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Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Old Apr 13th 2020, 1:28 am
  #451  
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by stevenglish1
If the economy is ticking over nicely, then limp along for a while and don't jump the gun.
But the economy is not ticking over nicely. Mining and a few other areas are doing well but most of the economy is suffering. Business, wealth, aspiration is being torched before our very eyes - and our children are going to be paying this climbing debt off. Trump was right when he said (but because he said it, was shouted down by the MSM) that the cure cannot be worse than the disease. We're okay now but if we're still locked down like this by June, we're going to be in a world of hurt with no sector of the economy immune. Somewhere along the line, risk is going to be have to be managed
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 1:49 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by Beoz
You might buy her continual publicity stunts, but when it knocks 20% off the salary of Australians and the tax we all benefit from in trying times, the laugh is over.
Publicity stunt saving lives? Some things transcend money. Great time to readjust world economies breaking free of the shackles economic neoliberalism, and returning to what really matters.
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 2:11 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by the troubadour
Publicity stunt saving lives? Some things transcend money. Great time to readjust world economies breaking free of the shackles economic neoliberalism, and returning to what really matters.
Unfortunately I don't see much chance to break away from the far right and back towards the centre. The issue is all this money being dished out is going to need to be paid for, the debt is going to have to be paid down.

Now, the way it should fall is that those that benefited are the ones to pay, but I'm betting the Labor approach will be a tax targeted on those that didn't get made redundant, that still have the well paid jobs. All the far right have to do is be slightly more targeted than this and they will get in.

My guess is they will attempt to push up GST.
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 2:49 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by GarryP
Unfortunately I don't see much chance to break away from the far right and back towards the centre. The issue is all this money being dished out is going to need to be paid for, the debt is going to have to be paid down.

Now, the way it should fall is that those that benefited are the ones to pay, but I'm betting the Labor approach will be a tax targeted on those that didn't get made redundant, that still have the well paid jobs. All the far right have to do is be slightly more targeted than this and they will get in.

My guess is they will attempt to push up GST.
I fear you are correct. While it could have been a time to reboot, a return to same flawed policy, is more likely. The forces controlling the status quo are indeed formable. One thing for sure. The pain will not be, as usual shared equitably. Will fools like Trump and Bolsonaro (Brazil) come out all the worse for their ridiculous stance on the virus?
GST in the case of Australia, is something the Right have favoured increasing for a long time. Regressive taxation being their obvious platform.

Thank goodness for Arden and Merkel. Women leaders have certainly shown their worth in this crises. Add Taiwan and Norway to the list as well.
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 2:56 am
  #455  
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by Amazulu
And while the MSM and social media fawns over Ardern, what ScoMo is doing hardly gets a mention. We all know the reason but there it is

Bullshit I know but ho hum
Did you see McGowan's press conference yesterday? I caught the tail end - the questions from the reporters were moronic and revolting. One asked him why he didn't want community transmission of the virus, since a "little bit" of community transmission was "good" and would encourage herd immunity (I actually wondered if the reporter asking, understood what community transmission is . . . or herd immunity). Another wanted to argue with him that AFL players should qualify as "essential workers." Then they were mostly trying to bait him and get that "gotcha" moment, and I just thought to myself, here is a perfect example of why trust in 21st century journalism is so low and how the profession has lost its way.

Wrong place, wrong time, wrong content for an adversarial-style press conference, and the purpose of press conferences like these, is to get information from the authorities - not for journalists to try to debate the politicians or shout their opinions at them.
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 4:22 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by Amazulu
And while the MSM and social media fawns over Ardern, what ScoMo is doing hardly gets a mention. We all know the reason but there it is

Bullshit I know but ho hum
Prof of Micro Biology has picked her apart today too.
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 4:39 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by carcajou
Did you see McGowan's press conference yesterday? I caught the tail end - the questions from the reporters were moronic and revolting. One asked him why he didn't want community transmission of the virus, since a "little bit" of community transmission was "good" and would encourage herd immunity (I actually wondered if the reporter asking, understood what community transmission is . . . or herd immunity). Another wanted to argue with him that AFL players should qualify as "essential workers." Then they were mostly trying to bait him and get that "gotcha" moment, and I just thought to myself, here is a perfect example of why trust in 21st century journalism is so low and how the profession has lost its way.

