Sydney reccie (long post)
Oct 19th 2007, 6:56 am
#1
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Sydney reccie (long post)
First of all it is probably best to say that we are not on the tightest budget (but that does not mean we have money to burn). Nevertheless I thought our trip may have some notes of interest for those looking to move.
We planned a trip to Oz a few months ago, before we had decided to move here, but as we subsequently were offered the opportunity to relocate we decided to keep the trip but to have a combined holiday and reccie. We will move at the end of December and the purpose of this trip was to look at areas where we like to live and (if possible) find schools for the children. In total we were in Oz for just two weeks with 10 days in Sydney and the remainder a short trip to see some friends in Melbourne.
I am relocating on a 457 visa and my company kindly agreed to pay for business class for our trip. I felt a bit cheeky so I booked the cheapest routing possible (which was about half the price of a normal business class fare). The return routing was straightforward but on the way there we had to change planes twice which I thought might be a risk from a baggage point of view (more of that in a second). We had flown economy to Oz in 2004 and all I can say is that the experience is not great; business class may not be “worth” the money but I personally think it makes for a fantastic experience and if you are only going to make the trip once why not make the experience special and splash out? We flew out with BA and back with Qantas. In my view BA is better but it’s a close run thing.
Anyway, sure enough only two of four bags arrived in Sydney. My advice to you would be to ensure that each family member has some clothes in each bag! Second advice: stay calm! Its not the ground staff fault and shouting at them will be counterproductive. Be polite but be firm. We asked for cash to tide us over until the errant bags arrived (which they did within 24 hours) and were give $200. Which was nice.
We decided not to hire a car for the whole trip as we anticipated being tourists for a while. Traveling as we were as a family of four it generally does not make sense to use public transport so we took a taxi. The fare to the city worked out less than the equivalent cost of four train or bus tickets.
In Sydney we stayed in the Meriton World Tower which is the heart of the Sydney CBD and a five minute stroll from Darling Harbour. The Meriton has two great advantages over a traditional hotel. Firstly, it is an apartment hotel so for the equivalent cost of a (4 or 5 star) hotel room which got a two bed apartment with a separate lounge and kitchen. We actually used the kitchen quite a lot (especially for breakfast). Secondly (and more importantly) all the hotel rooms are on high floors (ours was on the top – 77th – floor) which means spectacular views of the city. I would advise that you don’t lose your swipe card security pass (as I did) as the cost is $100. I was able to book the room through my company which meant an overnight rate of $225. The only downside is that because the Meriton is not a hotel, there is no restaurant but there are adequate restaurants and supermarkets in the immediate vicinity.
Another reason for not hiring a car for the whole stay is that most hotels (including the Meriton) will charge you an overnight fee which is quite steep (in the case of the Meriton $35) but that is cheaper than the public car parks.
We hired a car on three separate occasions (using Avis each time). The rental office was right around the corner from the hotel although somewhat bizarrely it was cheaper to book online than to book in the office! Cars can booked right up until midnight before the day you need them (and possibly later but we did not try that).
On day 1 in Sydney we bought a Sat Nav system for getting around and to be honest it was the best decision we could have made. We bought a Tom Tom system for $499 and it was so easy to use just plug in straight from the box and away you go. It may seem extravagant but we figure we will need one when we move here and in addition we were able to claim the tax back on leaving the country. Here’s another tip: You can claim back tax on items costing over $300 but the claim is per item. Myers (and I am sure other stores) will consolidate your purchases onto one invoice (even if they are over a couple of days) but you will need to show the items when you go to claim the tax back (in the departure lounge) and of course you will need to declare the items and pay the tax in your home country (yeah right!).
As regards the rest of the trip well all I can say it was pretty plain sailing, mainly for two reasons:
1. We had researched to death on the internet before we arrived so already had a rough view about where we wanted to live.
2. I had the opportunity to meet with my forthcoming new colleagues who were very helpful (especially in confirming the answers to point 1!
