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$4500/yr car insurance with three star?

$4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Old Jan 20th 2012, 6:18 pm
  #61  
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian View Post
Trouble is, the driving ability of the new Canadians is such that, if they are of Asiatic orgin and if they drive as badly across Canada as they do in Calgary, the premiums collected will nowhere near cover the cost of the damage caused.
AFAIK, the insurance business is all about being able to assess risk. If you're better at it than your competitor, either one of the following happens when you quote a customer:

a) your competitor quotes a higher rate -> you get the business, you win (given you've correctly assessed the risk)
b) your competitor quotes a lower rate -> his payment doesn't cover the probabilistic losses (again given you've correctly assessed the risk), so they lose -> you win -> they'll quote a higher rate in the future -> see a)

If you specialise in "new Canadians", you could find out about local conditions in their country of origin, learn how insurance there operates, to get a better view of the probabilistic risk.

Last edited by FlyingDutchman6666; Jan 20th 2012 at 6:22 pm.
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Old Jan 20th 2012, 6:24 pm
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Originally Posted by FlyingDutchman6666 View Post
That's true, but take the (purely hypothetical) case of, say, a Belgian and a Dutch person with 10 years of driving history in the UK. The company would set rates (and discriminate) based on where the NCD was incurred (and its quality) - which doesn't mean they discriminate on country of origin, right?
They might do that, just as companies don't use age but have a sudden drop in premium for eight years licensed, but every year there would be new legislation to close whatever loop hole they were using and they'd have to come up with another mechanism (this, btw, is how they arrived at using credit rating, it's a substitute for age). Each time some new group of unlucky drivers would be penalised as an unintended consequence.
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Old Jan 20th 2012, 6:33 pm
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Originally Posted by dbd33 View Post
They might do that, just as companies don't use age but have a sudden drop in premium for eight years licensed, but every year there would be new legislation to close whatever loop hole they were using and they'd have to come up with another mechanism (this, btw, is how they arrived at using credit rating, it's a substitute for age). Each time some new group of unlucky drivers would be penalised as an unintended consequence.
That's a bit unfortunate !!

Not that I'm against govt regulation of the insurance business, mind you. The way bioscience is evolving, it's not unreasonable to expect tests to become available soonish (10 years) which determine the genetic probability of developing certain types of cancer over the next 30-40 years of one's life. I can see private health insurance companies making such a genetic test as compulsory as a health check, at least in some countries (cough.. US... cough). Guess what will happen if you have the wrong kind of genes, but otherwise healthy (even a baby)...?

Last edited by FlyingDutchman6666; Jan 20th 2012 at 6:35 pm.
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Old Jan 20th 2012, 6:53 pm
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Originally Posted by dbd33 View Post
A problem for the new insurer is that it's not lawful to discriminate based on country of origin. Similarly, depending on the province, it may not be lawful to discriminate based on age or sex. The companies are left to set the rate based on the worst case.
I appreciate that and I was, of course, being just a tad facetious
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Old Jan 20th 2012, 7:03 pm
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian View Post
I appreciate that and I was, of course, being just a tad facetious
I thought you might know that but that it might come as a surprise to other readers that so many underwriting criteria used in other markets are not allowed here. The effect is that, for example, a 26 year old female with three years clean driving experience looks a much better risk in the UK than here.
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Old Jan 21st 2012, 12:08 am
  #66  
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Try these guys:

http://www.smartcoverage.ca/

I bought my first car last year after being here for 8 years or so but living in downtown Toronto so didn't jsutify the expense of a car. Still live in Toronto (so should be comparable post code rate wise) but needed a car for work etc.

I went through a million quotes before I found these guys. I tried my home insurer who we had a house policy with for 5 years with no claims etc. and they quoted me just under $5,000. All the other places I tried, pretty much the ones named in all these posts, varied from say $4,000-$12,000. The Johnsons place wouldn't quote me because they said they didn't do new drivers or something.

I was looking for coverage for a 2010 Sonata, just me driving it as my wife doesn't drive. Ontario G since 2003 and UK license since 1996. I had a 2 year NCD letter from my last UK insurer which was like 1997-1999, but then i went to University so sold the car and drive my parents on occasion until I moved to Canada and then I just rented when I needed one or borrowed family car etc.

So my problem there was that even if I got somewhere to recognize the 2 year historical NCD they questioned the gap between 1999-2003 when I was outside Canda with no insurance history. Then I had my 8 years in Canada with no tickets or accidents etc. but also no named insurance due to renting etc.

So first thing I did was got myself added as a named driver on my wife's parents policy. It didn't cost them anything because they have had the same policy/broker etc. for decades and I didn't live at their address etc. What that did, as I understand, was cause my name to turn up on searches when being quoted. Kind of like an entry point. They ask the question "have you ever been named on an insurance policy in Canada before?" if you say no, then that is that and you get the crazy quote. If you say yes, even if it is a short period, then you can proceed to document more history.

