Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

Old Jun 16th 2020, 3:53 am
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Default Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

My son is currently working in the Netherlands on a highly-skilled migrant visa. He earned his MS in Leiden and can apply for permanent residence in about 2 more years. Sometime after that he can apply for citizenship. His understanding is that he will have to renounce his US citizenship and is not able to be a dual national. Is that right? If not, can he retain permanent residency and keep his US citizenship?
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Old Jun 16th 2020, 7:23 am
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

As you already mention, he *can* apply for Dutch citizenship, but he is not forced to do so. Dual nationality is not allowed in the Netherlands (except for a few specific circumstances), so his choice would indeed result in him having to denounce his US citizenship. However, that would be the consequence of his free choice.
Permanent residency is, as the word says, permanent and does not involve renouncing citizenship.

For more details you can start reading here: https://ind.nl/en/dutch-citizenship/...alisation.aspx
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Old Jun 17th 2020, 1:36 am
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

Thanks, SushiFan - that link was very helpful. So it seems there is something called long-term permanent residency. Once he obtains that, would it be possible for him to spend a few years outside of the Netherlands if necessary and retain permanent residency? Is there a limit to how long he can spend outside the Netherlands on any one trip? I didn't see anything specifically pertaining to losing permanent residency.
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Old Jun 17th 2020, 7:31 am
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

I don't know. It would be best if your son contacts the local IND department to ask about losing permanent residency.
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Old Jun 17th 2020, 7:32 pm
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

You will find the answer to your question on the IND website; this link will take you straight there.

Hope this helps.
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Old Jun 17th 2020, 7:39 pm
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

I know of a few Dutch people living in the USA that have dual nationality. My son is a student in amsterdam and looked into this as well and came across some stuff that suggested it was possible to maintain other nationalities. I would suggest your son investigate this. I would imagine that becoming an EU citizen will have benefits above that of permanent residency in NL.
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Old Jun 17th 2020, 7:41 pm
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

Originally Posted by HannahGreen View Post
My son is currently working in the Netherlands on a highly-skilled migrant visa. He earned his MS in Leiden and can apply for permanent residence in about 2 more years. Sometime after that he can apply for citizenship. His understanding is that he will have to renounce his US citizenship and is not able to be a dual national. Is that right? ....
There are a number of exceptions to the prohibition on holding dual nationality which could apply to your son, and though I would guess that most do not apply to your son, there is at least one which could easily apply if your son has studied and is now living in the Netherlands, i.e. he has lived there for a fair period of time and expects to do so for another two years or more - and that is the exception for someone married to, or is in a registered relationship, with a Dutch citizen.
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Old Jun 17th 2020, 8:33 pm
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

Dutch nationality law is based primarily on the principle of jus sanguinis, which I've always interpreted as meaning that you inherit the nationality of your parents at the time of your birth. All my children are dual nationals (UK/NL) because their mother is a Dutch national and we registered their birth with the Dutch Embassy in the country where we lived at the time of their birth - they all have 2 valid passports. There is a useful wiki page which may help at this link.

The only real difference in the Netherlands between permanent residence and nationality is the right to vote in Dutch parliamentary elections - nationals can vote.

Hope this helps.
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Old Jun 21st 2020, 3:47 pm
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

We have both UK and US citizenship and applied for our Dutch Residence Permits as EUCitizens. These will be exchanged for something else after the UK finalise leaving. We're eligible for Dutch citizenship now and believe that although we would have to renounce our UK citizenship we wouldn’t have to for our American. Why? Because since the US government requires you pay $2,300 and be subject to an exit tax to renounce, the Dutch accept that we will be financially penalized and therefore would grant an exemption.

At then of the day, we'll do what we need to do as the Netherlands is where we want to be now we’re retired.
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Old Jun 21st 2020, 4:00 pm
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

Originally Posted by Dizzyp View Post
We have both UK and US citizenship and applied for our Dutch Residence Permits as EUCitizens. These will be exchanged for something else after the UK finalise leaving. We're eligible for Dutch citizenship now and believe that although we would have to renounce our UK citizenship we wouldn’t have to for our American. Why? Because since the US government requires you pay $2,300 and be subject to an exit tax to renounce, the Dutch accept that we will be financially penalized and therefore would grant an exemption.

