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Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Old Jan 8th 2018, 10:11 pm
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by Beoz
And there's the tourist / business visitor coming out in me. I am glad to hear. It would be so sad if our lives were restricted to CBD's

Or alternatively, as in comment regarding Perth being busy, a further off the cuff remark, completely divorced from reality.
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Old Jan 9th 2018, 9:06 am
  #242  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

8
Originally Posted by the troubadour
Well you may come from a backwater with no CBD but city centres do rank as important features. Obviously the City of London, being a square mile an exception, but has a well defined centre. As I wrote Sydney's centre is rather ordinary. But if unused to big smokes I can see you may be blown away.
Well yes funnily enough so many of our prime are increasingly a struggle for average people to afford to live and no doubt less desirable with the smugness of those that believe in the virtue of high income equates a well balanced, intelligent populace, interesting environment type of city landscape.


We are not keeping immigration going the right way by a long shot. It is appeasing certain vested interest and lobby groups.....nothing for Bruce though.


You really do have a complex of importance don't you? No idea where you get it from. A huge Sydney mortgage is nothing to crow about. Ski trips to Europe...boring.....just amazing you find it so impressive. I'd be more impressed if said was going for cultural/intellectual refreshment .......but there you are traipsing up Alps with thousands of other like minded people will have to surface I suppose.


I think I'll pass on the real estate offer as well. Too far out for me, and Sydney when it corrects, if not sold out completely, something you cannot depend on the hue of Australian/ NSW governments not to go the whole hog and Honkers the city completely.
So tell us about you...what interests you? Apart from social justice...? You are becoming an enigma..
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Old Jan 9th 2018, 9:19 am
  #243  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by BadgeIsBack
8

So tell us about you...what interests you? Apart from social justice...? You are becoming an enigma..


Lets not. It's not about me. You rather like the use of the word enigma for some particular reason. How about we debate the thread subject matter and get over concerns for the individual poster. Probably why I hate Facebook so......
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Old Jan 9th 2018, 9:25 am
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by the troubadour
Lets not. It's not about me. You rather like the use of the word enigma for some particular reason. How about we debate the thread subject matter and get over concerns for the individual poster. Probably why I hate Facebook so......
Well, BE has become about a few posters in recent years and you've been active a fair bit.

You are right about Facebook.
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Old Jan 9th 2018, 1:31 pm
  #245  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Ah, I have so many emotions about this topic!

I'd say that if it's something that means a lot to you - just do it.

We are in our 2nd year in the UK after 13 years devoted to trying to move here (joys of UK immigration policy changes - I'm Australian, OH British). I'm afraid that after all our efforts we have arrived here too late. We are now -
inconceivably - considering a return to Oz.

The reasons are financial and lifestyle. I'm paid a fraction of my Oz salary (about a 3rd!) in one of my professional capacities - which is slowly facing extinction in the UK whilst flourishing in Oz. And in the other - due to archaic bureaucracy - I'm relegated back to Provisional level and offered a salary LESS than what I was paid in my first year of teaching in Australia in 2002.

The cost of living in the UK has increased, but wages have not, but our biggest issue has been with housing. I purchased a house on a single income with a dependent in Oz a few years ago. We're now in a similar rural location in the UK, on a dual income, and can't afford to buy! We live in an area with a housing shortage, so we've just moved house for the 3rd time in a year. This time we're in social housing - which wouldn't even be on my radar in Australia - and we've had to cram our family of 3 + cat into a shoebox designed for a single person. It was either that or live in a caravan.

Lifestyle - well, we're in Scotland so the weather is shite which we knew about, but besides the gym there are limited options for sport/recreation for women, and my daughter's options evaporated when she started high school as suddenly all the sports she played in Primary are "boys only". We're fighting this trend, but it's a hard slog, and depressing when in the same sized town in Oz she'd have netball, soccer, vigoro, AFL, tennis, swimming, waterskiing...

On the plus side, the scenery is lovely and the local pub is excellent. We have a business that relies on tourist trade and we get numbers here that we couldn't even dream of in Oz. I believe the standard of education at the local high school is possibly better than Oz, but at home we'd have affordable private school options which we don't have here. We can also travel to Europe (although we can't afford it mwahaha).

