scottishcelts

I agree, and trying to get the message across that it's not about Salmond and his cohort of cronies - to see past that, has been fruitless.

Amazulu

My take:

I have no vested interest in that country but reckon that they are better as a union, so would go for no
The UK has achieved so much in its past (although its record since 1945 is ordinary - but that's what socialism does to a country)
Don't try and fix something that isn't broken
The no campaign has not been good (G Brown FFS) but neither has the yes
Salmond is a terrible leader - far-left and won't answer the hard questions. He has plain outright lied about so many issues
Economically it would be a disaster for Scotchland - lying about non-existent oil and gas reserves is going to get them nowhere
Major companies will leave - trying to deny this is head in the sand stuff
The EU will swallow Scotchland up in one bite and it will become a province of Brussels - with the Euro as its currency
The hysteria from most of the UK media has been ridiculous - The Daily Telegraph has published some real shite for instance

It will be a no vote IMO

paulry

They're not as selfish as you might think. Older generations take a wiser and more cautious view. And they also tend to think a lot more about providing a stable future for their children and grandchildren.

Gordon Barlow

Yes it has. After all, even if the vote were 90% YES, it would take years to negotiate a departure, and who knows what might happen in the meantime. Look at all the to-ing and fro-ing in Canada, with Quebec's threats to secede. And what about eastern Ukraine - no, WAIT... uhh - not the best example, probably...

paulry

Why 50-ish percent of the Scots would want this is beyond me, but as the article suggests, it might be the only option now.

GarryP

Yeah, it covers some of the stuff I've been banging on about for months. It almost get to the point where it understands why Cameron wants a 'yes' vote and thus his actions to date, but shies away at the end.

Only bit I would disagree about is the "long and protracted" bit - I think Cameron will make the negotiations short and to the point - "this is what you're getting" - such that he can have them out, and England realising how deviously smart he's been, before the election. Maybe tie the election date to the conclusion of negotiations with the justification of "a clean break".

Oh and one other thing. It's in the interests of countries around the world that scotland obviously and spectacularly fail (otherwise regions will be looking to break away left and right). So once Cameron has bent them over and had his way there will be a steady stream of other countries waiting their term.

They want to hope to hell that they vote "no".

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Edit : Oh, and for those who can't read it because of the FT paywall - stick "What happens after a Yes vote will shock the Scots" into google news and go via there.

ozzieeagle

Worst thing that can happen is the vote is very very close either way. As the turmoil will go on for years and years. My concern for the Scots is the first sign of any major political drama post this referendum and there will be thousands on the streets.... On either side.

The only real issue for the rest of the UK post this vote if it does go yes is Scotland allowing situations like Russian or Chinese subs into it's ports... doubt that will ever happen, but you never know. The Irish hosted the enemy in WW2

Hope this doesnt cause rabid sectarianism. Scots on both sides really wouldnt want that surely ????

First sign of any Orange marches and England should never ever let them back in the Union. Keep that kind of crap away from the Atheists and Agnostics of England.


Had enough of the politics of religion.

Gordon Barlow

Whenever there is a movement for independence, the classic argument has been that they would fall flat on their face. Yet, in this case, many British believe that Scotland has a lot of socialists who live off the state and therefore Scotland costs Britain money. Support for Scottish Independence may even be higher inside Britain than in Scotland.

... when India sought Independence:
Kinnoch: With respect, Mr. Gandhi, without British administration, this country would be reduced to chaos.

Gandhi: Mr. Kinnoch, I beg you to accept that there is no people on Earth who would not prefer their own bad government to the good government of an alien power.

Brigadier: My dear sir! India *is* British. We’re hardly an alien power!

[silence]
(from Lew Rockwell)
Scottish Independence v. India Independence – LewRockwell.com

Dennis The Menace

A Russian Submarine visited the Faslane Naval Base in 2001, One also visited Hms Dolphin in Gosport in 1993 so nothing new there

paulry

So when does the UK get to decide whether or not to keep Scotland?

GarryP

There's dumb, and then there's shoot yourself in the head, terminal stupidity :

BP threatened with nationalisation in independent Scotland - Yorkshire Post

Someone will NOT be on Salmond's Christmas Card list - if he doesn't order the prat lynched first.

paulry

Wow! What nutter would vote for that?

fish.01

You can read lots of speculation posing as fact in this debate.

Amazulu

As long as the same standards are applied to muslim marches

William of Orange was king of England from 1650 to 1702

Protestantism is part of the religious fabric from which the UK was built. Islam is not

Amazulu

Correction: WoO was king from 1689 to 1702