3. We had researched schools and made some appointments about those which we saw as options.
We had chosen the northern suburbs as our favored area to live mainly because of its proximity to everything (nice beaches, good schools, reasonable commute) and we spent most of our time touring around a relatively narrow area between about 10 and 20 km north of the Sydney CBD. I would say that you shouldn’t listen to too much about the traffic around Sydney or the quality of the driving. My experience was that it is heavy at peak periods but bearable and certainly no worse than any other large city. In fact because everyone sticks pretty religiously to the speed limits the traffic actually flows quite well however I will be getting an automatic (for the first time in my life).
We have managed to secure places for our children at the (fee paying) schools that were on our list. Not all of the fee paying schools are selective although it seems that most are streamed and will want the children to sit an exam on entry in order to stream them. Some of the schools have regular organized tours and others will make an exception and accommodate you. Make sure when you are contacting the schools that you ask whether they will have a place for your child. One of the schools we visited was happy to give us a tour but then told us during the tour that securing a place was difficult. A fairly key piece of information they omitted to tell us!
We looked at around 25 houses. There seems to be a relatively tight rental market and therefore we will most likely buy. In the areas we were looking at (Pymble, Lindfeld, St Ives) for us it was not worth looking at properties under $1 million as generally they were needing some work (I am not a handyman!) but there is certainly a lot of variety in the range from $1 - $1.5 million (we are aiming at four beds and probably also a pool). A couple of the properties that we viewed reduced in price while we were there and my feeling from talking to agents is that the market is a little soft and therefore worth putting in an offer.
After speaking with my (Australian) bank, we have (probably rather foolishly) made offers on two houses and I will let you know how that goes.
Opening the bank account (with Westpac) was very straightforward and we now have internet banking access which will enable us to transfer funds prior to arrival (including into an interest bearing deposit account).
One other thing worth mentioning was that whilst we were there we had our medicals (for the 457 visa) undertaken which should save us quite a bit of time in the overall application process.
We had a look at some cars while we were there (including going to the Sydney motor show) and two things are very clear:
• Second hand cars are not good value for money: and
• European (German) cars are very expensive relative to Europe with the exception of VW’s (probably because they are mostly manufactured in South Africa).
Remember if you are buying new then the price quoted on web sites is not the price you will pay as it excludes stamp duty and dealer delivery etc. for cars less than $100,000 that adds about 10% to the purchase price. The stamp duty is much higher over $100,000 but I didn’t really work out why or by how much (seems to be approximately double).
We also took our time to do the tourist thing and did some typical Sydney things:
• Went to Taronga Zoo
• Took a tour bus up to Bondi
• Went on a jet boat on the harbour
• Took the car south to see some whales
• Took a drive to look at the Northern beaches.
I don’t think I have covered everything but ask any questions.
We planned a trip to Oz a few months ago, before we had decided to move here, but as we subsequently were offered the opportunity to relocate we decided to keep the trip but to have a combined holiday and reccie. We will move at the end of December and the purpose of this trip was to look at areas where we like to live and (if possible) find schools for the children. In total we were in Oz for just two weeks with 10 days in Sydney and the remainder a short trip to see some friends in Melbourne.
I am relocating on a 457 visa and my company kindly agreed to pay for business class for our trip. I felt a bit cheeky so I booked the cheapest routing possible (which was about half the price of a normal business class fare). The return routing was straightforward but on the way there we had to change planes twice which I thought might be a risk from a baggage point of view (more of that in a second). We had flown economy to Oz in 2004 and all I can say is that the experience is not great; business class may not be “worth” the money but I personally think it makes for a fantastic experience and if you are only going to make the trip once why not make the experience special and splash out? We flew out with BA and back with Qantas. In my view BA is better but it’s a close run thing.
Anyway, sure enough only two of four bags arrived in Sydney. My advice to you would be to ensure that each family member has some clothes in each bag! Second advice: stay calm! Its not the ground staff fault and shouting at them will be counterproductive. Be polite but be firm. We asked for cash to tide us over until the errant bags arrived (which they did within 24 hours) and were give $200. Which was nice.
We decided not to hire a car for the whole trip as we anticipated being tourists for a while. Traveling as we were as a family of four it generally does not make sense to use public transport so we took a taxi. The fare to the city worked out less than the equivalent cost of four train or bus tickets.