I think my answer to the OP is...yes. I've no regrets about the effort we put in to move to Scotland, even though we are now looking at moving to Australia. There have been plenty of high points and it would be much worse to spend the rest of my life wondering what if...
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Old Jan 10th 2018, 8:12 am
  #246  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by saoghalbeag
Ah, I have so many emotions about this topic!

I'd say that if it's something that means a lot to you - just do it.

We are in our 2nd year in the UK after 13 years devoted to trying to move here (joys of UK immigration policy changes - I'm Australian, OH British). I'm afraid that after all our efforts we have arrived here too late. We are now -
inconceivably - considering a return to Oz.

The reasons are financial and lifestyle. I'm paid a fraction of my Oz salary (about a 3rd!) in one of my professional capacities - which is slowly facing extinction in the UK whilst flourishing in Oz. And in the other - due to archaic bureaucracy - I'm relegated back to Provisional level and offered a salary LESS than what I was paid in my first year of teaching in Australia in 2002.

The cost of living in the UK has increased, but wages have not, but our biggest issue has been with housing. I purchased a house on a single income with a dependent in Oz a few years ago. We're now in a similar rural location in the UK, on a dual income, and can't afford to buy! We live in an area with a housing shortage, so we've just moved house for the 3rd time in a year. This time we're in social housing - which wouldn't even be on my radar in Australia - and we've had to cram our family of 3 + cat into a shoebox designed for a single person. It was either that or live in a caravan.

Lifestyle - well, we're in Scotland so the weather is shite which we knew about, but besides the gym there are limited options for sport/recreation for women, and my daughter's options evaporated when she started high school as suddenly all the sports she played in Primary are "boys only". We're fighting this trend, but it's a hard slog, and depressing when in the same sized town in Oz she'd have netball, soccer, vigoro, AFL, tennis, swimming, waterskiing...

On the plus side, the scenery is lovely and the local pub is excellent. We have a business that relies on tourist trade and we get numbers here that we couldn't even dream of in Oz. I believe the standard of education at the local high school is possibly better than Oz, but at home we'd have affordable private school options which we don't have here. We can also travel to Europe (although we can't afford it mwahaha).

I think my answer to the OP is...yes. I've no regrets about the effort we put in to move to Scotland, even though we are now looking at moving to Australia. There have been plenty of high points and it would be much worse to spend the rest of my life wondering what if...
Many thanks for your contribution. A great read. No idea pay a third of OZ rate. Wow. Still good to see you are aware of the positives to live in Scotland though. Good luck on future decision making. It would be great to get updates.
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Old Jan 10th 2018, 8:16 am
  #247  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by saoghalbeag
Ah, I have so many emotions about this topic!

I'd say that if it's something that means a lot to you - just do it.

We are in our 2nd year in the UK after 13 years devoted to trying to move here (joys of UK immigration policy changes - I'm Australian, OH British). I'm afraid that after all our efforts we have arrived here too late. We are now -
inconceivably - considering a return to Oz.

The reasons are financial and lifestyle. I'm paid a fraction of my Oz salary (about a 3rd!) in one of my professional capacities - which is slowly facing extinction in the UK whilst flourishing in Oz. And in the other - due to archaic bureaucracy - I'm relegated back to Provisional level and offered a salary LESS than what I was paid in my first year of teaching in Australia in 2002.

The cost of living in the UK has increased, but wages have not, but our biggest issue has been with housing. I purchased a house on a single income with a dependent in Oz a few years ago. We're now in a similar rural location in the UK, on a dual income, and can't afford to buy! We live in an area with a housing shortage, so we've just moved house for the 3rd time in a year. This time we're in social housing - which wouldn't even be on my radar in Australia - and we've had to cram our family of 3 + cat into a shoebox designed for a single person. It was either that or live in a caravan.

Lifestyle - well, we're in Scotland so the weather is shite which we knew about, but besides the gym there are limited options for sport/recreation for women, and my daughter's options evaporated when she started high school as suddenly all the sports she played in Primary are "boys only". We're fighting this trend, but it's a hard slog, and depressing when in the same sized town in Oz she'd have netball, soccer, vigoro, AFL, tennis, swimming, waterskiing...

