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Lord_Farquar Feb 9th 2010 10:39 am

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by slapphead_otool (Post 8327877)
Not that long ago in our evolution great men thought the world was flat. I care little for what great men think, only what they know.... :p


Tony Abbot?

Burbage Feb 9th 2010 10:42 am

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by iolande (Post 8327795)
Funny - I though the King Canute story was that he was proving that even a King couldn't hold back the tide. It was just that the story has been corrupted over the years to be told the way you told it.

Which is the point I was making. King Canute proved to his own idiot subjects that kings were not divine. Does someone have to prove that governments are not divine?

If the sun increases its energy output we get warmer. If the sun decreases its energy output we get cooler. Are you saying that we can guarantee a particular mean climatic temperature? Can Kevin Rudd now control the sun?

slapphead_otool Feb 9th 2010 10:44 am

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by Lord_Farquar (Post 8327916)
Tony Abbot?

Nice reply, and very quick too :D

Burbage Feb 9th 2010 10:44 am

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by iolande (Post 8327816)
In trying to overcome criticism of earlier attempts to gauge the view of earth scientists on global warming and the human impact factor, Doran and Kendall Zimmerman sought the opinion of the most complete list of earth scientists they could find, contacting more than 10,200 experts around the world listed in the 2007 edition of the American Geological Institute's Directory of Geoscience Departments.

The climatologists are most certain that humans play a role in the planet's warming.

Two questions were key: have mean global temperatures risen compared to pre-1800s levels, and has human activity been a significant factor in changing mean global temperatures.

About 90 percent of the scientists agreed with the first question and 82 percent the second.

In analyzing responses by sub-groups, Doran found that climatologists who are active in research showed the strongest consensus on the causes of global warming, with 97 percent agreeing humans play a role. Petroleum geologists and meteorologists were among the biggest doubters, with only 47 and 64 percent respectively believing in human involvement. Doran compared their responses to a recent poll showing only 58 percent of the public thinks human activity contributes to global warming.


http://www.futurepundit.com/archives/005889.html

These are the same people who want to make sure that there is plenty of government funding for their research. In fact that result that those "who were currently in research" had a stronger opinion merely confirms this.

We know what they believe.

What can they prove?

Burbage Feb 9th 2010 10:50 am

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by iolande (Post 8327816)
...climatologists who are active in research showed the strongest consensus on the causes of global warming, with 97 percent agreeing humans play a role.

I agree humans play a role. I think that our CO2 output into the atmosphere has had a very tiny effect on the temperature of our planet. I also suspect that the actual heat we've produced has an effect too.

But it is insignificant in respect of all the other factors involved in our climate.

The world is warming. Naturally. Someday it will start cooling. Naturally. Then it will start warming up again.

slapphead_otool Feb 9th 2010 10:52 am

Re: Global warming
 
I would go so far as to say the GW/AGW is woefully underfunded, given its impacts both to the planet and to our economy.

Research still hasn’t reached the NASA Apollo type inertia.

We haven’t even proved yet that the planet is worming, let alone by how much.

Burbage Feb 9th 2010 10:54 am

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by slapphead_otool (Post 8327966)
I would go so far as to say the GW/AGW is woefully underfunded, given its impacts both to the planet and to our economy.

Research still hasn’t reached the NASA Apollo type inertia.

We haven’t even proved yet that the planet is worming, let alone by how much.

I found a worm yesterday. In my garden. OH MY GOD!!!!

iolande Feb 9th 2010 12:29 pm

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by slapphead_otool (Post 8327877)
To be fair Iolande:

To parphase George Bernard Shaw: 'If you laid all of the worlds scientists end to end they wouldn’t reach a conclusion” :D

There are a lot of good scientists who don’t believe in AGW, and a lot who are unconvinced.

What is absent from this comment is the word “think” – these 90% and 85% THINK global temperatures risen compared to pre-1800s levels, and human activity been a significant factor in changing mean global temperatures respectively.

What they don’t say is “I know”, because as yet no on knows.

Not that long ago in our evolution great men thought the world was flat. I care little for what great men think, only what they know.... :p

I thought any scientist who professed to believe something was being religious and therefore are barred from the debate!

Besides - the flat earth story is apocryphal . . . :rofl:

iolande Feb 9th 2010 12:35 pm

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by Burbage (Post 8327934)
These are the same people who want to make sure that there is plenty of government funding for their research. In fact that result that those "who were currently in research" had a stronger opinion merely confirms this.

We know what they believe.

What can they prove?

Well that sorts that out then.

iolande Feb 9th 2010 12:38 pm

Re: Global warming
 
just because I love putting in statistics to see how others dismiss them . . .

http://www.gallup.com/poll/1615/Environment.aspx

iolande Feb 9th 2010 1:29 pm

Re: Global warming
 
Out of curiosity, can you please the following question (whether you are a believer or non-believer?

What single piece of evidence would it take to change your mind about the theory of anthropogenic global warming?

Burbage Feb 9th 2010 1:39 pm

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by iolande (Post 8328285)
Out of curiosity, can you please the following question (whether you are a believer or non-believer?

What single piece of evidence would it take to change your mind about the theory of anthropogenic global warming?

Any evidence would be a start.

MartinLuther Feb 9th 2010 1:46 pm

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by iolande (Post 8328172)
I thought any scientist who professed to believe something was being religious and therefore are barred from the debate!

Besides - the flat earth story is apocryphal . . . :rofl:

Scientists are allowed to believe it's just that they're supposed to challenge those beliefs.

A bit like Buddhists but without the certainty of truth.

Wol Feb 9th 2010 2:11 pm

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by Burbage (Post 8327934)
These are the same people who want to make sure that there is plenty of government funding for their research. In fact that result that those "who were currently in research" had a stronger opinion merely confirms this.

We know what they believe.

What can they prove?

Funnier and funnier!

All these words get bandied around: "believe", "think", "prove" and so on.

We all know what the posters mean - it's not really useful to split hairs and invoke the dictionary!

The corollary to what you are saying is that the people who have nothing to do with climate research should be taken more seriously that those who do it. That's like saying a hundred surgeons' unanimous diagnosis is more likely to be correct than the milkman's - they have a vested interest in it, he doesn't.

I think everyone knows what a "denier" is in this context - and "believer". No need to bring in religious sideswipes.

iolande Feb 9th 2010 2:16 pm

Re: Global warming
 

Originally Posted by Burbage (Post 8328299)
Any evidence would be a start.

what would you take to be evidence?


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