a student with nothing to lose, and was instead an established professional in Britain, would I do the move again? I don't know.

CalgaryAMC

It's hard I know to separate these things, but the restrictions on professionals in Canada is *not* a government thing. It is by the professional associations in each of the individual provinces.

That is why you end up with the contradiction where the government says that the country is short of x type of skilled worker, whilst the professional association won't let foreigners in without retraining.

CalgaryAMC

No.

Yes. Remember that Canada no longer has a retirement category (it used to). So you'd still be coming in as a skilled worker, even if you did not intend to work.

dingbat

I would go back home. I have been here 9 years in September and I moved for quality of life issues. Now I am stuck, qualified up the ying yang by UK standards but nailed to the floor economically. I wish I had stayed at home, but my kids are happy here as they know no different.

flashman

I have been in Canada since 1968 and have now spent more of my life here than in the UK. From what I remember the UK lifestyle has only been comparable to that of Canada for the past 10 years or so. Before that life in the UK was the pits with IRA violence, labour unrest etc. so overall my time in Canada has been much better.

My memories of the UK are now more like a theme park fantasy than reality. But the thing that struck me on my last visit was a sense of claustrophobia with crowded roads and little houses and poor value for money etc.

Also from reading the ex-pat UK press it seems like there's now a culture based on the superficial and trivial.

paddythepilot

Thanks for your input, so I didn't think about that.......no such thing as a 'retirement visa' eh?

Oh well, never mind, I might have to consider France or Malaysia etc?

So it appears, whilst Canada is a lovely country with wide open spaces, fresh air etc.......economically it is a bit of a basket case?

Without a decent career, or at least a liveable wage, you can't enjoy what Canada has to offer, what shame eh?

Cheers.

mad bunny

Hi All,
Firstly ClagaryAMC, I'm afraid to differ with your contention that it is not a government thing in relation to the professional regulatory bodies. I can completely understand where you are coming from however. The regulatory nursing bodies regulate the standards, practises, ethics etc of nursing. They are however *funded* by the government, and are not independant of their dictates.
In the U.K. the government for example will call for a white paper on something they intend to address or look to reform, this will be done with the nurse regulatory bodies acting in a consultancy manner. The aim is to colloborate and work together to reach an acceptable standard or reform. There are the two reports that I mentioned in my post that will be government funded. After all health is a government concearn. Nurses are not indissociable from government funding, and cannot dictate the policies of health care as can the government.
Hence in order for me to be more proactive, I need to loby the government, not the nurse regulatory bodies, if I am to expediate change in a constructive manner.
Iain Mc, as your wife is a general nurse, she should not meet the same obstacles, and should once her qualifications are accredited, and passes the 'test', she will be able to gain her licensure to practise. A nurse from Australia who nursed my husband whilst in emergency, called Kylie, well what do you know, suggested the test was very straightforward. Other than that I would'nt know. Nursing is nursing at the end of the day, as people and their bodies and minds all work the same way.
It's just the way of working, and perhaps drug names that are different, so I'm sure she'll be fine. It's the specialisms that are not recognised in Canada, your psychiatric and learning disabilities. Unfortunately I'm not in a position to allow myself to be deskilled, as I need to make sure that I can support my husband, if his health should fail further. So will be going'home' to work, earn dosh and maintain my registration, and putting up a scrap for a change in government policys in relation to mental health & learning disabilities.
Spouse by the way is very happy in Canada. Another reason to put up a fight eh!
Gem, I agree with all of your post 100%.
So many countries kill for U.K. trained nurses as well.
There are a lot of good skills in Canada, at no cost to canada, which are not utilised. What a shame, and what a waste!
Best regards to all.

ThemeOne

Another point about retirement - I'm sure I recall reading a leaflet about this which said that although you can get your state retirement pension if you live in Canada, you don't get the inflation-linked increases.

If this is wrong, someone please correct me, but if I've remembered correctly it seems like yet another disincentive for moving to Canada!

flashman

The Australian and Canadian ex-pats have a case before the House of Lords about pension indexing since retirees living in the U.S. do have their U.K. pensions indexed.