On the plus side, the scenery is lovely and the local pub is excellent. We have a business that relies on tourist trade and we get numbers here that we couldn't even dream of in Oz. I believe the standard of education at the local high school is possibly better than Oz, but at home we'd have affordable private school options which we don't have here. We can also travel to Europe (although we can't afford it mwahaha).

I think my answer to the OP is...yes. I've no regrets about the effort we put in to move to Scotland, even though we are now looking at moving to Australia. There have been plenty of high points and it would be much worse to spend the rest of my life wondering what if...
I don't know where you were in Australia but don't you think moving to Australia now will be the same? If you can't afford a house in Scotland (depends where again), where will the money come from in Australia? Although you bought in Australia a few years ago I would imagine that prices have increased in Australia too if it's flourishing, so the better salary is not automatically getting you more these days.
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Old Jan 10th 2018, 10:58 am
  #248  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by Moses2013
I don't know where you were in Australia but don't you think moving to Australia now will be the same? If you can't afford a house in Scotland (depends where again), where will the money come from in Australia? Although you bought in Australia a few years ago I would imagine that prices have increased in Australia too if it's flourishing, so the better salary is not automatically getting you more these days.

It does depend on where however this is just a 59-minute commute from Southern Cross and that's going down to 45 mins soon. this 100,000 town offers very low unemployment. Walking distance to everything. People are going to be kicking themselves in just 15 years.

He'd likely be in front on rent alone, as long as he has 30K GBP deposit up his sleeve and very likely walk straight into a job.


https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...tral-127146550

At 175,000 pounds not bad at all.


Whats wrong with Ballarat you may ask, Well climate alone is the main reason people cite. It's damn hot in summer for Victoria and damn cold in Winter...... It's going to be heaps better climate wise than Scotland.... as long as you dont mind summer heat.

Last edited by ozzieeagle; Jan 10th 2018 at 11:04 am.
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Old Jan 10th 2018, 12:02 pm
  #249  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by ozzieeagle
It does depend on where however this is just a 59-minute commute from Southern Cross and that's going down to 45 mins soon. this 100,000 town offers very low unemployment. Walking distance to everything. People are going to be kicking themselves in just 15 years.

He'd likely be in front on rent alone, as long as he has 30K GBP deposit up his sleeve and very likely walk straight into a job.


https://www.realestate.com.au/proper...tral-127146550

At 175,000 pounds not bad at all.


Whats wrong with Ballarat you may ask, Well climate alone is the main reason people cite. It's damn hot in summer for Victoria and damn cold in Winter...... It's going to be heaps better climate wise than Scotland.... as long as you dont mind summer heat.
I'm with you on this OE. I've visited rural Victoria on a few occasions and found it to be pretty good. There's some genuinely nice towns that have a good vibe to them - nice people with something going on. I like it

After 11 years in Australia, I now realise that the best parts of Australia are out of the capital cities (which can, in parts, be ordinary by international standards - unless you have a lot of money)
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Old Jan 10th 2018, 9:46 pm
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by Amazulu
Indeed I do understand the supply/demand equation in relation to labour and how major cities attract people

but

London, for example, attracts people - lot's of people and the salaries there are the highest in the country. The ABS figures show us that Sydney attracts a lot of people yet salaries there are lower than in Perth, Darwin and Canberra and only slightly above the Australian average.
Unless I cannot find it, which is quite possible as its a horrible website, the ABS (last reported in 2010-11) reports that the average salary for Sydney was $57,612 and Perth was $58,181. Darwin was $55,788. That's a long time ago toward the end of the mining boom.

I think you were looking at states, back in 2010-11. Even then, Seeks annual salary review of states has NSW outstripping WA in 2016, which is a surprise to me as I would have thought the boys on the big bucks up in the Pilbara would have taken the WA state average way away from NSW and the rest of Australia

https://www.seek.com.au/career-advic...ry-review-2016

Since then the census in 2016 reported Perth with a median weekly household income of $1,643 and Sydney with a median weekly household income of $1,750.

