smallbeagle

Hi there, we have just lodged an application for a temporary visa (457) and realise that we have to pay the schools fees. We have shortlisted some public schools and private schools (primary) and was wondering if anyone out there know anything about these schools: based on academic results, sports, art, behavioural control, discipline etc.

Private:
Currambena
Forestville Montessori
John Colet
Kinma
Northside Montessori
Ravenswood
Wenona
Queenswood


Public:
Castle Cove
Chatswood
Gordon West
Killara
Lane Cove
Willoughby
Lindfield
Wahroonga
Turramurra
Mosman
Roseville.

Thanking you all in advance.

Cheers,

michdp

I have a friend whose son is at Forestville Montessori & is very happy with it. I'm not sure on the academic results etc. though...

One tip when you choose a private school is consider how far you want to travel to the school e.g. my son is at Pittwater House on the Northern Beaches & his classmates travel from all around to school (we live just 4 mins drive!). I have friends in the school who drive 30 mins to school & are getting fed up with the drive!!

On the public (state) schools, you might want to check but when we looked at schools here before we moved, a lot have local catchment areas so you may not be able to get your kids into the school you want if you live outside the area anyway.

When we moved here we looked at a number of schools, private & public, & ended up going private because we hadn't found a house at that point & didn't want our son to keep moving schools once we arrived (i.e. from initial rental house to permanent rental house to purchased house!! potentially, three different schools in a year or so).

Good luck with your decision...

michdp

Actually just one more thought...private schools here tend to follow the British model - quite traditional (for Australia!) & good discipline. With state schools, I think it really depends on the area, like British schools... if it's a good area, it's likely to be a good school. I don't think you can get results tables here or Ofsted type reports, like you can in the UK to gauge how good a school is... you really have to visit them & get a feel for them & the community..

smallbeagle

Thank you Michdip. Nice to know that the private schools are somewhat similar to British model. We are trying to choose a school first before we move. Hubby's work will be in Chatswood and like you say I wouldn't want to drive to far to school. Ideally I would like to walk!!

By the way, do you have to have more as overseas student in private schools? I notice that some schools mention that.

And what do you think of the annual reports which also touch on the performance of the various classes? Not independent but at least there is something to base on?

michdp

Smallbeagle

I'm not sure about how much you pay because we're residents so we pay the school fees that Aussies pay (I think our friends who aren't residents pay the same school fees in the private school sector?) . You have to pay fees for the state schools as well, I think, if you're not a resident (although obviously much less than private school fees!).

To be honest, when we looked at schools here & having talked to people about schools, I don't think the reports count for much because they are not generated by a government-regulated body (unlike UK). Standards differ from school to school. I too agonised over finding the best school before I arrived but actually, ended up choosing one based on facilities, feel, ethos, class sizes & HSC results (although of course, like anywhere, the schools can skew the figures to represent what they want!).

One thing we found startling with some of the private schools was the size of the classes: 20 -26 in a lot of them (the same size as my son's state primary school in the UK). In the end, that was also a factor in our choice. My son has a class size of 11 in year 1. I think the school's policy is for a maximum of 18 per class.

If you can afford to, I would consider sending your child to a private school here. Like anywhere, the state school system is under tremendous pressure whereas the private sector has money to fund great facilities & small teacher to pupil ratios. I've have a couple of sets of friends who tried the State system & moved to private schools after a year. Many Aussies we know send their kids privately at 11 & to state schools until then so it really depends on your views, disposable income etc.

You certainly meet more people locally if you go the State route. As I said earlier, kids come from all over North Sydney to my son's school. We have made friends there but it has been very different to my son's village school in Surrey where you knew everyone & the kids all played at each others houses etc. We've made local friends here through sports teams etc. & ultimately, I think that's where our close friends will come from because you're sitting on the side of a rugby pitch/criket pitch/nippers every weekend & you live round the corner from each other...

Lots of things to think about...! IF you have any more questions, feel free to ask!

Trax

Hi

My 2 girls go to Ravenswood ((Junior school) - have been there since Feb. We saw several other private and public schools, in 2 visits to Australia, and it was our favourite both times. Fantastic facilities - pool, tennis courts, auditorium - very good HSC results, especially since it is a non selective school. It has a very good reputation for its pastoral care.

My friend's kids go to John Collet, and she is very happy with it. The fees are much lower, and it is much smaller. One thing to bear in mind is that it is a Vegetarian school (i.e. no beef crisps allowed!) Didn't bother me, but my husband found it hard to comprehend! The headmaster is very nice too.

Of the other schools we saw, the other we did like was Roseville College (private). Quite similar to Ravenswood.

Wahroonga Public (called the Bush school) has a fairly good reputation, but there is definitely a difference between the public and private schools here.

To be honest most public schools on the North Shore are of a high standard anyhow.

Hope this is of help - please feel free to pm me if you want anymore info. Any idea where you are planning to live - or is this dependent on the school?

Trax

Sandra

I agree - I personally prefer state schools, but then I also planned to live in a good area so my children can attend the local one, for me this is St Ives

On your list Killara stands out - it is the number 1 in NSW. Lists are published in the papers once a year and available in the libraries based on different criteria for all schools. But like others have said it is personal choice for your children, some will be happy in one school more than another.