In Sydney we stayed in the Meriton World Tower which is the heart of the Sydney CBD and a five minute stroll from Darling Harbour. The Meriton has two great advantages over a traditional hotel. Firstly, it is an apartment hotel so for the equivalent cost of a (4 or 5 star) hotel room which got a two bed apartment with a separate lounge and kitchen. We actually used the kitchen quite a lot (especially for breakfast). Secondly (and more importantly) all the hotel rooms are on high floors (ours was on the top – 77th – floor) which means spectacular views of the city. I would advise that you don’t lose your swipe card security pass (as I did) as the cost is $100. I was able to book the room through my company which meant an overnight rate of $225. The only downside is that because the Meriton is not a hotel, there is no restaurant but there are adequate restaurants and supermarkets in the immediate vicinity.
Another reason for not hiring a car for the whole stay is that most hotels (including the Meriton) will charge you an overnight fee which is quite steep (in the case of the Meriton $35) but that is cheaper than the public car parks.
We hired a car on three separate occasions (using Avis each time). The rental office was right around the corner from the hotel although somewhat bizarrely it was cheaper to book online than to book in the office! Cars can booked right up until midnight before the day you need them (and possibly later but we did not try that).
On day 1 in Sydney we bought a Sat Nav system for getting around and to be honest it was the best decision we could have made. We bought a Tom Tom system for $499 and it was so easy to use just plug in straight from the box and away you go. It may seem extravagant but we figure we will need one when we move here and in addition we were able to claim the tax back on leaving the country. Here’s another tip: You can claim back tax on items costing over $300 but the claim is per item. Myers (and I am sure other stores) will consolidate your purchases onto one invoice (even if they are over a couple of days) but you will need to show the items when you go to claim the tax back (in the departure lounge) and of course you will need to declare the items and pay the tax in your home country (yeah right!).
As regards the rest of the trip well all I can say it was pretty plain sailing, mainly for two reasons:
1. We had researched to death on the internet before we arrived so already had a rough view about where we wanted to live.
2. I had the opportunity to meet with my forthcoming new colleagues who were very helpful (especially in confirming the answers to point 1!
3. We had researched schools and made some appointments about those which we saw as options.
We had chosen the northern suburbs as our favored area to live mainly because of its proximity to everything (nice beaches, good schools, reasonable commute) and we spent most of our time touring around a relatively narrow area between about 10 and 20 km north of the Sydney CBD. I would say that you shouldn’t listen to too much about the traffic around Sydney or the quality of the driving. My experience was that it is heavy at peak periods but bearable and certainly no worse than any other large city. In fact because everyone sticks pretty religiously to the speed limits the traffic actually flows quite well however I will be getting an automatic (for the first time in my life).
We have managed to secure places for our children at the (fee paying) schools that were on our list. Not all of the fee paying schools are selective although it seems that most are streamed and will want the children to sit an exam on entry in order to stream them. Some of the schools have regular organized tours and others will make an exception and accommodate you. Make sure when you are contacting the schools that you ask whether they will have a place for your child. One of the schools we visited was happy to give us a tour but then told us during the tour that securing a place was difficult. A fairly key piece of information they omitted to tell us!
We looked at around 25 houses. There seems to be a relatively tight rental market and therefore we will most likely buy. In the areas we were looking at (Pymble, Lindfeld, St Ives) for us it was not worth looking at properties under $1 million as generally they were needing some work (I am not a handyman!) but there is certainly a lot of variety in the range from $1 - $1.5 million (we are aiming at four beds and probably also a pool). A couple of the properties that we viewed reduced in price while we were there and my feeling from talking to agents is that the market is a little soft and therefore worth putting in an offer.
After speaking with my (Australian) bank, we have (probably rather foolishly) made offers on two houses and I will let you know how that goes.
Opening the bank account (with Westpac) was very straightforward and we now have internet banking access which will enable us to transfer funds prior to arrival (including into an interest bearing deposit account).