PayScale has Perth at $62,527 for an average salary while it has Sydney at $65,933


Originally Posted by Amazulu
Salaries in Sydney do not bear any resemblance to the COL there (and before you start, people in Anglo-Saxon, capitalist countries prefer to own property rather than rent it - Sydney ain't Hamburg. We're right, they're wrong)
At the end of the day, just about everything in Sydney is cheaper than Perth except housing. If you consider a house as an investment, you know, like somewhere where you stick your money for a number of years like you would with your share portfolio, superannuation, etc, which market would you prefer that to be in?

Well let me see, a town riding on boom and bust cycles, where you can be in negative equity for years until the next boom, or somewhere that has more diversity in where its money comes from, somewhere that doesn't have the ups and downs of a property market all hinging on resource demand and pricing.

Hmmmm ...... its a no brainer really.


Originally Posted by Amazulu
Anyway, none of this changes the fact that apart from the lovely area around the harbour, Sydney is a shithole. Bondi? Gimme a break!
Yeah we went down this path earlier but if you want to keep going back to Bondi and leaving the rest alone then good for you.

At then end of the day Cottesloe beach has nothing going for it. Its restaurants are shit and the beach is bland. And if you put Bondi up against Glenelg, St Kilda and (what's the city beach in Brisbane? - Ah that's right they don't have one) then Bondi wins hands down, even though its natural beauty is at the bottom of the 100 or so other beaches in Sydney.
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Old Jan 10th 2018, 10:38 pm
  #251  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by the troubadour
Well you may come from a backwater with no CBD but city centres do rank as important features. Obviously the City of London, being a square mile an exception, but has a well defined centre. As I wrote Sydney's centre is rather ordinary. But if unused to big smokes I can see you may be blown away.
Melbourne's CBD has back lanes, Sydney CBD has waterfronts and back lanes for that matter. Tell me, what does any other Australian CBD have to offer?

Originally Posted by the troubadour
Well yes funnily enough so many of our prime are increasingly a struggle for average people to afford to live and no doubt less desirable with the smugness of those that believe in the virtue of high income equates a well balanced, intelligent populace, interesting environment type of city landscape.
If you want a property, buy where you can afford. If that means you don't want the 'burbs, then by an apartment. If you want the house, then move out to the 'burbs.

Housing can still be bought especially if you want to live in it, in any city in Australia.

Not everyone can have the 4 bed free stander within 10km of Circular Quay. Fact of life and this hasn't changed in 50 years.

My advice to you is pretty simple. Change yourself to change your wealth so you can afford the things you want rather than taking second best and complaining about it on this forum.


Originally Posted by the troubadour
We are not keeping immigration going the right way by a long shot. It is appeasing certain vested interest and lobby groups.....nothing for Bruce though.
Who?

Originally Posted by the troubadour
You really do have a complex of importance don't you? No idea where you get it from. A huge Sydney mortgage is nothing to crow about. Ski trips to Europe...boring.....just amazing you find it so impressive. I'd be more impressed if said was going for cultural/intellectual refreshment .......but there you are traipsing up Alps with thousands of other like minded people will have to surface I suppose.
Do what ever you want. You are the miserable under achiever. I am happy with my lot in life hence I don't complain.


Originally Posted by the troubadour
I think I'll pass on the real estate offer as well. Too far out for me, and Sydney when it corrects, if not sold out completely, something you cannot depend on the hue of Australian/ NSW governments not to go the whole hog and Honkers the city completely.
You should be used to a correction living in Perth.
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Old Jan 11th 2018, 12:40 pm
  #252  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by Beoz
Unless I cannot find it, which is quite possible as its a horrible website, the ABS (last reported in 2010-11) reports that the average salary for Sydney was $57,612 and Perth was $58,181. Darwin was $55,788. That's a long time ago toward the end of the mining boom.

I think you were looking at states, back in 2010-11. Even then, Seeks annual salary review of states has NSW outstripping WA in 2016, which is a surprise to me as I would have thought the boys on the big bucks up in the Pilbara would have taken the WA state average way away from NSW and the rest of Australia

https://www.seek.com.au/career-advic...ry-review-2016

Since then the census in 2016 reported Perth with a median weekly household income of $1,643 and Sydney with a median weekly household income of $1,750.

