Re: Solar Power
 

$40k and above

I would focus more on trying to reduce your current usage

Re: Solar Power
 

Thanks for that BS. I only use the tumble dryer once a week for towels & undies, the rest goes on the line. We already have a solar hot water system installed. I'm strict (and nag everyone else) about turning off lights in unused rooms and wasting electricity generally. Will have a look at getting an energy usage monitor installed, and also get quoted for a smaller solar power system.

Re: Solar Power
 

I am in the category of wanting solar to save money however the pay back figures never add up. Maybe i am missing something that someone can see.

for example a 1.5kW system from Origin is $3000. I live in Brisbane so calculate that will generate 2211kWh (1.5kw x 4.04 (daily average per kw system for brisbane) x 365 days)

At a peak rate of electricity of 0.194 $ per kw thats a yrly saving of $429 per yr.

Then when you take into account that the $3000 could have been used to pay off some of the mortgage at 7% per year (ie earning the equivalent of $210 in interest per yr) the saving from solar is only $219 per yr. This is roughly a 15yr payback.

(Also what makes it worse for us is that we can salary sacrifice our electricity bill (QLD gov worker so pay it before income tax) This is approx an extra $80 reducing the solar saving to $140 per yr or 21yrs payback.

From my experience in Manufacturing industry anything less than 5yrs pay back is not worth doing unless for a strategic reason (ie a greenie)

The other reason we might go solar is so that we have power during daytime blackouts (like the flooding) however any system has to shut down in such cases (for obvious reasons)

Have i missed anything off this calculation or is it true Solar is a 15- 20 yr payback:thumbdown:

Re: Solar Power
 

Lot of factors at work...and I am not a finance person so cannot really comment on a lot of things, however...

If you are grid connected (and nearly everyone is in urban areas) then a solar panel system will not make any difference if there is a blackout in your neighbourhood. By law in all states, if there is a power blackout then your inverter MUST shut down and stop feeding the power into your house. The alternative? You become grid-independent and draw all of your electricity from your solar production and store the excess in batteries. This solution is extremely expensive at the moment (no doubt will significantly reduce over the years to come). However you will not even come close to being able to do something like this off a 1.5kW system. You'll need to be looking at something more like a 10kW system to power the average household in this manner.

A number of factors you may not be considering in your calculations...

a 1.5kW system will NOT eliminate your bill, no matter what the cowboys out there tell you. However, it will likely significantly reduce your bills. Your usage of electricity is not likely to rise significantly over the years (unless you are planning to add new family members), however the cost of that same usage of electricity most certainly will. In the last 12 months in QLD we have seen a 11% increase in electricity prices. In the next 24 months there is an expected 33% rise in power costs. Have you considered how much of these rises you would save from buying a solar power system?

Also, dependent on your circumstances, if there is no one at home during peak power production time (ie: 8am-3pm in Sth East QLD) then you will almost certainly be feeding this power back into the grid and earning yourself the boosted rate of 44c per kilowatt.

I'm not sure what calculations you are running, but on average for a 1.5kW system in South East QLD, with a buy price of $3000 (also the average buy price for this size system) then the pay back rate should be 4-5 years.

Re: Solar Power
 

Hi Broadshoulders,

I maybe i wasnt that clear in my post. I totally understand that the inverter needs to shut down during blackouts hence the use of the (for obvious reasons) in my post.

I also understand that a 1.5kw system would not take care of all the electricity, it is more a case of getting some sort of solar panel system to contribute to bills rather than being self sufficient. To be self sufficient would cost alot and my point was more that i cannot get the figures to add up even with a small system.

Thanks for your point about the 44c feed back, which i didnt use in my calculation. I was led to believe it is about net feedback. ie if i use 3000kwh and generate 2000kwh then there is no electricity to get the feedback rate on even if it was done during the day time and i use it at night. Is that correct?

