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-   -   A Pom (https://britishexpats.com/forum/australia-54/pom-424416/)

thebears Feb 5th 2007 8:59 am
A Pom
 
The Ozzies have the "Wallaby"
The Kiwis have the "Kiwi"
The French have the "Frog"
The Saf's have the "Springbok"

What sort of animal (imaginary if need be) would we create for "the Pom"?

Something with affection please not distain.

DrWho Feb 5th 2007 9:03 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by thebears (Post 4367751)
The Ozzies have the "Wallaby"
The Kiwis have the "Kiwi"
The French have the "Frog"
The Saf's have the "Springbok"

What sort of animal (imaginary if need be) would we create for "the Pom"?

Something with affection please not distain.
Got three of them... Lions...

Or a seriously BFO Dragon...

Australia_bound? Feb 5th 2007 9:04 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by thebears (Post 4367751)
The Ozzies have the "Wallaby"
The Kiwis have the "Kiwi"
The French have the "Frog"
The Saf's have the "Springbok"

What sort of animal (imaginary if need be) would we create for "the Pom"?

Something with affection please not distain.
Not sure the frog is supposed to be complimentary lol :p

British Bulldog!

Not a Pom, as no one even knows what it means, not prisoner of mother england so what exactly does it mean? Pom indeed may become a racial term in the near future! :ohmy: if it isn't already to many...

thebears Feb 5th 2007 9:07 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by Australia_bound? (Post 4367773)
Not sure the frog is supposed to be complimentary lol :p

British Bulldog!

Not a Pom, as no one even knows what it means, not prisoner of mother england so what exactly does it mean? Pom indeed may become a racial term in the near future! :ohmy: if it isn't already to many...
Yes I thought of a british bull dog but then my wife said " I don't think the women would take kindly to be associated with a big fat dribble monster".

PS I like bulldogs so no bias - can picture one with a big gold chain with "Chav" around its neck - not the picture we need on the world stage.:sneaky:

stuckinblighty Feb 5th 2007 9:14 am
Re: A Pom
 
a hedgehog

thebears Feb 5th 2007 9:24 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by rodders39 (Post 4367771)
Got three of them... Lions...

Or a seriously BFO Dragon...
I like the idea of the dragon:thumbup:

DrWho Feb 5th 2007 9:38 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by thebears (Post 4367848)
I like the idea of the dragon:thumbup:
Called Puff...! :rofl:

Dried Graze Feb 5th 2007 9:50 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by thebears (Post 4367848)
I like the idea of the dragon:thumbup:
That would be the Welsh. Didn't George Formby batter a dragon to death with his eukulele while on tour in Libya and later become a saint in the eyes of the English? It would probably more relevant to adopt the lion but dogs, cats and ferrets are more appropriate.

:)

Vash the Stampede Feb 5th 2007 9:52 am
Re: A Pom
 
1 Attachment(s)
Originally Posted by Australia_bound? (Post 4367773)
Not sure the frog is supposed to be complimentary lol :p

British Bulldog!

Not a Pom, as no one even knows what it means, not prisoner of mother england so what exactly does it mean? Pom indeed may become a racial term in the near future! :ohmy: if it isn't already to many...
The slang term "Pom" was originally an abbreviation of "pomegranate" (used as rhyming slang for "immigrant").

This is was authoritatively confirmed by than D H Lawrence, who made the following remarks in 1923:

Pommy is supposed to be short for pomegranate. Pomegranate, pronounced invariably pommygranate, is a near enough rhyme to immigrant, in a naturally rhyming country. Furthermore, immigrants are known in their first months, before their blood "thins down", by their round and ruddy cheeks.
Earlier evidence is found in The Pommies, or New Chums in Australia (1920) by H J Rumsey, who observes that the original term for an immigrant in Melbourne was "Jimmy Grant".

"Jimmy Grant" soon morphed into "Pommy Grant"; possibly an oblique reference to pomegranates (which fresh-off-the-boat Poms quickly resembled). But whatever the reason, "pomegranate" for "immigrant" became the new rhyming slang of choice. This was inevitably truncated (as most Aussie slang words are) to "Pom".