PayScale has Perth at $62,527 for an average salary while it has Sydney at $65,933




At the end of the day, just about everything in Sydney is cheaper than Perth except housing. If you consider a house as an investment, you know, like somewhere where you stick your money for a number of years like you would with your share portfolio, superannuation, etc, which market would you prefer that to be in?

Well let me see, a town riding on boom and bust cycles, where you can be in negative equity for years until the next boom, or somewhere that has more diversity in where its money comes from, somewhere that doesn't have the ups and downs of a property market all hinging on resource demand and pricing.

Hmmmm ...... its a no brainer really.




Yeah we went down this path earlier but if you want to keep going back to Bondi and leaving the rest alone then good for you.

At then end of the day Cottesloe beach has nothing going for it. Its restaurants are shit and the beach is bland. And if you put Bondi up against Glenelg, St Kilda and (what's the city beach in Brisbane? - Ah that's right they don't have one) then Bondi wins hands down, even though its natural beauty is at the bottom of the 100 or so other beaches in Sydney.
A 10 second Google search found these ABS stats from the middle of last year:
6302.0 - Average Weekly Earnings, Australia, May 2017

The cost of stuff around the major capital cities is pretty much the same when you look at prices across a variety of products and services - and any differences are minor - 5% or so (or only in the head of the opinion holder). So it may be cheaper to eat out and drink in Sydney but groceries, fuel, utilities, cars, consumer goods etc will be pretty much the same in Perth. Houses and rents are higher in Sydney, so those costs will be reflected in the overall COL

I don't like Sydney. End of. I didn't like it when I lived there in 1995 and like it even less today. I reckon it's overrated, overcrowded, dirty and full of people with an over-inflated opinion of themselves. Why anyone would pay $1.5 million to live in a shitbox there is beyond me, but each to their own. You obviously like it and that's cool but I'm not going to change my mind so any meaningful debate about the place is pointless. For what I do, I earn 30% more than I could earn in Sydney. For others this will be different but the above stats show that's not always the case. Even in the depths of the resource construction phase slump here, I was earning more than I could earn in NSW. The only other place where I could have a similar income and live a western lifestyle is Texas and I don't got a visa (although the UK is coming back into the picture)

I don't get involved in why houses cost what they do wherever they are as it's pointless and nobody in that debate really knows what they're talking about (opinions and assholes etc), so you're on your own there. But you're a big fan of renting anyway, so again, no point

Cottesloe Beach is pretty ordinary I agree (but better than Bondi), but I prefer beaches that I can drive on. I can set up my 4x4 awning, so plenty of shade, some comfy chairs to sit on and ice cold beer and cider from my Engel, have some nice, chilled food or even get the braai going. Awesome Australian living

Each to their own champ
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Old Jan 11th 2018, 8:56 pm
  #253  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by Amazulu
A 10 second Google search found these ABS stats from the middle of last year:
6302.0 - Average Weekly Earnings, Australia, May 2017
You are looking at state salaries, not cities, as I earlier pointed out.

WA is always bumped up by the boys pumping resources out of the ground outside Perth. eg Pilbara

Originally Posted by Amazulu
The cost of stuff around the major capital cities is pretty much the same when you look at prices across a variety of products and services - and any differences are minor - 5% or so (or only in the head of the opinion holder). So it may be cheaper to eat out and drink in Sydney but groceries, fuel, utilities, cars, consumer goods etc will be pretty much the same in Perth. Houses and rents are higher in Sydney, so those costs will be reflected in the overall COL

I don't like Sydney. End of. I didn't like it when I lived there in 1995 and like it even less today. I reckon it's overrated, overcrowded, dirty and full of people with an over-inflated opinion of themselves.
Like London, New York, Paris - like those mentioned they know its the best city in their country?


Originally Posted by Amazulu
Why anyone would pay $1.5 million to live in a shitbox there is beyond me, but each to their own.
Totally agree, why would any pay 1.5 to live in a shitbox. I paid a well under that for a 4 bed near the city and the beach.

