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Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

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Old Feb 20th 2018, 8:26 am
  #61  
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Denmark is constantly voted the happiest country
With very high consumption taxes too

Those happy Danes are on to something Herman

Last edited by Amazulu; Feb 20th 2018 at 8:31 am.
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Old Feb 20th 2018, 8:31 am
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by GarryP View Post
Yeah, that's why I added in the "we'll each pay $5" part of my scenario correction. The rich love the idea of 'consumption' taxes because it means that they don't have to bear their share. GST is effectively levied on the majority of goods, meaning the rich get an effective 'free pass'.
Err, buying a $1m boat would attract GST of 100k

Buying a $5 bottle of wine would attract GST of 50c

The vast majority of Australians earning $50k effectively pay no income tax (in fact they get more back). That looks awfully like a 'free pass to me'!
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Old Feb 20th 2018, 8:49 am
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Don't wriggle out of debate as is your inclination. You were referring not just to tax on cig's and Foxtel, but an overall consumption tax on everything.


Besides having to put up with some of the rot going around, you can hardly blame someone reaching for a fag (now most expensive in world, I believe, in Nanny State Australia, leading in itself to affordability issues for those whom smoke,) Foxtel? So what? Keeping people entertained can perhaps alleviate other issues of a far more anti social direction or desperation and impact on health services.
More than happy to for the poor and rich to equally share a tax free existence on the essentials.

After all I am all about fairness and will defend your bigoted attacks on the wealthy all day long.
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Old Feb 20th 2018, 10:40 pm
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by Amazulu View Post
With very high consumption taxes too

Those happy Danes are on to something Herman

They certainly do well, their pension scheme saves concern with the age issues and well cared for if lose job in initial stages at least. Oh and child care one of the best in the world...
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Old Feb 20th 2018, 10:46 pm
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by Beoz View Post
More than happy to for the poor and rich to equally share a tax free existence on the essentials.

After all I am all about fairness and will defend your bigoted attacks on the wealthy all day long.


Besides being unable to defend the indefensible of course. Fairness in your book in corporate tax avoidance regardless of societal impact.
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Old Feb 20th 2018, 11:00 pm
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Besides being unable to defend the indefensible of course. Fairness in your book in corporate tax avoidance regardless of societal impact.
Avoidance or evasion? Avoidance is something we all do in accordance with tax laws. You would be completely stupid and most likely a liar if you didn't.
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Old Feb 21st 2018, 2:44 am
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by Beoz View Post
Avoidance or evasion? Avoidance is something we all do in accordance with tax laws. You would be completely stupid and most likely a liar if you didn't.
Evasion. When even The Don speaks out against your apparent examples of prudence within the dodgy corporate sector, I'm referring to Amazon of course and their malarkey in creative tax avoidance. Not just in America of course, but EU trickery as well.
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Old Feb 21st 2018, 2:59 am
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Evasion. When even The Don speaks out against your apparent examples of prudence within the dodgy corporate sector, I'm referring to Amazon of course and their malarkey in creative tax avoidance. Not just in America of course, but EU trickery as well.
Which is why you should attack the governments, not the company. If Luxembourg create the rules, and other countries have no laws or sanction powers to combat it, retrospective tax grabs is unacceptable for all.
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Old Feb 21st 2018, 9:13 am
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by Beoz View Post
Which is why you should attack the governments, not the company. If Luxembourg create the rules, and other countries have no laws or sanction powers to combat it, retrospective tax grabs is unacceptable for all.
Time to end the rotten culture that over compensates rogues. The power of corporations these days influences by various means, for example lobbyists to ex politicians sitting on boards to out right corruption and everything thinkable in between. Government needs to dissociate itself from business returning more to an umpire role. Luxemburg is a pretty darn good example.
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Old Feb 21st 2018, 9:23 am
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by Amazulu View Post
Err, buying a $1m boat would attract GST of 100k