Wrong place, wrong time, wrong content for an adversarial-style press conference, and the purpose of press conferences like these, is to get information from the authorities - not for journalists to try to debate the politicians or shout their opinions at them.
I didn't see it but can believe what you're saying - I'm really trying to avoid most media coverage if I can. Most journalists are talking heads who are just looking for a soundbite or for a politician to say something stupid or controversial. I'm really not interested. ScoMo and McGowan is doing a good job. End of
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 4:43 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by Beoz
Prof of Micro Biology has picked her apart today too.
https://mobile.twitter.com/Collignon...64061697261568
Since Christchurch, the MSM can't get enough of Ardern - with the US MSM being the most sycophantic

The NZ government is torching their economy - but this will suit her as it will mean major state intervention to sort it out - something that fits in with her (and other leaders like her) real agenda
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 4:45 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by GarryP
My guess is they will attempt to push up GST.
That would be the best option. Economics 101 shows us that consumption taxes are one of the best, most efficient taxes. Everyone would get to pay it - with the wealthier in effect paying more as they consume more

Winner, winner chicken dinner
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 5:02 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

I was speaking to a scientist I know when all of this started happening. His take on things is that we need to stay at the level we are now for the next six months. Slow the spread enough that we don't run out of beds in ICU's and protect the vulnerable that are currently in total lockdown. If we slow the spread down too much, we'll be locked down for 18 months as the spread will be slower.
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 5:19 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by Amazulu
Since Christchurch, the MSM can't get enough of Ardern - with the US MSM being the most sycophantic

The NZ government is torching their economy - but this will suit her as it will mean major state intervention to sort it out - something that fits in with her (and other leaders like her) real agenda
Yep the NZ economy was already a basket case before COVID. I can't help thinking full lockdown, no economy was her way of never having to get NZ out of the mess. I guess when your economy is that far gone there's no point trying at all.
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 5:21 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by Kim67
I was speaking to a scientist I know when all of this started happening. His take on things is that we need to stay at the level we are now for the next six months. Slow the spread enough that we don't run out of beds in ICU's and protect the vulnerable that are currently in total lockdown. If we slow the spread down too much, we'll be locked down for 18 months as the spread will be slower.
When it started to happen, flatten the curve was the plan. Things have changed. The curve got flatten and we are now on the cusp of eradication. Should Australia behave itself and eradicate it, we can avoid a second wave due to closed borders. This is something Singapore, Hong Kong and China failed to do in time and now they have the second wave.

Flatten the curve will have to be the plan for the US and Europe as their borders are too porous.

Last edited by Beoz; Apr 13th 2020 at 5:26 am.
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 5:29 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by GarryP
Unfortunately I don't see much chance to break away from the far right and back towards the centre. The issue is all this money being dished out is going to need to be paid for, the debt is going to have to be paid down.

Now, the way it should fall is that those that benefited are the ones to pay, but I'm betting the Labor approach will be a tax targeted on those that didn't get made redundant, that still have the well paid jobs. All the far right have to do is be slightly more targeted than this and they will get in.

My guess is they will attempt to push up GST.
That Labor approach you mention is currently how we work. We look after those who don't have jobs paid for by those who do.
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 5:50 am
  #464  
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by Beoz
When it started to happen, flatten the curve was the plan. Things have changed. The curve got flatten and we are now on the cusp of eradication. Should Australia behave itself and eradicate it, we can avoid a second wave due to closed borders. This is something Singapore, Hong Kong and China failed to do in time and now they have the second wave.

Flatten the curve will have to be the plan for the US and Europe as their borders are too porous.
"When all of this started to happen" before Phase 1 commenced, when Australia was closing just international borders. I was asking him about locking down and that was his take on it. Keep schools open for essential workers children, allow people to grocery shop etc with social distancing - has to happen for six months. Close everything completely, has to happen for 18 months. It won't be a six week fix like people think if we completely lockdown.
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Old Apr 13th 2020, 5:56 am
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Default Re: Coronavirus - how's everyone doing?

Originally Posted by Kim67
Close everything completely, has to happen for 18 months. It won't be a six week fix like people think if we completely lockdown.
Then we'll have no economy. Jobkeeper and Jobseeker cannot be afforded for that length of time - forget recession make that major depression - with all the associated rioting and social breakdown

Choices are going to be have to be made. None of this is easy
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