Originally Posted by Amazulu
You obviously like it and that's cool but I'm not going to change my mind so any meaningful debate about the place is pointless. For what I do, I earn 30% more than I could earn in Sydney. For others this will be different but the above stats show that's not always the case. Even in the depths of the resource construction phase slump here, I was earning more than I could earn in NSW. The only other place where I could have a similar income and live a western lifestyle is Texas and I don't got a visa (although the UK is coming back into the picture)
But you didn't have a job during the depths of the slumps, like many others.

Originally Posted by Amazulu
I don't get involved in why houses cost what they do wherever they are as it's pointless and nobody in that debate really knows what they're talking about (opinions and assholes etc), so you're on your own there. But you're a big fan of renting anyway, so again, no point
I am a fan of renting, but I bought (the wife wanted a house to swim around in and we had the cash so I just invested). I swapped the rented harbour view for a house with no view but some beautiful marble fireplaces and a yard which needs constant bloody mowing and leaf blowing. I miss the view and the location somewhat (it was in the thick of it and I like thick of it), I like the new house, its got old charm, and the new area while quieter has a couple of pubs and still really central to the city and beach, but I hate the constant gardening. I'd take renting back if I could just to get rid of a garden.

Originally Posted by Amazulu
Cottesloe Beach is pretty ordinary I agree (but better than Bondi)
Hmmmm .... nup

Originally Posted by Amazulu
but I prefer beaches that I can drive on. I can set up my 4x4 awning, so plenty of shade, some comfy chairs to sit on and ice cold beer and cider from my Engel, have some nice, chilled food or even get the braai going. Awesome Australian living
Sounds nice but doesn't happen on city beaches I'm afraid .... champ.

Originally Posted by Amazulu
Each to their own champ
Very much so, I could never do the acreage in far outer suburbia. Yawn ZZZZZZ stuff
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Old Jan 11th 2018, 10:17 pm
  #254  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Originally Posted by Beoz
Melbourne's CBD has back lanes, Sydney CBD has waterfronts and back lanes for that matter. Tell me, what does any other Australian CBD have to offer?



If you want a property, buy where you can afford. If that means you don't want the 'burbs, then by an apartment. If you want the house, then move out to the 'burbs.

Housing can still be bought especially if you want to live in it, in any city in Australia.

Not everyone can have the 4 bed free stander within 10km of Circular Quay. Fact of life and this hasn't changed in 50 years.

My advice to you is pretty simple. Change yourself to change your wealth so you can afford the things you want rather than taking second best and complaining about it on this forum.




Who?



Do what ever you want. You are the miserable under achiever. I am happy with my lot in life hence I don't complain.




You should be used to a correction living in Perth.


Who, are the want to be Jonathon's and the 'look how big mine is mate' syndrome. Or alternatively how well I'm doing and important I am. Are you from a rather small and provincial location in England? I can see why Sydney may 'blow you away' , but as you have already been informed, outside of the harbour, a rather 'ordinary' city at the end of the day. But fine if you like it, but opinions that vary are just as valid, and sometimes those looking from the outside are better able to offer a non biased view with a lack of sentiment.
Of course, going into such a debt in a city with declining houses prices, you will need the reinforcement that you were not a total 'plonker' getting so out of depth with finances. Sydney a good investment? Ever heard of the London house decline during late 80's and into 90's? That was London, I repeat, an Alpha city, Sydney is not in that league ....


Nothing like personal insults when you lose an argument at every stance.
While your skiing exploits may well impress your public service outlaws in Tasmania, and your existence appears in light of this forum to impress and/or sabotage with ideological baggage, something thankfully less frequent than previously thank the lord.


By the way this under achiever had a gaff in Les Orres in the Hautes Alpes , if you care to look it up. Great in summer for hiking . Not a one trick pony.
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Old Jan 11th 2018, 10:29 pm
  #255  
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Default Re: Is Moving To Australia Still Worth It In 2017/18

Beoz and Zulu, it's good to see that each of you enjoys and appreciates where you live, you're both obviously doing very well and are happy. That's all that really matters. You do realise that you're not going to change each other's minds on Sydney vs Perth, don't you?
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