Buying a $5 bottle of wine would attract GST of 50c

The vast majority of Australians earning $50k effectively pay no income tax (in fact they get more back). That looks awfully like a 'free pass to me'!
Really? Try living on just over $41,000 a year then. Chances are an earner on such a wage would be paying rent, the subsidy would be probably lucky to cover a quarter of the cost. Probably right though, A $5 dollar bottle of gut rot on pay day, as earnings wouldn't stretch to much more. Every chance they may smoke as well. Slugged for tax like nothing else. So what if a luxury such as a $1 million dollar boat is taxed at such a rate. The fag tax would work out higher all things equal.
Free pass indeed.
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Old Feb 21st 2018, 9:53 am
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Really? Try living on just over $41,000 a year then. Chances are an earner on such a wage would be paying rent, the subsidy would be probably lucky to cover a quarter of the cost. Probably right though, A $5 dollar bottle of gut rot on pay day, as earnings wouldn't stretch to much more. Every chance they may smoke as well. Slugged for tax like nothing else. So what if a luxury such as a $1 million dollar boat is taxed at such a rate. The fag tax would work out higher all things equal.
Free pass indeed.
There are three little games being played here:

The first is to talk about GST and then at the end switch to income tax to say they are getting a 'free pass'. Of course the reality is they are paying significant amounts of tax because ...

... part two, the proportion of their income paid in GST is much greater for the person on $50k than the person on $1m. Their effective GST tax rate is much higher, and ....

... if you are looking to buy a boat there are many more ways of avoiding paying tax, even GST. For instance, buy it via an offshore company you own in a zero tax location, and rent it out to yourself so you can claim back the costs as a business expense, and keep it in Australian waters for less than a year, etc. etc.

Kind of difficult to do that for the GST on your electricity bill for Mr 50k.
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Old Feb 21st 2018, 10:10 am
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Time to end the rotten culture that over compensates rogues. The power of corporations these days influences by various means, for example lobbyists to ex politicians sitting on boards to out right corruption and everything thinkable in between. Government needs to dissociate itself from business returning more to an umpire role. Luxemburg is a pretty darn good example.
So in reality its not about tax at all. Its all about nailing private companies to the wall because you got turfed by one once. Just reading between the lines because you are so so far away from the target.
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Old Feb 21st 2018, 10:15 am
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by the troubadour View Post
Really? Try living on just over $41,000 a year then. Chances are an earner on such a wage would be paying rent, the subsidy would be probably lucky to cover a quarter of the cost. Probably right though, A $5 dollar bottle of gut rot on pay day, as earnings wouldn't stretch to much more. Every chance they may smoke as well. Slugged for tax like nothing else. So what if a luxury such as a $1 million dollar boat is taxed at such a rate. The fag tax would work out higher all things equal.
Free pass indeed.
Someone on $41,000 takes home $35,693.00 after tax and super of which most of the deduction is "their own" super.

What a contribution to society this person is making. I guess they are when you throw in the fags and the gut rot tax.

Nah maybe not when our medicare levy is sorting out their health.

Are you starting to see where fair play comes into society?
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Old Feb 21st 2018, 10:26 am
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by GarryP View Post
... if you are looking to buy a boat there are many more ways of avoiding paying tax, even GST. For instance, buy it via an offshore company you own in a zero tax location, and rent it out to yourself so you can claim back the costs as a business expense, and keep it in Australian waters for less than a year, etc. etc.
Yep but sadly its not that easy to do. I've tried it.

The bitch is having to fly to Monaco once a year to use it.

That said you can rent it out, then it becomes a legitimate business earner, but in the case of a boat, most likely losing money.

Sounds good on paper but the harsh reality is you are better off renting.

Last edited by Beoz; Feb 21st 2018 at 10:30 am.
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Old Feb 21st 2018, 10:40 pm
  #75  
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Default Re: Corporate Tax Cuts? Better Personal Cuts

Originally Posted by Amazulu View Post
I've said it before and I'll say I again - Australia does not have a revenue problem, it has a spending problem
Well, with more revenue you can spend more. What Australia has is a "daylight robbery of the nation" problem with how its natural resources are being ransacked instead of serving the Australian people.

What the country needs is to take back control and have a government like Norway, whose sovereign wealth fund is now worth in excess of 1,000 Billion $ and is greater than that of Saudi Arabia.
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