Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
Dec 25th 2013, 9:23 am
#1
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Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
We are about to use the doctors, some minor issues, but we will have to get a GP. Old age i guess. Now my friend, a native Ozzy told us that if you find a bulk biller, you will not be charged a cent, you only pay for your meds, your prescription, like the UK. We are PR.....But i walked into Ascot Medical Center, and the receptionist there, told me its $70 bucks to see the doc and i can claim half back on medicare. Now if they charge $70 minus $35 back, why would a bulk billing practice claim the full $70 bucks back for you, or do Doctor charges fluctuate?
I am looking for a bulk billing practice on the north side, Ascot, Hendra, Toombul areas..
Thanks for any feedback
I am looking for a bulk billing practice on the north side, Ascot, Hendra, Toombul areas..
Thanks for any feedback
Dec 25th 2013, 9:53 am
#2
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
We are about to use the doctors, some minor issues, but we will have to get a GP. Old age i guess. Now my friend, a native Ozzy told us that if you find a bulk biller, you will not be charged a cent, you only pay for your meds, your prescription, like the UK. We are PR.....But i walked into Ascot Medical Center, and the receptionist there, told me its $70 bucks to see the doc and i can claim half back on medicare. Now if they charge $70 minus $35 back, why would a bulk billing practice claim the full $70 bucks back for you, or do Doctor charges fluctuate?
I am looking for a bulk billing practice on the north side, Ascot, Hendra, Toombul areas..
Thanks for any feedback
I am looking for a bulk billing practice on the north side, Ascot, Hendra, Toombul areas..
Thanks for any feedback
Non bulk billing doctors can charge what they like and you pay the difference between their fee and the $36.30 that Medicare will contribute.
Bulk billing clinics will only receive the basic $36.30 from Medicare for seeing you - which is why lots of them employ cheaper doctors and rush through patients quickly. They can only be profitable if they see lots of people in a short time.
Dec 25th 2013, 10:29 am
#3
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
My GP practice is not a bulk billing practice usually (except for under 16s and over 65s). However I rarely go to the doctor and the last couple of times I've been he's bulk billed me. I gues their policy is that if it's something really serious or an urgent thing they bulk bill. Come to think of it, they bulk billed my son yesterday when he had to go for a medical for a program he's entering over east.
Maybe I just got lucky.
. Either way, I don't mind paying $30-40 if it means I can spend more than 3 minutes with the doctor.
Maybe I just got lucky.
. Either way, I don't mind paying $30-40 if it means I can spend more than 3 minutes with the doctor.
Dec 25th 2013, 10:49 am
#4
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
Medicare pay fixed, scheduled fees for every type of service. Currently that's $36.30 for a short consultation.
Non bulk billing doctors can charge what they like and you pay the difference between their fee and the $36.30 that Medicare will contribute.
Bulk billing clinics will only receive the basic $36.30 from Medicare for seeing you - which is why lots of them employ cheaper doctors and rush through patients quickly. They can only be profitable if they see lots of people in a short time.
Non bulk billing doctors can charge what they like and you pay the difference between their fee and the $36.30 that Medicare will contribute.
Bulk billing clinics will only receive the basic $36.30 from Medicare for seeing you - which is why lots of them employ cheaper doctors and rush through patients quickly. They can only be profitable if they see lots of people in a short time.
Dec 25th 2013, 10:51 am
#5
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
Cheers
Dec 25th 2013, 11:14 am
#6
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
Our local practice bulk bills people with a Centrelink "blue" card, age, disability etc, but charges a fee to other categories.
I receive excellent treatment - certainly far more thorough and "holistic" than my non-bulk billing practice on Bribie Island when I lived there.
Edit: our mob usually allow about 15 mins per patient and if you have more than one medical condition, you can book in for a long consultation, where they get a double rebate from Medicare. I get the impression that the quick visits for script renewals (for example blood pressure medication is supposed to be prescribed for with repeat scripts no more than 3 months as your condition could change) outweigh the serious consultations, so it's quite common for a "serious" case to spend half an hour with the doc. Swings / roundabouts.
