Election

Old May 5th 2019, 12:38 pm
  #31  
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by GarryP View Post
"Dartboard 2019 - The Smarter Alternative"
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I think many do that anyway
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Old May 6th 2019, 5:43 am
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by Beoz View Post
Well we all know that "well heeled" individuals pay more tax than the rest of us. The top 10% of earners pay 50% of all tax in Australia. That myth doesn't really work any more. It's coming unstuck.

As for companies I see today BS is going to refuse tax deductions for companies who have links to tax havens such as Ireland. Wow. You have an office in Ireland ..... boom .... no tax deductions.

So this means quite simply, Australia just becomes more costly to do business with, and being such a small market, and a costly market (rents, salaries, etc) why bother, just pull out, there goes the jobs, there goes many other tax revenues, there goes the other business and jobs that rely on the trickle down.

This guy is a bloody disaster. Can't wait to see the multinationals flee Australia.

What this disaster of a union puppet doesn't realise is that pushing money through other countries is a global affair, not an Australian one. Australia is a tiny market. There is very little need for multi nationals to be here. Until a global tax stance is in place, some type of global tax treaty, Australia should be doing everything to entice, not sending them away, but that's the type of destroyers the ALP are.
Instead of moaning about Ireland, we should become Ireland. What they did on corporate taxes has smashed their economy into orbit. Their per capita GDP and HDI score have skyrocketed in recent years. Cut taxes and they will come - it's not rocket surgery

It will never happen here though as both sides are punch drunk on taxes, with nobody prepared to make the hard tax reforms needed. We are already, arguably, the richest country in the world but we could be the Liechtenstein of the Southern Hemisphere
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Old May 6th 2019, 6:38 am
  #33  
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by Amazulu View Post
Instead of moaning about Ireland, we should become Ireland. What they did on corporate taxes has smashed their economy into orbit. Their per capita GDP and HDI score have skyrocketed in recent years. Cut taxes and they will come - it's not rocket surgery

It will never happen here though as both sides are punch drunk on taxes, with nobody prepared to make the hard tax reforms needed. We are already, arguably, the richest country in the world but we could be the Liechtenstein of the Southern Hemisphere
Absolutely. Let's be realistic. Its Australia. Not exactly an attraction for business like the US is where you can keep a 35% corporation tax rate.

Until the world decides it will implement a coordinated corporate tax rate, it's all about competition, which is why Singapore, Ireland and the Caymen Islands do what they do.

And to be fair, the current government has already implemented corporate tax avoidance strategies. One where real avoidance is being investigated. If you read to the end of this article it shows the challenges in doing so.

https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-...74?pfmredir=sm

Again BS doesn't really understand the challenges faced in this arena and the side effects of being black and white about the topic. Poor fellow is not very worldly.

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Old May 7th 2019, 1:13 am
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by Amazulu View Post
Instead of moaning about Ireland, we should become Ireland. What they did on corporate taxes has smashed their economy into orbit. Their per capita GDP and HDI score have skyrocketed in recent years. Cut taxes and they will come - it's not rocket surgery

It will never happen here though as both sides are punch drunk on taxes, with nobody prepared to make the hard tax reforms needed. We are already, arguably, the richest country in the world but we could be the Liechtenstein of the Southern Hemisphere
We should 'become Ireland'. A knee jerk ideological reaction, I expect, with little thought into the repercussions of becoming an Ireland, or leprechaun economy as known,as if Australia hasn't already created enough of its own problems without adding more of that country being referred to.
Why does above writer constantly seek corporate welfare and to absolve tax multi billion dollar organisations? Why should foreign companies pay only 0.2% tax in Ireland, yet home based Irish business pays over 12%? Talk about unfair competition. Of course Irish taxpayers can pay far more than that.
So lets get this right. It is okay for foreign business as they employ workers who pay tax on the money earned that a foreign employer is paying them for their labour, while based in Ireland , but quite okay for them to pay next to nothing on profit?
While these companies pat lip service to Irish workers, they actually ship in huge numbers of foreign workers who in the process place extreme pressure on the almost dysfunctional Dublin housing market, putting it out of reach for the average Irish worker.
In the meantime mention the health system in Ireland or to an Irish abroad, and most will tell you of the dreadful and declining state of Irish health. Simply no money in the kitty to pay for it or much else with regards welfare and pensions are a topic of debate.
The last thing Australia wants is to emulate Ireland. I suppose it would reverse population growth though. The fact of the matter is, Australia is a great producer of raw materials and grain and farm produce. There is no need to give it away for little return to Australian economy . On the other hand, Ireland produces quite little. They like Iceland (take a long hard look what happened to Iceland) have little to get by in the world. Cayman Islands? A place where the rich corporates park there money in secrecy. Contrary what is needed is transparency and to force open such places that store ill gotten gains. Money should be circulating not piling up in ever bigger holes out of sight, with massive gains for the few.
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Old May 7th 2019, 1:26 am
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by Beoz View Post
Absolutely. Let's be realistic. Its Australia. Not exactly an attraction for business like the US is where you can keep a 35% corporation tax rate.