With the Smart Coverage (a broker they use Motors Insurance which is part of GM I think) they acknowledged that and gave me credit for my time in Ontario, they also recognized the UK history so I scanned and emailed my letter from my UK insurer and they gave me credit for that and I got the quote down to about $3,200 which was crazy but the best of the bunch.

Then I had a stroke of luck because I was talkign to my parents in the UK about it and my Mum called their insurer and found out that they had never taken my name off their policy. Their insurer said they should have removed me once I moved out and definately once I left the country and they removed me moving forward but that meant that I had technically been named on their policy since like 1998. So she got a letter from them and emailed it to me and I forwarded it to the broker like 3 days before I needed to take out the polciy to pick up my new car and he was like, sure ok this works and gave me full credit for no claims since basically I have had a licence. Like 9 years or whatever their max was.

So that brought it down to around $2,500 for full coverage. I think with $1,000 deductible, maybe $500. Which is still a huge hit every year but not bad for Toronto, 32 year old male, married with clean license etc.

So anyway, try those guys they might recognize the UK history and get a better quote?

Drew
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Old Jan 21st 2012, 1:54 am
  #67  
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

We got a quote from TD insurance for 2 cars, 2011 Nissan Sentra and 2006 KIA Rio for $3,600 and we went with it. We had to do our test again here as we only had Irish licences so our Irish experience and 15 years no claims bonus between was never considered. Actually we also had a broker look at getting our Irish experience taken into consideration and with a 3 star rating our insurance was over $4,500..

Try not mentioning your previous experience at all and see what happens, nothing to lose!!
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Old Jan 22nd 2012, 10:59 am
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

O.M.G. That's a RIP. Seems they have deliberatley not allowed UK non claims so thay can rip newcomers off?
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Old Jan 22nd 2012, 11:00 am
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Surely say 5 years UK no cliams has to mean something? $5,000+ quotes that's crazy expensive.
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Old Jan 22nd 2012, 12:24 pm
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Well all is not rosy in the UK if we believe this

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ing-truth.html
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Old Jan 22nd 2012, 5:40 pm
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Originally Posted by wizzard View Post
Then I had a stroke of luck because I was talkign to my parents in the UK about it and my Mum called their insurer and found out that they had never taken my name off their policy. Their insurer said they should have removed me once I moved out and definately once I left the country and they removed me moving forward but that meant that I had technically been named on their policy since like 1998. So she got a letter from them and emailed it to me and I forwarded it to the broker like 3 days before I needed to take out the polciy to pick up my new car and he was like, sure ok this works and gave me full credit for no claims since basically I have had a licence. Like 9 years or whatever their max was.

So that brought it down to around $2,500 for full coverage. I think with $1,000 deductible, maybe $500. Which is still a huge hit every year but not bad for Toronto, 32 year old male, married with clean license etc.
Drew
Aha, so being a named driver on someone's policy in Canada does count towards Canadian no-claims history? That's an interesting piece of information !!

I guess most Canadian drivers start out that way - named on their parents' policy?
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Old Jan 22nd 2012, 6:11 pm
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Originally Posted by FlyingDutchman6666 View Post
Aha, so being a named driver on someone's policy in Canada does count towards Canadian no-claims history? That's an interesting piece of information !!

I guess most Canadian drivers start out that way - named on their parents' policy?
No. There aren't named drivers in Canada (at least not in provinces where there's commercial car insurance). What there is is "any driver" policies for which the premium is based on all the drivers in the household. Typically, if a person is named on a policy it's as an excluded driver.
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Old Jan 22nd 2012, 6:21 pm
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Originally Posted by FlyingDutchman6666 View Post
Aha, so being a named driver on someone's policy in Canada does count towards Canadian no-claims history? That's an interesting piece of information !!

I guess most Canadian drivers start out that way - named on their parents' policy?
Not in BC. The vehicle is insured and anyone who is licensed and with the owners permission can drive it. You have to name a principal driver, the premium is based on this, one can put restrictions on the policy, such as no drivers with less than 10 years experience. If you don't have an insurance policy in your own name, you don't build up a claims history. You could have 20 years experience, but if you have had no insurance policy in your name, you have no insurance history, so no discounts.
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Old Jan 22nd 2012, 7:28 pm
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Originally Posted by Former Lancastrian View Post
Well all is not rosy in the UK if we believe this

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ing-truth.html
Former Lancastrian

We moved back from Canada in 2006 and get fully no claims now. I agree car insurance has gone up a lot over the last few years. My wife and I are in our mid 40's and paying now £240-£280/yr for each car (this does include recovery). In 1997 we were paying £100 fully comp for my wife. We had some silly quotes of £700 so we shop around every year. I was quoted £2800 last year for my 18 year son to drive my car, so he will have to wait until he finish university before he gets a car. When I was 18 it cost £20 to be added to my Dads car insurance.

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Old Jan 23rd 2012, 1:02 pm
  #75  
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Default Re: $4500/yr car insurance with three star?

Originally Posted by wizzard View Post
Thanks Drew, cheapest quote I've seen for a while, although the liability maxed out at $1M?
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