Some practices bulk bill but charge a "top up", say $5, and others don't bulk bill at all.
Our practice has a resident couple of nurses who do most of the drudge work like vaccinations, dressings, ear syringing etc and the whole thing runs smoothly. As with the UK if it's more serious than just handing you a prescription you get referred to a specialist anyway. With specialists (for example our local eye clinic) you get slugged about $100 for your first visit but get the Medicare rebate. Quite often for follow ups or to go in to discuss test results they charge a much lower rate so after Medicare rebate you aren't out of pocket much.
I receive excellent treatment - certainly far more thorough and "holistic" than my non-bulk billing practice on Bribie Island when I lived there.
Edit: our mob usually allow about 15 mins per patient and if you have more than one medical condition, you can book in for a long consultation, where they get a double rebate from Medicare. I get the impression that the quick visits for script renewals (for example blood pressure medication is supposed to be prescribed for with repeat scripts no more than 3 months as your condition could change) outweigh the serious consultations, so it's quite common for a "serious" case to spend half an hour with the doc. Swings / roundabouts.
Some practices bulk bill but charge a "top up", say $5, and others don't bulk bill at all.
Our practice has a resident couple of nurses who do most of the drudge work like vaccinations, dressings, ear syringing etc and the whole thing runs smoothly. As with the UK if it's more serious than just handing you a prescription you get referred to a specialist anyway. With specialists (for example our local eye clinic) you get slugged about $100 for your first visit but get the Medicare rebate. Quite often for follow ups or to go in to discuss test results they charge a much lower rate so after Medicare rebate you aren't out of pocket much.
Last edited by Mike at Taree; Dec 25th 2013 at 11:21 am.
Dec 25th 2013, 11:24 am
#7
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
Our local practice bulk bills people with a Centrelink "blue" card, age, disability etc, but charges a fee to other categories.
I receive excellent treatment - certainly far more thorough and "holistic" than my non-bulk billing practice on Bribie Island when I lived there.
Edit: our mob usually allow about 15 mins per patient and if you have more than one medical condition, you can book in for a long consultation, where they get a double rebate from Medicare. I get the impression that the quick visits for script renewals (for example blood pressure medication is supposed to be prescribed for with repeat scripts no more than 3 months as your condition could change) outweigh the serious consultations, so it's quite common for a "serious" case to spend half an hour with the doc. Swings / roundabouts.
Some practices bulk bill but charge a "top up", say $5, and others don't bulk bill at all.
Our practice has a resident couple of nurses who do most of the drudge work like vaccinations, dressings, ear syringing etc and the whole thing runs smoothly. As with the UK if it's more serious than just handing you a prescription you get referred to a specialist anyway. With specialists (for example our local eye clinic) you get slugged about $100 for your first visit but get the Medicare rebate. Quite often for follow ups or to go in to discuss test results they charge a much lower rate so after Medicare rebate you aren't out of pocket much.
I receive excellent treatment - certainly far more thorough and "holistic" than my non-bulk billing practice on Bribie Island when I lived there.
Edit: our mob usually allow about 15 mins per patient and if you have more than one medical condition, you can book in for a long consultation, where they get a double rebate from Medicare. I get the impression that the quick visits for script renewals (for example blood pressure medication is supposed to be prescribed for with repeat scripts no more than 3 months as your condition could change) outweigh the serious consultations, so it's quite common for a "serious" case to spend half an hour with the doc. Swings / roundabouts.
Some practices bulk bill but charge a "top up", say $5, and others don't bulk bill at all.
Our practice has a resident couple of nurses who do most of the drudge work like vaccinations, dressings, ear syringing etc and the whole thing runs smoothly. As with the UK if it's more serious than just handing you a prescription you get referred to a specialist anyway. With specialists (for example our local eye clinic) you get slugged about $100 for your first visit but get the Medicare rebate. Quite often for follow ups or to go in to discuss test results they charge a much lower rate so after Medicare rebate you aren't out of pocket much.