Until the world decides it will implement a coordinated corporate tax rate, it's all about competition, which is why Singapore, Ireland and the Caymen Islands do what they do.

And to be fair, the current government has already implemented corporate tax avoidance strategies. One where real avoidance is being investigated. If you read to the end of this article it shows the challenges in doing so.

https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-...74?pfmredir=sm

Again BS doesn't really understand the challenges faced in this arena and the side effects of being black and white about the topic. Poor fellow is not very worldly.
What is needed is a joint will to stop the rot and seek to repair the damage. What BS doesn't understand is the implications of steady as you go and allow the rot to continue. Ireland is paying a high price favouring foreign enterprise paying little while Irish business and tax payers carry the can which is proven to be nowhere near enough to implement essential services. Singapore on the other hand has socialist policies in place to lessen the burden on own citizens.
What's not being very worldly is failing to realise the consequences of giving multi nationals free 'tax rides', while being swayed by failed eighties drip down theories that the benefit will at some point reach all. Which of course is why we are in the mess we are now with large segments of voters searching populist solutions because the system offers them nothing.
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Old May 7th 2019, 10:05 pm
  #36  
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
What is needed is a joint will to stop the rot and seek to repair the damage. What BS doesn't understand is the implications of steady as you go and allow the rot to continue.
I have to agree that the old model of governance and 'steady as she goes' is really past it's sell by date. People should have realised that it's really not working any more, and that it certainly won't work when deep learning automation causes mass unemployability. The problem is, politicians have stopped trying to fix problems, and just try and exploit them. So there is nobody left with the wit and intelligence to actually look at the full complexity of a country in the now resolutely global context, and understand it, let alone fix it.

At least nobody outside china...
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Old May 8th 2019, 4:06 am
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by GarryP View Post
I have to agree that the old model of governance and 'steady as she goes' is really past it's sell by date. People should have realised that it's really not working any more, and that it certainly won't work when deep learning automation causes mass unemployability. The problem is, politicians have stopped trying to fix problems, and just try and exploit them. So there is nobody left with the wit and intelligence to actually look at the full complexity of a country in the now resolutely global context, and understand it, let alone fix it.

At least nobody outside china...
Very true. Likely China will increasingly lead on more fronts. The West and the democratic process appear to be tying itself in knots as voters flee to populist causes. There certainly seems little forward thinking. It's as if it is all too hard with the inclination being made to attempt to manage the situation as well as possible, at any given time and either hope for the best or disregard it as being someone's else's mess to solve further along the road.
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Old May 8th 2019, 5:44 am
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
We should 'become Ireland'. A knee jerk ideological reaction, I expect, with little thought into the repercussions of becoming an Ireland, or leprechaun economy as known,as if Australia hasn't already created enough of its own problems without adding more of that country being referred to.
Why does above writer constantly seek corporate welfare and to absolve tax multi billion dollar organisations? Why should foreign companies pay only 0.2% tax in Ireland, yet home based Irish business pays over 12%? Talk about unfair competition. Of course Irish taxpayers can pay far more than that.
So lets get this right. It is okay for foreign business as they employ workers who pay tax on the money earned that a foreign employer is paying them for their labour, while based in Ireland , but quite okay for them to pay next to nothing on profit?
While these companies pat lip service to Irish workers, they actually ship in huge numbers of foreign workers who in the process place extreme pressure on the almost dysfunctional Dublin housing market, putting it out of reach for the average Irish worker.
In the meantime mention the health system in Ireland or to an Irish abroad, and most will tell you of the dreadful and declining state of Irish health. Simply no money in the kitty to pay for it or much else with regards welfare and pensions are a topic of debate.
The last thing Australia wants is to emulate Ireland. I suppose it would reverse population growth though. The fact of the matter is, Australia is a great producer of raw materials and grain and farm produce. There is no need to give it away for little return to Australian economy . On the other hand, Ireland produces quite little. They like Iceland (take a long hard look what happened to Iceland) have little to get by in the world. Cayman Islands? A place where the rich corporates park there money in secrecy. Contrary what is needed is transparency and to force open such places that store ill gotten gains. Money should be circulating not piling up in ever bigger holes out of sight, with massive gains for the few.
Last time I looked, Ireland is an advanced Western liberal democracy. If the Irish people are unhappy with what's happening in their country - with any aspect - they have it within their means, at election time to vote and take their country in a different direction. Therefore, it looks to me like the majority of Irish people are happy with the way their country is going. Turns out, surprise surprise, that a lot of people prefer having decent paying jobs and economic wealth to the opposite.