One other thing worth mentioning was that whilst we were there we had our medicals (for the 457 visa) undertaken which should save us quite a bit of time in the overall application process.
We had a look at some cars while we were there (including going to the Sydney motor show) and two things are very clear:
• Second hand cars are not good value for money: and
• European (German) cars are very expensive relative to Europe with the exception of VW’s (probably because they are mostly manufactured in South Africa).
Remember if you are buying new then the price quoted on web sites is not the price you will pay as it excludes stamp duty and dealer delivery etc. for cars less than $100,000 that adds about 10% to the purchase price. The stamp duty is much higher over $100,000 but I didn’t really work out why or by how much (seems to be approximately double).
We also took our time to do the tourist thing and did some typical Sydney things:
• Went to Taronga Zoo
• Took a tour bus up to Bondi
• Went on a jet boat on the harbour
• Took the car south to see some whales
• Took a drive to look at the Northern beaches.
I don’t think I have covered everything but ask any questions.
Oct 19th 2007, 7:38 am
#2
Forum Regular
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 51
Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
Hi Martin
Excellent post.
I am about ot head to Sydney at the end of next week and am researching the areas you mentioned. How would yu rte thefor small children? Commute to CBD?
Also, did you look at other areas such as Pennant Hills or Turramurra?
Thanks again foir a great post. Tom
Excellent post.
I am about ot head to Sydney at the end of next week and am researching the areas you mentioned. How would yu rte thefor small children? Commute to CBD?
Also, did you look at other areas such as Pennant Hills or Turramurra?
Thanks again foir a great post. Tom
Oct 19th 2007, 10:24 am
#3
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Joined: Feb 2007
Location: Waterford, Qld
Posts: 1,920
Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
Yeah, good post.... Sydney is great eh!
Did you not go to the mountains? Beautiful up there!
Did you not go to the mountains? Beautiful up there!
Oct 19th 2007, 11:04 am
#4
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Joined: Oct 2006
Location: Newcastle , NSW
Posts: 6,756
Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
Hi Martin,
You said you spent a couple of days in Melbourne.
Did you like it there?
You said you spent a couple of days in Melbourne.
Did you like it there?
Oct 19th 2007, 1:37 pm
#5
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Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
Hi Martin
Excellent post.
I am about ot head to Sydney at the end of next week and am researching the areas you mentioned. How would yu rte thefor small children? Commute to CBD?
Also, did you look at other areas such as Pennant Hills or Turramurra?
Thanks again foir a great post. Tom
Excellent post.
I am about ot head to Sydney at the end of next week and am researching the areas you mentioned. How would yu rte thefor small children? Commute to CBD?
Also, did you look at other areas such as Pennant Hills or Turramurra?
Thanks again foir a great post. Tom
Oct 19th 2007, 1:41 pm
#6
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Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
1. Sydney is more consistently warmer.
2. Sydney has nice beaches near the centre whereas Melbourne is on a bay and you need to travel for beaches.
3. Sydney is more spectacular. We had dinner in a restaurant opposite the bridge and the opera house with a view that just could not be improved.
However from a practical standpoint Melbourne is considerably cheaper and has less traffic so commuting is more relaxed.
There are many other points of comparison and contrast but those are the main ones in my view.
Oct 19th 2007, 2:03 pm
#7
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Joined: Sep 2001
Location: Sydney
Posts: 3,014
Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
So back to the two offers on houses!
Which suburbs did you chose,what schools? I am being extremely nosy but being in St Ives I need to know!
What ages are your children and are you considering fee paying for primary as you have the NSW 457 fees or are they senior years? Very interested - did you look at the public option in these areas?
I will disagree about the commute it can be worse and it can be better a few times.......and do you have parking thrown in?
I understand no money to throw around but considerations such as buying 1-1.5M on a 457, fee paying, 100K cars. Do you work for Macquaire? Or transfering on a UK salary?
Best of luck I think your post is an honest one
Cheers
Which suburbs did you chose,what schools? I am being extremely nosy but being in St Ives I need to know!
What ages are your children and are you considering fee paying for primary as you have the NSW 457 fees or are they senior years? Very interested - did you look at the public option in these areas?
