TiddlyPom

I have no problem them asking me. But I refuse.

Like you say, if I were going to steal something, the last place I'd put it would be in my bag. Next they'll be asking us to strip to our undies at the door.

iamthecreaturefromuranus

[QUOTE=Machiavelli;6851207

So, if we were all chipped, say the government said that all babies had to be chipped at birth, what would happen? And would we know if they had 'chipped' our babies? How paranoid do you think we should be?

And if we think that 'chipping' is a good thing for our pets, why would we not think it a good thing to happen to our children? Do pet owners not 'chip' their pets to stop them from being stolen or lost?

[/QUOTE]

While we are probably a way off being 'chipped' if you have ever been arrested and charged in the UK your DNA is now on file.... and there are people suggesting that everybody should have their DNA registered.

Its the access and security of information that worries me. How about if insurance companies got access to peoples DNA records and started to refuse people health/life insurance because your DNA profile said you were a high risk?. That sort of thing is probably not that far away.

Machiavelli

First week here. Jetlagged. Hot, arrived in January! Too scared that they would deport me after all the hassle of getting the visa.

Now I just do it. To be fair, I'm not a big shopper. I go get what I want, I pay, (usually), I leave. I go to the same stores for most stuff, and the ladies know me now. I wouldn't want to offend them!

Oddly, just thinking now, there are more stores where they don't have ladies on the door than ones where they do. None of the jewellery shops ask to look in your bag, or DVD/CD stores.

Anyway, maybe I'll try it after I move. New stores, new rules, and they can't deport me now!

Mxxx

GinaUK

We don't have every inch of the shops covered with CCTV cameras here and many shops don't have automatic scanners at the door.

Instead we have a person at the door that asks to check our bags.

I don't like having my bag checked. But I prefer that option to the CCTV cameras and scanners. The fewer "machines" watching and recording our every move and purchase the better. For that reason, the bag-checker at the door gets my vote and I don't mouth off at them. I don't want the shop to replace him/her with CCTV cameras and scanners and ...

Gina

TiddlyPom

I don't 'mouth off' at them either! I very politely decline to have them look in my personal property. I am perfectly within my legal rights to decline their request. And so are you if you don't like it!

I am just that sort of person. I dislike showing my personal stuff to a stranger when I am not required to under the law. If the law says I don't have to do it, then I won't be doing it any time soon either.
They know this which is why when you refuse, they can do nothing. And they know it.

Machi, I'm not a big shopper either, and the employees locally know me now... I'm always pleasant but I refuse to put my bag on show. It's none of their business.
I'd like to see how much theft the bag person at the door stops. I bet it's absolutely minimal.

Where's Vash? He's good at googling. The figures are probably online somewhere.

Safin

Whilst I agree with privacy it takes a child being snatched / a shop assistant being knifed / a garage being held up at gun point / some other criminal being in a store for whatever reason and now being visually identifiable to argue the case for CCTV in stores, let alone what happens in the street.

Lots more (admittedly sometimes petty) crime gets solved now as a result of CCTV which is what everyone wants. Well it does if the CCTV is good enough quality - worthless if it's cheap s**t.

What's to hide if you've done nowt? And if you're in a public place then you're ina public place! Ok the operators might get a laugh now and then but it'd be pretty rare for bad unfair consequences to happen. Probably far fairer and safer than eyewitness accounts!

And despite saying this I think I'd refuse to open my bag too unless they wanted to accuse me of theft - then I probably would to avoid more hassle but I bet most of the checkers would back down before me. Don't think I'd bother suing though

Machiavelli

Luckily, I haven't been arrested in any country, so far!

But, I've had blood taken regularly during my lifetime. How would I know if there wasn't a secret law here, or back in the UK, that forced doctors or pathology labs to send my blood off to be DNA tested? How do we know that they don't already DNA test babies at birth? As I said before, how paranoid can we be?

The only time I felt uncomfortable was when I had to have my blood taken for my visa. I didn't like the fact that they were testing for HIV. The doctor told me that if, in future, I was asked by an insurance company if I'd had an HIV test that I was to state that it was for immigration medical purposes only.

Yes, I think that you're right to be worried about the access and security of information. Thinking now of the recent loss of information regarding 'child benefit' records in the UK. I know people who were affected. Nothing may come of it, but then again some people think that children whose details were 'lost' may be affected by identity theft in the future.

Nothing is 100% failproof. Someone else said, if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to worry about.

The insurance companies may be the ones who are trying to get all these measures implemented. The BMI charts that the medical profession use now to gauge obesity are the ones set up by an insurance company in USA in the mid 50s (think date is right). Don't most insurance companies expect you to have a medical if the policy is for over a certain amount? It was like that when I last took out cover. If this is the case they may already be DNA testing the blood taken during the medical.

It may be that in the future, we will be able to stand at the front of a big screen and press buttons to see where our teenagers are I know that in some of the jobs I've had, I did threathen to 'chip' the guys I had to keep tabs on. That would have made my life so much easier!

So, back on topic, privacy or security?

Mxxx

Safin

in airports? Security everytime.

Despite all the changes since 9/11 I've seen some shocking disregard of these changes by officials so it's only as good as those administering it.

iamthecreaturefromuranus

That's the classic argument used by security forces the world over.... and we all fall for it. It gradually leads to Government knowing a damn site more about you than you might be happy for them to know. I work in the IT industry and used to support a large, doughnut shaped, building in Cheltenham for the security services.... you would be staggered to know what they can find out about people already.

As for the security vs privacy question... I personally feel that a line in the sand should be drawn now... "they" know enough already... they should be prevented from extending those powers.

Safin

I think the OP was talking about the limited realm of airport security before we got carried away. In that sense I know I'd prefer them to know what colour my knickers are rather then be blown up by a loonie

iamthecreaturefromuranus

Why would a loonie want to blow up your knickers

Machiavelli

I think that security measures will only get more stringent as time passes, and if we don't agree with them then we may personally have to give up travelling by air, or crossing borders. I'm not saying that I agree with this, just that it may happen.

I would still prefer to walk through a (harmless) scanner, than be physically checked over by a complete stranger.

Mxxx

Pollyana

You think you jest, but I have been asked in BiLo to remove my jacket and long sleeved shirt as they obviously thought I would conceal groceries down my front instead of putting them in the trolley with the rest of the shopping:curse:

Machiavelli

That's shocking

I hope that you didn't do it

Mxxx

Hutch

I am in complete agreement.

I had a friend who worked in said doughnut shaped building in Cheltenham - and another who was busy discretely listening to men with broad Derry accents in the late troubles over the Irish sea. Both made me very aware of how much my civil liberties had been eroded since the 1960s.