But then, the left and democracy - real democracy - are rarely on the same page! The left can only really prosper when there are a lot of poor people - and being kept poor

Last edited by Amazulu; May 8th 2019 at 5:46 am.
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Old May 8th 2019, 10:58 am
  #39  
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Default Re: Election

If I hear some idiot on an idiotic tv ad say 'a fair go' one more time I may lose my mind. What little of it I have left anyway.
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Old May 8th 2019, 11:01 am
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by Amazulu View Post
Last time I looked, Ireland is an advanced Western liberal democracy. If the Irish people are unhappy with what's happening in their country - with any aspect - they have it within their means, at election time to vote and take their country in a different direction. Therefore, it looks to me like the majority of Irish people are happy with the way their country is going. Turns out, surprise surprise, that a lot of people prefer having decent paying jobs and economic wealth to the opposite.

But then, the left and democracy - real democracy - are rarely on the same page! The left can only really prosper when there are a lot of poor people - and being kept poor
Every likelihood the Irish people will vote change, providing of course there is a party offering change to vote for. That is far from certain which results in ever more turning off politics as being of any use in their lives.
Most Irish people will tell you if you ask and they are indeed informed, that it has long passed left/right politics. The choice is far from clear. The right leaning governments have set the course going back years , What most people want is job security, a stable economy, a break in austerity and a return to decency. A world without concern about the standard of care if ill, would be a start. But as I wrote Australia has experienced enough living declines of its own, without using Ireland as a poor example.
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Old May 8th 2019, 11:04 am
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by moneypenny20 View Post
If I hear some idiot on an idiotic tv ad say 'a fair go' one more time I may lose my mind. What little of it I have left anyway.
Fair dinkum, they'd have to mention battlers doing it tough as well ..... strewth.
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Old May 8th 2019, 1:35 pm
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Every likelihood the Irish people will vote change, providing of course there is a party offering change to vote for. That is far from certain which results in ever more turning off politics as being of any use in their lives.
Most Irish people will tell you if you ask and they are indeed informed, that it has long passed left/right politics. The choice is far from clear. The right leaning governments have set the course going back years , What most people want is job security, a stable economy, a break in austerity and a return to decency. A world without concern about the standard of care if ill, would be a start. But as I wrote Australia has experienced enough living declines of its own, without using Ireland as a poor example.
The people will decide

That's how it works

Australia and Ireland continue to experience increasing per capita GDP, HDI, disposable and discretionary incomes etc. The figures tell the story. Yes, both countries are expensive places to live but that is a product of a wealthy, successful economy, with relatively high incomes. It is what it is

Last edited by Amazulu; May 8th 2019 at 3:15 pm.
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Old May 8th 2019, 11:14 pm
  #43  
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by moneypenny20 View Post
If I hear some idiot on an idiotic tv ad say 'a fair go' one more time I may lose my mind. What little of it I have left anyway.
I heard it several times in last nights debate.

It actually means taking more from the wealthy to give to the poor, even though the wealthy already greatly subside the poor.

Sadly giving the poor more doesn't equal a fair go. BS really needs to look into what that is and what it means. In this country, the poor are very much given a fair go in respect to services. Could there be more done when it comes to non tangible fair go's .... sure .... but that certainly doesn't mean raiding the piggy bank.
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Old May 8th 2019, 11:20 pm
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
What is needed is a joint will to stop the rot and seek to repair the damage. What BS doesn't understand is the implications of steady as you go and allow the rot to continue. Ireland is paying a high price favouring foreign enterprise paying little while Irish business and tax payers carry the can which is proven to be nowhere near enough to implement essential services. Singapore on the other hand has socialist policies in place to lessen the burden on own citizens.
What's not being very worldly is failing to realise the consequences of giving multi nationals free 'tax rides', while being swayed by failed eighties drip down theories that the benefit will at some point reach all. Which of course is why we are in the mess we are now with large segments of voters searching populist solutions because the system offers them nothing.
But that's the point, drip feeding is reaching the people, especially those who need it most.

As much as you want to make up this rubbish that Australia is in some type of bad situation you fail every time to come up with clear evidence of that. Just because you cannot get on the property ladder in the best suburbs of Perth is just resentment ..... nothing more.

Sorry for the late reply BTW. Too busy making hay while the sunshines. If Labor gets in I know that earning a crust won't be so easy, and the tax dollars of the many people I manage is in jeopardy. So is the tax dollars we all contribute in more ways than one.

Get ready for the loss of foreign investment and choking red tape.

Last edited by Beoz; May 8th 2019 at 11:22 pm.
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Old May 9th 2019, 1:06 am
  #45  
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Default Re: Election

Originally Posted by GarryP View Post
I have to agree that the old model of governance and 'steady as she goes' is really past it's sell by date. People should have realised that it's really not working any more, and that it certainly won't work when deep learning automation causes mass unemployability. The problem is, politicians have stopped trying to fix problems, and just try and exploit them. So there is nobody left with the wit and intelligence to actually look at the full complexity of a country in the now resolutely global context, and understand it, let alone fix it.

At least nobody outside china...
How's that nuclear agenda looking. Still being choked by Labor and the Greens?
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