Dec 25th 2013, 9:53 pm
#8
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
Consultations longer than 15 minutes result in a higher payment from Medicare. I'm with a bulk billing practice and I have never had anything but the best of care from the doctors I see and have never ever felt that a consultation has been "rushed".
Dec 25th 2013, 10:21 pm
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
I couldn't find the current Medicare rebates for Doctor consultations on the Medicare site, but I found this on a medical practitioners web site. The rebates listed are for 2013
Consultation Medicare Rebate
✤ Short (<5 mins) $16.60
✤ Standard (10-15 mins) $36.30
✤ Long (20-30 mins) $70.30
✤ Prolonged (>45 mins) $103.50
As you can see, the bulk billing Doctor is actually better off extending the length of the consultation, not shortening it.
4 x 15 minute consultations @ $36.30 = $145.20
3 x 20 minute consultations @ $70.30 = $210.90
An extra $65 per hour for seeing less people and doing less work.
Consultation Medicare Rebate
✤ Short (<5 mins) $16.60
✤ Standard (10-15 mins) $36.30
✤ Long (20-30 mins) $70.30
✤ Prolonged (>45 mins) $103.50
As you can see, the bulk billing Doctor is actually better off extending the length of the consultation, not shortening it.
4 x 15 minute consultations @ $36.30 = $145.20
3 x 20 minute consultations @ $70.30 = $210.90
An extra $65 per hour for seeing less people and doing less work.
Last edited by Hino; Dec 25th 2013 at 10:23 pm.
Dec 25th 2013, 11:18 pm
#10
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Location: Sydney beachside
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
I couldn't find the current Medicare rebates for Doctor consultations on the Medicare site, but I found this on a medical practitioners web site. The rebates listed are for 2013
Consultation Medicare Rebate
✤ Short (<5 mins) $16.60
✤ Standard (10-15 mins) $36.30
✤ Long (20-30 mins) $70.30
✤ Prolonged (>45 mins) $103.50
As you can see, the bulk billing Doctor is actually better off extending the length of the consultation, not shortening it.
4 x 15 minute consultations @ $36.30 = $145.20
3 x 20 minute consultations @ $70.30 = $210.90
An extra $65 per hour for seeing less people and doing less work.
Consultation Medicare Rebate
✤ Short (<5 mins) $16.60
✤ Standard (10-15 mins) $36.30
✤ Long (20-30 mins) $70.30
✤ Prolonged (>45 mins) $103.50
As you can see, the bulk billing Doctor is actually better off extending the length of the consultation, not shortening it.
4 x 15 minute consultations @ $36.30 = $145.20
3 x 20 minute consultations @ $70.30 = $210.90
An extra $65 per hour for seeing less people and doing less work.
Any doctor who billed more than the 'normal' percentage of long consultations vs short ones would be checked out quick-smart.
Medicare aren't stupid. They'd know if they were ripped-off if every consultation was a long one.
Dec 26th 2013, 12:52 am
#11
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Location: Blue Mountains, NSW
Posts: 5,523
Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
As you can see, the bulk billing Doctor is actually better off extending the length of the consultation, not shortening it.
4 x 15 minute consultations @ $36.30 = $145.20
3 x 20 minute consultations @ $70.30 = $210.90
An extra $65 per hour for seeing less people and doing less work.
As you can see, the bulk billing Doctor is actually better off doing the minimum time possible to qualify for a standard consultation.
Dec 26th 2013, 1:01 am
#12
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
When I worked in IT for Medicare years ago in Canberra, they had a very well organised Fraud department whose sole job was to investigate 'over-servicing' doctors (and the like). Doctors who were guilty would lose their Provider number and be unable to use the system.
Any doctor who billed more than the 'normal' percentage of long consultations vs short ones would be checked out quick-smart.
Medicare aren't stupid. They'd know if they were ripped-off if every consultation was a long one.
Any doctor who billed more than the 'normal' percentage of long consultations vs short ones would be checked out quick-smart.
