ozzieeagle

Should have ordered 250KG of peat off of her then At least we left the peat


Personally I see the Irish thing as a bitter long standing dispute between first cousins.

Swerv-o

I must admit, it was the first time that it had ever happened, but it has left me a little wary of the Irish from that point on. Such deep seated resentment can't possibly be good.

I think the main take-away from the famine is that crop variation is a good idea - having a country all growing the same variety is bound to end in tears if there is a disease. So as it's my fault, I am going to accept full credit for the science of crop variation and rotation. Sound fair?


S

ozzieeagle

Yehp definitely fair.

Beoz

And that was exactly my point when I said "Britain does not have the problem so really isn't in a position to judge the complexity of it." So thanks for confirming it.

BadgeIsBack

That's alright. It was Chris I thought who was making a point and drew me to comment.

I'm not bothered - what I meant though, in another point, that it was Britain who sent out it's people to Australia. So not to judge, looking at Australia itself, or with the same problem, but maybe a causal factor in managing other colonies.

Beoz

..... and exactly my point too. Its a little unfair to blame Australians of today on the plight of Aborigines. The good news is of course colonization by those countries who practised in it centuries ago has now ceased.

Amazulu

Colonisation was super cool

Big fan of powerful nations sailing round the world, kicking the door in and making the locals their bitches

Colonisation was the UK's finest hour

Beoz

Slavery was better

LeeChong

But, isn't the point that current generations (either in UK or Australia), and whether responsible or not for the acts of their ancestors (probably not) continue to benefit from the acts of our ancestors. Whilst slavery, colonialism and sometimes genocide are things of the past the fact remains that white English societies have infrastructure and wealth which owes a lot to previous activities. And the destruction of indigenous societies and kingdoms clearly leaves a cultural impact that takes generations to disappear.

Beoz

Yep they do benefit. Ask the Chinese in Singapore if they feel they have benefited by the acts of their ancestors.

LeeChong

So morally, if one knowingly profits on the back of ill-gotten gains, at the expense of the original victims and their descendants, it is perhaps arguable that one is also morally responsible for the victims descendants continuing plight? (Not directing that at anyone personally of course, it applies equally to me as a White Englishman).

As an aside - my history of China / Singapore is virtually nil - what happened there?

Beoz

As for your first question, well that all depends if you want to accept responsibility for your ancestors. Some will some won't. What do I think? Well history is history. No point dwelling. Onwards and upwards for all.

Amazulu

whatever floats your boat champ

I'll stick with colonisation

LeeChong

But, if someone had forcibly taken your family's property or land and even perhaps killed your family members, at what point would that become history for you?

Personally I suspect that if I were a victim, or a descendent thereof, it would not be quite so easy to take the philosophical point of view that it was all just history until some considerable time had passed.

Hence I am no longer outraged by the roman conquest of Saxon England, as it was a very long time ago, but if I were a resident of a very poor country that was formerly a colony, and I saw that the coloniser or slaver had grown rich on the back of that I might conclude there is little justice in the situation, and it's not just history.

chris955

Sometimes you just have to draw a line under it and move on, it was 100's of years ago and really isnt relevant to anyone alive or their recent relatives. By all means complain about their treatment now. This is why I didnt agree with The Apology, what did it achieve?