At then of the day, we'll do what we need to do as the Netherlands is where we want to be now we’re retired.

this is also what my son found out.
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Old Jul 3rd 2020, 1:40 pm
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

Originally Posted by SushiFan View Post
As you already mention, he *can* apply for Dutch citizenship, but he is not forced to do so. Dual nationality is not allowed in the Netherlands (except for a few specific circumstances), so his choice would indeed result in him having to denounce his US citizenship. However, that would be the consequence of his free choice.
Permanent residency is, as the word says, permanent and does not involve renouncing citizenship.

For more details you can start reading here: https://ind.nl/en/dutch-citizenship/...alisation.aspx
I never fully understood the "few specific circumstances" where NL allows dual nationality in the case of naturalization. I understand that one of them would be marriage to a Dutch citizen. But what about if citizenship is tied to property ownership in another country other than NL, or if it's a tax question in that other country? Sadly naturalization is also too often seen as a choice, however, it's often also realistically "the only choice" especially if one plans a longer absence from that country, for whatever job reason there is these days? Any return to NL would mean, starting from the beginning again.....
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Old Jul 3rd 2020, 1:57 pm
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

Originally Posted by OrangeMango View Post
..... But what about if citizenship is tied to property ownership in another country other than NL, or if it's a tax question in that other country? .....
Wouldn't those examples fall under the cost/ penalty exception in the Netherlands?
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Old Jul 4th 2020, 3:31 pm
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

Originally Posted by Pulaski View Post
Wouldn't those examples fall under the cost/ penalty exception in the Netherlands?
That's one of the questions many applicants for Dutch citizenship would have and the ruling cost or penalty are not really clearly explained.

Myself I am a citizen of Canada. If I had to give that one up, certain options in life would be gone forever and the time I could spend within Canada plus the things I could do there, like employment would be limited or none at all.
I am also a British citizen, which seems the only decent choice, if I ever wanted to return there, and Brexit is fully implemented. Thus I can't give it up either.
I also have another citizenship of an EU country which I can't give up as well, as it allows free movement within the EU, plus it's tied to some property I inherited, where citizenship is actually a clear a requirement.

Not having these citizenships would certainly offer me certain limitations. Whether that would qualify under exceptions in Dutch law, I don't know.

Yes, I understand that the application for Dutch citizenship is completely voluntary, but again, it's nice to have, if one has accumulated the number of years in the country. And in today's times with Corona, and things changing rapidly, citizenship would be a wise investment, but only if I don't have to renounce others.

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Old Jul 4th 2020, 5:25 pm
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

Originally Posted by OrangeMango View Post
That's one of the questions many applicants for Dutch citizenship would have and the ruling cost or penalty are not really clearly explained.

Myself I am a citizen of Canada. If I had to give that one up, certain options in life would be gone forever and the time I could spend within Canada plus the things I could do there, like employment would be limited or none at all.
I am also a British citizen, which seems the only decent choice, if I ever wanted to return there, and Brexit is fully implemented. Thus I can't give it up either.
I also have another citizenship of an EU country which I can't give up as well, as it allows free movement within the EU, plus it's tied to some property I inherited, where citizenship is actually a clear a requirement.

Not having these citizenships would certainly offer me certain limitations. Whether that would qualify under exceptions in Dutch law, I don't know.

Yes, I understand that the application for Dutch citizenship is completely voluntary, but again, it's nice to have, if one has accumulated the number of years in the country. And in today's times with Corona, and things changing rapidly, citizenship would be a wise investment, but only if I don't have to renounce others.
The rules seem fairly clear to me, though some might be a bit fuzzy, but the Dutch rules seem largely focused on financial cost, actual money, and the right to own property etc., and place no significance on you wanting to keep your options open to live and work in another country, such as the UK or Canada.
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Old Jul 5th 2020, 8:25 am
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Default Re: Dual US/Dutch citizenship?

Originally Posted by Pulaski View Post
The rules seem fairly clear to me, though some might be a bit fuzzy, but the Dutch rules seem largely focused on financial cost, actual money, and the right to own property etc., and place no significance on you wanting to keep your options open to live and work in another country, such as the UK or Canada.
I'd rather consider Belgium then, if I wanted to live in another country for a longer time. "clear to me, though some might be a bit fuzzy, but the Dutch rules seem largely focused on financial cost, actual money". That criteria would actually be met in my interpretation, if I had to re-apply for any kind of visa for Canada, or some ILR or pre-settled visa in the UK at some point foreseen or unforeseen in the future. The cost isn't exactly low, and is not expected to get cheaper, more expensive at some point. However I doubt hat this would actually qualify as "financial cost" and "actual money" in the position of the Dutch authorities.
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