brissybee

Resources Republic anyone?

Amazulu

I can see that this makes you happy (if it's true)

Amazulu

Subsidies for car manufacturers happen all over the world and Australia is certainly not the worst - BMW is heavily state subsidised. As are the industries in Korea, Japan, US, UK etc

Problem for Holden and Australia is that we are subsidising cars that people no longer really want to buy - the new Commodore is a nice car but it's just the wrong car. At least BMW make cars that are desirable and sell

I have mixed feelings about this. Subsidies to just prop up failing industries are generally a bad idea - the money could be spent better elsewhere in the economy or taxes reduced. On the other hand, advanced nations should have the capability to manufacture vehicles (saying that, there are advanced economies in Europe that don't - Norway, Denmark) and to lose this capability would be a big blow - just as the run down of the shipbuilding and aerospace industries industries has been a big blow to the UK

High cost nations do successfully build cars - Germany, Italy, Japan. If they can do it so should we but I don't think we have the government, policy or industry leaders to make it happen

Swerv-o

This is the key for me on this issue - As the cost of fuels rise, the desire and need to have these large and thirsty cars is inevitably going to wane. The only real mass markets for these cars are Australia and NZ, and as people wake up to much more efficient motoring, it's not rocket surgery that people will stop buying Holdens.


S

Amazulu

Tellingly, there was another news story yesterday: the car of the year was announced - and it's the VW Golf. Now there's a car that people want to buy - and many are built in a high cost country; Germany

Look at the cars that most Australians are buying - small Japanese and Korean cars, small to large SUVs, dual cab utes.........

I reckon we can build cars here - just build the right cars

Swerv-o

But there needs to be an understanding of the change in dynamics before this can occur. And it looks like the baby will be thrown out with the bath water.


S

GarryP

Actually I'm a bit iffy about this.

Look around the car park of the local shopping mall and yes, there are quite a few small cars. There are however also quite a few medium(ish) sized cars, and far too many utes, suvs, trucks, and what would be known in the is UK as Chelsea Tractors.

So it would be perfectly possible for the holdens and fords to build bigger vehicles, just not the types of big vehicles that people aren't buying. And that decision sits in Detroit. They didn't want Australia building the types of vehicles that people wanted, they wanted Australia churning out the old, big, dumb, car types - till the market was sucked dry and they could close down the lot.

As I say, cash cow.

Vash the Stampede

Life goes on. South Australia survived the Mitsubishi pullout. It'll survive the end of Holden.

There will be a lot of pain, particularly in the Northern suburbs like Elizabeth and Salisbury. But if managed carefully, the transition need not be catastrophic.

Swerv-o

This is exactly what I am saying - there will always be a market for larger vehicles, but they need to be the right larger vehicles - The time of the Commodore and Falcon is at an end, as was the Crown Victoria in the US.

I'll also point out that Australia has just signed a free trade agreement with South Korea. The Koreans also happen to make lots of very affordable, and economic cars. Coincidence that these things are both 'announced' this week?


S

Vash the Stampede

Yes, pure coincidence.

Firstly, Australia has been importing cheap, economic cars from Korea for a long time already. Secondly, Holden has been threatening to leave Australia for at yeast two years. Any decision would have been drawn up well in advance.

paulry

I've always found VW Golf to be over-rated heaps of shite.

GarryP

Oh, and under the careful ministrations of Joyce, Qantas has just been downgraded to junk status, after announcing 1000 redundancies yesterday.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-12-0...unceme/5139902

That's despite having an firm grip on it's domestic market the likes of which BA could only dream of.

Once again, it's bleeding the Australian cash cow to fund ill-advised expansion in Asia - then blaming workers when you finally kill off the Australia bits.

Vash the Stampede

Typical private sector. Incompetent, inefficient, and grossly hypocritical.

Amazulu

Yep. I will be mightily pissed off if the Feds bail them out

Vash the Stampede

I think Abbott will play hardball. Can't see him chucking bad money after good.