The popular belief that "POME" or "POHM" are acronyms for "Prisoner of Mother England" and "Prisoner of Her Majesty" and were originally embroidered on the uniforms of convicts, is false.

See attached for a photograph of a genuine convict uniform (the last known in existence), and note the absence of acronyms.

Vash the Stampede Feb 5th 2007 9:53 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by stuckinblighty (Post 4367815)
a hedgehog
Spot on. The perfect symbol.

:)

Australia_bound? Feb 5th 2007 10:06 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by Vash the Stampede (Post 4367924)
The slang term "Pom" was originally an abbreviation of "pomegranate" (used as rhyming slang for "immigrant").

This is was authoritatively confirmed by than D H Lawrence, who made the following remarks in 1923:

Pommy is supposed to be short for pomegranate. Pomegranate, pronounced invariably pommygranate, is a near enough rhyme to immigrant, in a naturally rhyming country. Furthermore, immigrants are known in their first months, before their blood "thins down", by their round and ruddy cheeks.
Earlier evidence is found in The Pommies, or New Chums in Australia (1920) by H J Rumsey, who observes that the original term for an immigrant in Melbourne was "Jimmy Grant".

"Jimmy Grant" soon morphed into "Pommy Grant"; possibly an oblique reference to pomegranates (which fresh-off-the-boat Poms quickly resembled). But whatever the reason, "pomegranate" for "immigrant" became the new rhyming slang of choice. This was inevitably truncated (as most Aussie slang words are) to "Pom".

The popular belief that "POME" or "POHM" are acronyms for "Prisoner of Mother England" and "Prisoner of Her Majesty" and were originally embroidered on the uniforms of convicts, is false.

See attached for a photograph of a genuine convict uniform (the last known in existence), and note the absence of acronyms.
So why are only the English supposed to be Poms then? When the evidence you provide points to it being a universally encompassing term for just about any immigrant into Australia!

lightr0d2o Feb 5th 2007 10:13 am
Re: A Pom
 
I was told by a lovely lady who was an "Ozzie", That POM stood for PERFECTION OF MAN...
I just kissed her on the cheek and agreed politly....;) :D :thumbup:

shears Feb 5th 2007 10:16 am
Re: A Pom
 
1 Attachment(s)
Why not a proper Pom-eranian? :)

sel Feb 5th 2007 10:37 am
Re: A Pom
 
PMSL :lol: .... Looks like something my cat coughed up !!




The Horse :)

sassycat Feb 5th 2007 10:38 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by shears (Post 4368021)
Why not a proper Pom-eranian? :)
Which end is which?

Vash the Stampede Feb 5th 2007 10:38 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by Australia_bound? (Post 4367963)
So why are only the English supposed to be Poms then?
Because they were the original recipients of the term.

When the evidence you provide points to it being a universally encompassing term for just about any immigrant into Australia!
It wasn't. It was originally used exclusively of English people who travelled to Australia as "assisted immigrants". The word "Jimmygrant" tended to be more general, and was not exclusive to the English.

Hence the OED entry, which cites a number of examples from the era in which the word was originally coined:

POM n.2, POMMY n.

1912 Bulletin (Sydney) 14 Nov. 16/4 The other day a Pummy Grant (assisted immigrant) was handed a bridle and told to catch a horse.
1912 Truth (Sydney) 22 Dec. 1/3 Now they call 'em ‘Pomegranates’ and the Jimmygrants don't like it.
1924 D. H. LAWRENCE & M. SKINNER Boy in Bush 120 Here you, young Pommy Grant.
1963 X. HERBERT Disturbing Elem. 91 He still wore the heavy clumsy British type of clothing of the day. When we kids saw people on the street dressed like that we would yell at them: ‘Jimmygrants, Pommygranates, Pommies!’
Source.

thebears Feb 5th 2007 11:08 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by rodders39 (Post 4367899)
Called Puff...! :rofl:
Your thinking the same relaxation:thumbup:

windog Feb 5th 2007 8:01 pm
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by Vash the Stampede (Post 4367927)
Spot on. The perfect symbol.

