melbournegirl

I have noticed some discussion about whether the U.K. or Australia has better education. It doesn't matter where you go in the world there are going to be brilliant schools, bad schools and everything in between. Generally speaking most Australian schools I feel are very good, some are excellent and a few are dodgy. People need to research before they choose a school. Talk to people in the area and visit the school. Generally if you live in a good area then the schools are usually of a high standard.

As far as education standards in both countires go the OECD do an education survey called PISA every three years. They survey 15 year olds around the world in Literacy, science and mathematics and then table the results.

This is the results of the last survey which was publised late 2007. As you can see Australia came out as being in the 'above average' countries and the U.K. came out 'average'.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/e...on/7126388.stm

comet555

I've noticed a lot of complaints too about the education here. I also see the same comments in the Canada forum which I look at from time to time.

It is interesting to note that Canada is also in the 'above average' category the same as Australia and that according to that the UK is just 'average'.

Personally I've always thought that the complaints in general come from a "uk is better" attitude and that the other countries (Canada and Australia) are different and therefore not as good. I'm not saying it's the case with everyone, but it just seems that the first comment about the schooling is always that their kids were farther ahead in the UK. But I like to think beyond just the year the child is in but rather the education up to the time they leave school. I think it all evens out and that Australia probably just has a slower approach in the early years, which can be a good thing.

Obviously in all countries there are good and bad schools. It just bugs me to see the big generalizations.

The Woodcutter

Yes - that is about right.
Having worked in tertiary colleges in the UK and Australia and taught students who have come straight from school the standard of academic ability in terms of spoken and written English, the ability to conceptualise and analyse, and inter-personal skills etc, is slightly better in Australian students.

UK education has, to a large extent, been dumbed down to the point whereby British Universities are desperate to introduce their own assessment procedures for entry because 'A' levels and GCSEs no longer hold the currency that they once did.

cranston

IMO it's down to the effort you and your child put in.

melbournegirl

I agree.

We had some kids from the U.K. start at my kids school and they were way behind and had to do a lot of catching up. As you said different schools teach at different rates and they might teach some subjects earlier or later. In some countries such as Germany they don't even start school until they are 6 or 7. The teachers here must be good or otherwise there wouldn't be so many being poached to go and work in the U.K.

quoll

Interesting - I have seen quite a few UK kids come into our schools and generally (the exceptions being those kids with identified special needs) their skills were at least one year and more often closer to two years ahead of their age cohort here. I suspect much of that was because of the earlier start in UK and more "taught" than "learning" approach of UK schools. They certainly wiped the floor with our kids with respect to reading comprehension, number skills and spelling.

I suspect the UK sample included a higher percentage of children for whom English was not their first language in their sample and that may have skewed the figures somewhat. If you look at the above average group they tend to be largely countries with relatively small immigration levels from memory.

With respect to Aussie teachers being recruited by UK - largely because young Australians are desperate to get out of the place and also because getting a permanent job as a teacher in Aus is a very challenging process and unless you fancy a stint in Cabbage Tree Creek or Boomanoomanah then you wont get a position in a "plum" area.

jad n rich

Kids arriving here (qld) from the UK are usually so far ahead their aussie peers, they are sometimes put in the grade above, or more often the proud english parents are loving the OZ education system because Wills or Lucy are suddenly "gifted" Later they find out why, and if they return to the UK there is one hell of a panic about how far behind they are.

If your staying in one system none of it probably matters, at the end of the day, they will get the right bits of paper. I personally think taking mine out of the 'relaxed' humm OZ system and putting them in the UK one is now impossible, I'd be the first to admit they would probably never catch up. That might have worked after 6 months or a year, but not now

cpdods

Having started one of my boys education in Oz and 1 in uk and spoken to friends who are teachers I felt the oldest (started in Oz) seemed to have more of grasp of things. Apparently the Nat Curriculum is now so rigid if the kids don't get it the first time round thats it forever no room to play catch up. Also some of the 'better' universities take from private schools because the state school pupils can not debate, or have their own views and are up to date on todays issues (apparently)- they only know what they have been specifically taught and are not meant to think outside the box. They are groomed for GCSEs. Not sure if this is the case or not.
We try and do extras with our boys to give them every chance we can. Looking forward to getting back to Oz system now.

moneypenny20

Surely though it's kind of irrelevant where grade 4, 5, 6 kids are in comparison to UK kids? As has been said, it's where the child at the end of grade 12 is compared to the child finishing Upper Sixth (no idea if it's still called that).

Just my opinion and not now commenting on your post, but I would rather have a 6 year old who can have a conversation with an adult and be able to stand up in front of the class to speak without being obnoxious, than one who can write their name and do their 3 times table. Other people prefer it the other way round, neither is right nor wrong, it's just a different way of teaching.

What would be interesting to know is if Australian Unis interviewed students from the UK and visa versa, what the Unis thought of the standard of a) the student's education and b) how competent the student was in selling themselves in order to get a place. I may be wrong but I can't help thinking that in that respect, an Australian student may do better.

comet555

Totally agree!

melbournegirl

There is no sample as such. All 15 year olds are required to sit for the test.

Yes, the Australian method of teaching may be a bit more 'creative' but at least the kids are confident and self assured and seems by 15 out doing most other countries in terms of learning.

quoll

I didnt detect any deficits in the UK kids with respect to maturity in discussing issues or relating to adults or other children actually so I am not sure that there is that much of a difference between the two groups. I often had to test kids who had come over because there were questions about their grade placement and on the whole they were just as eloquent and confident during the process as any other child I tested. Occasionally it was obvious that they would be better placed in groups older than their age cohort although that was obviously not the case for everyone.

The difference between Aus and UK children is important when families decide to make the move back to UK - if the children have been in an educational environment which has not covered the same ground then of course they will be disadvantaged when they return. So there is some value in comparing throughout the process. If, of course, a child is going to complete their education here then obviously there is no mileage in comparing the two.

You would actually expect UK children to be ahead at the end of A levels because that is 14 years of education compared with the standard 13 years of Aus education. The comparability should come at the end of an honours degree when the number of years completed would be equivalent.

There is an international University equivalence study also done and Aus universities score generally below UK universities. Someone posted it on here late last year. The top Aus university in the study was ANU too which was interesting. Both my boys went there and neither were particularly enamoured of the process - both of them, but especially the second one, were incredibly frustrated by the heavy emphasis on group assessments when some of the group were fee paying students with a very limited grasp of English and others were apathetic in the extreme. He challenged a couple of decisions and was given higher grades because obviously the lecturers agreed that individuals were being disadvantaged. Their degrees have travelled OK to UK and DS1 didnt have any trouble getting his degrees recognized when he needed to.

As someone else said - it probably doesnt really matter as long as you have parents who are concerned about the education of their kids and keep an eye on what is happening for them.

quoll

OK the UK cohort then probably has a higher percentage of non native language speakers. I was using the term "sample" loosly to mean the group that were assessed. I apologise.

Paddy_M

As a UK teacher I can say that, in general, kids seem to be taught to pass the content of a GCSE.

There are more modular exams where pupils can resit. Coursework is a complete joke IMO and I am glad it is starting to go.

Primary schools are now heading for the skills based curriculum.

It is only recently that UK schools are adapting a different approach and asking pupils to have greater autonomy. In fact, some UK schools are adapting Aussie methods of teaching....I know we are!

Racht70

I agree