I will disagree about the commute it can be worse and it can be better a few times.......and do you have parking thrown in?
I understand no money to throw around but considerations such as buying 1-1.5M on a 457, fee paying, 100K cars. Do you work for Macquaire? Or transfering on a UK salary?
Best of luck I think your post is an honest one
Cheers
Oct 19th 2007, 3:40 pm
#8
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Joined: Jul 2005
Location: psssst, I'm over here, in the corner......
Posts: 173
Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
Sounds like you had a good time and managed to sort out a few things 
I am assuming the 30 mins commute is on the train........in the car you are facing a much longer drive (I unfortunately have to do it 3 times a week), although hubby uses the train because he works in the city centre (circular quay). Between us I think we have left at various times between 6am- 9am, and believe me, the traffics bloody awful!
I am assuming the 30 mins commute is on the train........in the car you are facing a much longer drive (I unfortunately have to do it 3 times a week), although hubby uses the train because he works in the city centre (circular quay). Between us I think we have left at various times between 6am- 9am, and believe me, the traffics bloody awful!
Oct 19th 2007, 3:53 pm
#9
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Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
So back to the two offers on houses!
Which suburbs did you chose,what schools? I am being extremely nosy but being in St Ives I need to know!
What ages are your children and are you considering fee paying for primary as you have the NSW 457 fees or are they senior years? Very interested - did you look at the public option in these areas?
I will disagree about the commute it can be worse and it can be better a few times.......and do you have parking thrown in?
I understand no money to throw around but considerations such as buying 1-1.5M on a 457, fee paying, 100K cars. Do you work for Macquaire? Or transfering on a UK salary?
Best of luck I think your post is an honest one
Cheers
Which suburbs did you chose,what schools? I am being extremely nosy but being in St Ives I need to know!
What ages are your children and are you considering fee paying for primary as you have the NSW 457 fees or are they senior years? Very interested - did you look at the public option in these areas?
I will disagree about the commute it can be worse and it can be better a few times.......and do you have parking thrown in?
I understand no money to throw around but considerations such as buying 1-1.5M on a 457, fee paying, 100K cars. Do you work for Macquaire? Or transfering on a UK salary?
Best of luck I think your post is an honest one
Cheers
To take your points in order.
We have one offer on a house in Pymble and another on a house in St Ives. I think we will get one of them (even though buying on a 457 is tricky).
Our children are slightly older than most on these boards (15 and 11) and this will be our second relocation (we currently live in Germany) and hence we are also slightly more ......ahem.....more mature (in years). Both the schools we have chosen are fee paying (Knox Grammar and Ravenswood) although we did also consider Kilara High as that seems to do quite well on the HSE's. At the end of the day we chose the schools based on reputation, feel and availability of places (all have broadly similar fee structures).
Yes I do get a parking space.
I don't work for Macquaire but I do work in that sector!
and I don't have cash just an unhealthy predilection for leverage!
Oct 19th 2007, 4:06 pm
#10
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Joined: Oct 2007
Location: Curly Beach
Posts: 155
Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
Hello
I am new to this forum but found your post very interesting.
My husband is going out to Sydney at the weekend for a reccie as he is due to start his new job in the new year. We have been looking at suburbs on the northern beaches and wondered if you went up that far. He also has tours arranged with Pittwater House and Sceggs Redlands schools and wondered if you knew anything about these or any other schools in that area.
There is so much information to take in and so many different suburbs to choose from its getting very daunting.
Any advice and help would be appreciated especially re commuting to CBD
Many thanks in advance
I am new to this forum but found your post very interesting.
My husband is going out to Sydney at the weekend for a reccie as he is due to start his new job in the new year. We have been looking at suburbs on the northern beaches and wondered if you went up that far. He also has tours arranged with Pittwater House and Sceggs Redlands schools and wondered if you knew anything about these or any other schools in that area.
There is so much information to take in and so many different suburbs to choose from its getting very daunting.
Any advice and help would be appreciated especially re commuting to CBD
Many thanks in advance
Oct 19th 2007, 5:49 pm
#11
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Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2005
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Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
Hello
I am new to this forum but found your post very interesting.