Medicare aren't stupid. They'd know if they were ripped-off if every consultation was a long one.
I'm very surprised that anyone who is aware of Medicare's monitoring of the system and their determination to provide the best outcome for the patient, would be foolish enough to suggest that bulk billing practices are either routinely defrauding the system or failing to provide full service to the patient.
Have a good one
Last edited by Hino; Dec 26th 2013 at 1:48 am.
Dec 26th 2013, 1:17 am
#13
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
By seeing six patients per hour instead of three, the practice will gain an extra $6 in rebate...???
Minus the cost of the staff hours to process the extra paperwork to claim the rebate, minus the extra cost of accountant and bookkeeping fees, minus the cost of the paper and printer ink to print out the receipts and including the strong possibility of a Medicare investigation to determine why so many patients only need such a short consultation.
It would seem to be an awful lot of both extra work, and associated risk of investigation by Medicare, for a lousy $6 per hour...or $1 per patient.
Last edited by Hino; Dec 26th 2013 at 1:51 am.
Dec 26th 2013, 2:13 am
#14
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
Oh yes....I didn't consider that option
By seeing six patients per hour instead of three, the practice will gain an extra $6 in rebate...???
Minus the cost of the staff hours to process the extra paperwork to claim the rebate, minus the extra cost of accountant and bookkeeping fees, minus the cost of the paper and printer ink to print out the receipts and including the strong possibility of a Medicare investigation to determine why so many patients only need such a short consultation.
It would seem to be an awful lot of both extra work, and associated risk of investigation by Medicare, for a lousy $6 per hour...or $1 per patient.
By seeing six patients per hour instead of three, the practice will gain an extra $6 in rebate...???
Minus the cost of the staff hours to process the extra paperwork to claim the rebate, minus the extra cost of accountant and bookkeeping fees, minus the cost of the paper and printer ink to print out the receipts and including the strong possibility of a Medicare investigation to determine why so many patients only need such a short consultation.
It would seem to be an awful lot of both extra work, and associated risk of investigation by Medicare, for a lousy $6 per hour...or $1 per patient.
From a personal perspective, I use both bulk billing and non-bulk billing services within the same practice (I'm on a diabetes management plan so all appointments to do with that, no matter how tenuous, are bulk billed and anything else isn't) and find no difference in how I'm treated (obviously, it's the same doctor) or how long I can sit and burble away to him
Never felt rushed apart from when I saw my surgeon for a post surgery check up (which, incidentally, was included in the cost of the surgery) but he was a bit busy, bless him.
Dec 26th 2013, 2:49 am
#15
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Re: Doctors Fee's and Bulk Billing
Yeah... but it's not quite as cut and dried as you kind of implied in your previous post.
From a personal perspective, I use both bulk billing and non-bulk billing services within the same practice (I'm on a diabetes management plan so all appointments to do with that, no matter how tenuous, are bulk billed and anything else isn't) and find no difference in how I'm treated (obviously, it's the same doctor) or how long I can sit and burble away to him
Never felt rushed apart from when I saw my surgeon for a post surgery check up (which, incidentally, was included in the cost of the surgery) but he was a bit busy, bless him.
From a personal perspective, I use both bulk billing and non-bulk billing services within the same practice (I'm on a diabetes management plan so all appointments to do with that, no matter how tenuous, are bulk billed and anything else isn't) and find no difference in how I'm treated (obviously, it's the same doctor) or how long I can sit and burble away to him
Never felt rushed apart from when I saw my surgeon for a post surgery check up (which, incidentally, was included in the cost of the surgery) but he was a bit busy, bless him.
I was replying to the post that implied that bulk billing practices were somehow ripping off the patient by operating a 'revolving door' policy towards their patients and depriving them of the treatment they needed.
The only 'point' I was trying to make, is that a bulk billing practice has absolutely no incentive to speed-up the patients consultation. I wasn't having a dig at you
Like you I've been very happy with my GP, especially as I'm now bulk billed on almost everything.....just don't get me started on surgeons...
I hope that you are fully recovered