The other thing to possibly consider depending on the ages of your chidren is the exams they will be sitting and if and where you travel after your stint in Australia. They only do six years high school here, four and sit the School certificate (nothing much bit of paper) and two years doing HSC and possibly University entrance level criteria - depends on the subjects chosen and the level whether you get accepted, it is called UAI. If you intend moving you might like to look at schools that do Interational Baculaurate exams - IBG?. Worth a search.

Also if your primary school children are bright you might like them at a school that does some form of selection or streamng to help them on - you just need to ask at the primary you are looking at. The kids can sit an exam around the end of Year four and then might get a place in a selective class but if not done at the school they might have to move. Artamon is one primary that comes to mind that offers streaming.

On a 457 the selective places at schools such as North Sydney Boys and Normanhurst or Sydney Girls will not be available to you. (Sort of like getting a place at Grammer School).

Lots of your choice will depend on your kids obviously and possibly your future plans. I would also add that even if they end up in school here for only a few years the change and the challenge will surely enrich their education wherever you choose to send them.

Good luck - if your decide to go private or not, check carefully the support being offered by your company about expensing the fees, even the 4500 per child for state (higher for HSC students, year 11 and 12) they should at least be offering you these as part of your LAFHA. Remembering though the LAFHA is not available the minute you put in a full PR application.

Best of Luck

smallbeagle

Thanks Sandra, Trax and Michdp for your views. It is certainly very difficult to decide especially when we are still over here and not there in Australia.

We want the best for our children both academically and socially. We are very lucky here as our local school is very good and our children's social circle is excellent. Ideally, we would like to send our two daughters to a local state school and it's a better way to assimilate in a new place. But we do not want to compromise their education either.

I am a bit concerned though Sandra when you mentioned that on 457 selective schools are not available to us. We hope to apply for PR at the end of 3 years to take advantage of LAHFA. Daughter is only 4.5 now and year 7 is still a long way away. Hopefully applying for a PR won't be too difficult. Can one stay on 457 indefintely?

Sandra, what do you like about St Ives public? We will consider living in St Ives too. Our original idea was to find somewhere near the railway track but would cosider anywhere that is nice and good for schools.

Trax, you are right. I would like to get some ideas about schools first then find a place to live. Do not fancy driving too far to school. In fact, would like to walk to school if it is at all possible.

Streaming: do they do that at private schools? My daughter who's just started reception is already reading and writing. She's quite advanced in her class and would not hurt if school offers streaming, either private or public.

Kindergarten: Do you know if their kindergarten is similar to reception here? Well receptions are so different even here. Would they start them on reading, writing and maths ? My daughter is doing subtraction now.

Other activities: Is swimming, gymnastics, dancing part of the extra curricular offered at public schools? To infants (K,1,2) as well?

Nursery and Preschool: I have a 2 year old. How do you go about finding a good nursery on the shore? Are they regulated? Do I have to put her name down for preschool now?

Oh dear...so many questions!!!!!! Thanks everyone.....

Sandra

I mentioned the fact that certain 'grammer' style state schools are not availible - but as you have now stated the age of your kids I don't think you have a thing to worry about

We came over on a 457 and got our PR a year later, our son was in year 7 and pretty bright, we thought about getting him to sit the exams but by the time he was eligible he had already settled in St Ives and they have a GAT (Gifted and Talented - school have different names) stream to help the more academic so it wasn't an issue.

What do I like about St Ives - totally personal opinion of course, I wanted to live in the same area as my children went to school. The private schools in this area cost in the region of $15K plus and although we came on a 457 the fees were not part of my package so 4500 per child paid through LAFHA (tax saving) was a better option for us.

St Ives has a good reputation as a public school, it also has a deaf unit and my daughter (not at high school when we came over) is partially deaf, always at main stream, I thought they would be more understanding.

My son is finishing year 10 (young for the year only 15) and is excelling, he has already passed his school certificate without the exam (for what it is worth). He is planning his HSC and although he plans to be a chef is making sure his UAI will be an option.

Without getting into a lot of personal stuff, I do not think you get a better education paying private. I feel the fees are just the beginning and the extra curricular is as much a part of school life, we would have been putting ourselves into alot of debt to pay for private schooling. The support you give your children is the important factor for me and the school of choice can play a part - but it is not the be all.

Depending on your religious beliefs you might also look at the teachings within the schools. I understand private Catholic schools are cheaper but didn''t feel this fitted with our life choices.

I will add I have been told that the school you go to can mean an awful lot in Sydney....like most places money can talk. There is a snob value in sending ones kids to the right school and it comes out a little more on the North Shore, but honestly by the time you are out working and travelling and living life does anyone really care which private school I went to in Belfast.

I promised myself I would not go on, so apoligies for my slight soap box stance. You have loads of time to make choices and because you care so much you are going to make the right choices for your children - don't worry too much.

I worked in Chatswood, now down in the city. St Ives suits us but can't say it is for all and can be a little snobbish at times. In terms of child care - start looking now for the wee ones there can be long waiting lists.

PM me if you need any individual questions answered - personal opinion only guaranteed.

Cheers Sandra