My husband is going out to Sydney at the weekend for a reccie as he is due to start his new job in the new year. We have been looking at suburbs on the northern beaches and wondered if you went up that far. He also has tours arranged with Pittwater House and Sceggs Redlands schools and wondered if you knew anything about these or any other schools in that area.
There is so much information to take in and so many different suburbs to choose from its getting very daunting.
Any advice and help would be appreciated especially re commuting to CBD
Many thanks in advance
I am new to this forum but found your post very interesting.
My husband is going out to Sydney at the weekend for a reccie as he is due to start his new job in the new year. We have been looking at suburbs on the northern beaches and wondered if you went up that far. He also has tours arranged with Pittwater House and Sceggs Redlands schools and wondered if you knew anything about these or any other schools in that area.
There is so much information to take in and so many different suburbs to choose from its getting very daunting.
Any advice and help would be appreciated especially re commuting to CBD
Many thanks in advance
Sorry we didn't look at the schools you mention but as I said I would recommend that you check whether there is a good chance of being offered a place before you potentially waste time visiting.
We looked at some of the nothern beach suburbs (including French's Forest etc.) but dismissed them as although they are slightly better value for money they are not as close to rail lines (as the suburbs we looked at) and commuting looked a bit more daunting. I am sure others will be able to help on that.
Oct 20th 2007, 4:30 am
#12
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Joined: Sep 2001
Location: Sydney
Posts: 3,014
Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
Sandra
To take your points in order.
We have one offer on a house in Pymble and another on a house in St Ives. I think we will get one of them (even though buying on a 457 is tricky).
Our children are slightly older than most on these boards (15 and 11) and this will be our second relocation (we currently live in Germany) and hence we are also slightly more ......ahem.....more mature (in years). Both the schools we have chosen are fee paying (Knox Grammar and Ravenswood) although we did also consider Kilara High as that seems to do quite well on the HSE's. At the end of the day we chose the schools based on reputation, feel and availability of places (all have broadly similar fee structures).
Yes I do get a parking space.
I don't work for Macquaire but I do work in that sector! and I don't have cash just an unhealthy predilection for leverage!
To take your points in order.
We have one offer on a house in Pymble and another on a house in St Ives. I think we will get one of them (even though buying on a 457 is tricky).
Our children are slightly older than most on these boards (15 and 11) and this will be our second relocation (we currently live in Germany) and hence we are also slightly more ......ahem.....more mature (in years). Both the schools we have chosen are fee paying (Knox Grammar and Ravenswood) although we did also consider Kilara High as that seems to do quite well on the HSE's. At the end of the day we chose the schools based on reputation, feel and availability of places (all have broadly similar fee structures).
Yes I do get a parking space.
I don't work for Macquaire but I do work in that sector!
and I don't have cash just an unhealthy predilection for leverage!My kids are 17 and 15, one doing his HSC this year at St Ives. Knoxs and Ravenswood have good reputations - did you look at Barker College?
We have been here nearly 6 years in St Ives so we think it has something going for it.
Good luck with your move
Oct 20th 2007, 7:34 am
#13
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Posts: 2,030
Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
Another person living in St Ives, but not for long, as after a year we have just stopped looking for a house as we have bought one in Pymble.
If you want any further comments on the houses/street/area/REA etc, PM the addresses & I will let you know my thoughts.
If you want any further comments on the houses/street/area/REA etc, PM the addresses & I will let you know my thoughts.
Oct 20th 2007, 7:59 am
#14
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Re: Sydney reccie (long post)
I just had my offer accepted on the house in Pymble
When we arrived two weeks ago it was being marketed for between $1.5 and $1.7 but this week it was reduced to $1.49 and we got it for for slightly less than that. I have seen a few houses in that price range where the price has reduced although the agent tells me that the couple had a higher offer on the house on the first day they put it on the market but they wanted to hold out for more. I guess we could have waited until we arrive but this was exactly the kind of place we were looking for so why wait.
Sandra
We did myke an enquiry at Barker college but they had no places available.