:)
Nearly....

It should be a flat hedgehog :D

steandleigh Feb 5th 2007 8:08 pm
Re: A Pom
 
Maybe the Badger - quite unique to the UK:)

hedgehog-girl Feb 5th 2007 9:03 pm
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by Vash the Stampede (Post 4367927)
Spot on. The perfect symbol.

:)
Yes I think so too!

OzTennis Feb 5th 2007 9:37 pm
Re: A Pom
 
Some suggestions, offered in friendly spirit. :D

A rhino (thick hide needed to withstand banter)
An albatross or a whale (Britannia rules the waves)
A dodo (that's what's going to happen to Ashes and World Cup victories)
A cat (thinks it's a superior being)
A chameleon (changes colour - to pomegranate in the sun)
A secretary bird (civil servants, ex-public school really run the country)
A slain lion rampant and dragon (to symbolise Scotland and Wales)
A jail bird (what it did to us 'convicts')
......................... that'll do for now!:D

OzTennis :)

The Murphsters Feb 5th 2007 10:16 pm
Re: A Pom
 
A tame little Lapdog maybe?

http://www.cartoonstock.com/newscart...es/knin61l.jpg





http://davidicke.com/news/data/upimages/Blair-bush.jpg


Only an idea!

Paul & Wendy Feb 6th 2007 12:16 am
Re: A Pom
 
For us Scots, our national animal would have to be the Haggis - not often seen, but living in the heather moors up in the Highlands!

Buzzy--Bee Feb 6th 2007 12:21 am
Re: A Pom
 
The British have always been known as The Lions from the days of Empire. I however have long since given up referring to myself as British, in preference to being known as English.

I think a truly English animal would have to be the Badger.

:beer:

Buzzy the Badger

Dolly Feb 6th 2007 12:30 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by Vash the Stampede (Post 4368101)
Because they were the original recipients of the term.



It wasn't. It was originally used exclusively of English people who travelled to Australia as "assisted immigrants". The word "Jimmygrant" tended to be more general, and was not exclusive to the English.

Hence the OED entry, which cites a number of examples from the era in which the word was originally coined:

POM n.2, POMMY n.

1912 Bulletin (Sydney) 14 Nov. 16/4 The other day a Pummy Grant (assisted immigrant) was handed a bridle and told to catch a horse.
1912 Truth (Sydney) 22 Dec. 1/3 Now they call 'em ‘Pomegranates’ and the Jimmygrants don't like it.
1924 D. H. LAWRENCE & M. SKINNER Boy in Bush 120 Here you, young Pommy Grant.
1963 X. HERBERT Disturbing Elem. 91 He still wore the heavy clumsy British type of clothing of the day. When we kids saw people on the street dressed like that we would yell at them: ‘Jimmygrants, Pommygranates, Pommies!’
Source.


You surely must have a degree in answering this question by now;)

Dolly:)

OzTennis Feb 6th 2007 12:52 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by dollydaydream2 (Post 4370083)
You surely must have a degree in answering this question by now;)

Dolly:)
It is possible to find 'authoratative' other versions of the derivation of the name on the net and in books. The one I know which is good enough for me is from my grandfather, who fought in WW1 alongside 'Poms'. When as a very young child I asked him why they are called thus he gave me the version about cheeks (facial) getting as burned as pomegranates in the sun. There's also the earlier use of pomegranates by sailors to ward off scurvy (eg Vitamin C force fed by Cook to his crew). No doubt the penchant for eating them and turning the colour of them is at the heart of the tag.

OzTennis :)

Australia_bound? Feb 6th 2007 9:55 am
Re: A Pom
 
Originally Posted by dollydaydream2 (Post 4370083)
You surely must have a degree in answering this question by now;)

Dolly:)
But still can't find that ground breaking piece of evidence that states it is a definite reference to English people!
Seems that British is scattered in there a lot!
Funny thing is, not a racist term but the Welsh, Scots and Irish are all glad they're not referred to as Poms or refuse to accept the term could possibly be aimed in their direction!


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