As for the pay back i thought i had explained my costings pretty well. My example would have had a payback of approx 6 yrs if i hadnt looked at the income the initial investment could have generated if i had used it to pay off my mortgage. ie
$3000 would return $210 in interest a yr.
$3000 on solar would return $429 in savings a yr.
Therefore the actual saving of going solar as apposed to paying off mortgage is $219 net. This makes the payback 15yrs.

I agree electricity prices will most probably go up yr on yr and it is worth considering however i think at this point in time solar is more of a green lifestyle choice than a financial decision. Maybe in a few yrs time solar panels will become more efficient and cost less making it more viable.

Re: Solar Power
 

Not quite. Time is the important factor in all this. If your solar panel system produces let's say 7.3kW during the day (average for a 1.5kW system on the Eastern Coast), but no one is home during that time to use any power then nearly all of that will be fed back into the grid at the value of 44c/kW (a grand total of $3.21/day). Then if you use (hypothetically) the same amount of power in the evening during off-peak period, then you will pay approx 88c for that same amount of power (7.3kW x $0.12 (my off-peak rate)), giving you a net difference of -$2.33 per day.

Now as you can see all of those figures are based on an assumed power usage amount of a single person with low power usage and the average output of a small 1.5kW system. But it does highlight the importance of when you use your electricity and the returns you can get from it

As I said, I am no finance person so I can't really add much value to the above, however, something is askew with those figures as most systems above 1.5kW have a suggested payback period of around the 7-9 years in QLD. It all comes down to the value of the FiT rate.

Re: Solar Power
 

Solar panels (5 kw system) were installed on Thurs by Ingenero. We can highly recommend them. The guys that fitted the system were prompt and professional, made no mess cleaned up after themselves and did a very tidy job.
A big thank you to Broadshoulders for all your help.

Will give an update on their performance soon (55kwh sat & sun:thumbsup:)

Re: Solar Power
 

No worries Rob. Glad it all went well. Your install was all pretty straight forward really from all reports, in contrast to Buzzy-Bee's one we are working on right now. You couldn't really find two installs of the same system so different from each other.

...a working progress which I am hopeful we will have sorted out pretty soon.

Re: Solar Power
 

Oh great - I'm doomed. :rofl:

BB

Re: Solar Power
 

You're about right.

The main problem is the insistence on getting a cowboy to fit it (by the government) and the inability of the common systems to feed the house in the event of a power outage. Put them together with net rather than gross tariffs, they make it stupid to put money into solar panels.

The technology in itself can be made to make sense. However the red tape sinks it by stupidity and design.

Re: Solar Power
 

Can anyone advise where to start? ... :unsure:

Last bill was $770 and on the Origin bill it states on the front my daily average is 37.3KWh.

I have the T3 (think it's called) tariff which only supplies the hot water. Out of that $770 I think my hot water totalled $86, which for 4 adults bath or showering daily we're happy with ... :)

But! ... have been meaning to get Solar, but haven't a clue where to start, what size, and will it even be worth it as my garden faces North and I back onto bush. In the Winter I think the sun's only on the roof for a few hours midday. I'd like to check 100% this Winter to be sure, but with the rebate ending soon, I don't have time to play with ... :(

I'm 30k's south from Brisbane, so hoping Mr Broad can shed some light if he could be so kind?

Thanks in advance.

Re: Solar Power
 

Would 18K be better spent on Double Glazing, more insulaton and low energy appliances instead ? LED lighting and inverter system, and maybe a very large water tank feeding most of your needs ?

Thats the issue I'm trying to nut out.

Re: Solar Power
 

Didnt read this before I posted... blimey you will make money !! :thumbup:

Can you actually receive a cash rebate from doing this ?

Re: Solar Power
 

That off peak usage is all well and good, but it's only 11pm till 7am in Vic AFAIK... who would use real power then ? The evening usage when people come home from work would negate the savings in most cases.

I think those expansive peak times are the big killer for the Solar rebate from my point of view.

Re: Solar Power
 

Off peak is all weekend too. We can run the pool pump at night and do all the washing at weekend too, as there's only 2 of us. Dishwasher switched on when we get up at 6am.