littlebrit

Hi I'm new on this forum.

My husband is South African and after 10 years abroad (during which time he met me, we got married and had a baby) he's very homesick and wants to move home to Johannesburg. I'm British and have never lived in Africa. I've lived overseas, but it was Europe and North America.

He has a job offer and he'd be working in Joburg's northern suburbs.

I'd love advice about meeting people, day-to-day life (yes, security is a worry for me), and adapting to the new lifestyle.

Thanks

Bijilo123

Yes, you'll get plenty of advice about living there but it is valid to declare if you are black or white because the nature of the advice will differ I think.

Over to you but irt is a very challenging place to go to.

Gd luck - very good luck tho.

Pablo

...Then I fear you're going to spend an awful lot of your time there being worried.

littlebrit

To clarify: I'm a British white female in my 30s.

The crime is a big worry for me. I am used to walking everywhere with my baby in the buggy. We currently live in UK (London suburbs). I dislike driving.

Pugsy

Well, I left SA 10 years ago, with hubby and baby, because of a home invasion in the affluent northern suburbs. This was after years and years of watching our backs, living in fear, being hijacked, witnessing shootings, bank robberies, being mugged, burglaries, car theft and having countless friends die on lawless SA roads, some killed and injured through crime. Yes, we rationalised it, we were in denial, we thought it was normal. Believe me, it's very easy to delude yourself, we did it for years and I still have relatives there that do the same.

Plus now you have to deal with high house prices (10 years ago property was cheap in ££'s, but no longer). Power cuts? Ridiculous interest rates. High cost of living. It's not getting better, it's getting worse and a worldwide economic crunch will impact still further on crime.

Day to day life, we lived like prisoners inside our properties, nice though they were, we didn't even feel safe in our gardens or our beds. As kids, we never went to the park, never walked anywhere, never pushed our brother around in his pram, except inside a mall, never rode bikes or rollerbladed on the street. We missed out on alot and by the age of 13, I was fully aware of the crime which is not a good thing, I cherish my kids innocence and I can't think of anything worse than raising a child in SA, particularly Jhb, I really can't.

However, that's just me. I think what you should do is start googling all the SA news websites and keep up to date with what is actually going on. Only then can you decide if it is a life that you would be happy to lead. You might want to ask yourself, what is the benefit? The price is may be your freedom, safety and peace of mind, but what is the gain, is it big enough? If you keep an eye on this forum and others you find, you may notice that most people are going or trying to go the opposite way to you.

Some sobering reading from another victim.

http://www.news24.com/News24/South_A...300858,00.html

Daxk

Hi Littlebrit.
If you dont like driving you have a problem.
You cannot be without a car in SA as there is no public transport system to speak of, Taxi's are mostly Mini bus where they cram 20plus into and have a high accident rate.

I have a 9 year old daughter who witnessed our Armed home invasion, There is no amount of money or promise that would allow me to take her back to SA.
Kindly ask your husband why, when everyones trying to get off the Titanic, he insists on buying a ticket?

newkiwi

You will absolutely have to get over your dislike for driving, you will need a car for yourself and one for your husband. Take that as a given.
I lived in Northcliff before, (about 8-9 years ago) it was a nice suburb. Traffic was a nightmare though, especially getting into Sandton.
As for walking around, you will find people dont do that in south africa, not only because fo security issues, but because in the suburbs is is just too sprawled to do that, and in the city centres, it is because of security concerns. so people drive to malls and do their shopping and socialising there. Maybe a little sad but that is how it is. Mentally prepare yourself for not walking anywhere.

in terms of meeting people, it may take a little time, you will probalby find people tend to entertaiin at home. Maybe there are some mums-n-tots groups, i dont know. Does your husband still have contact with friends from south africa. Does he have a british passport in cae it all goes tits up and you want to return to Britain quickly?...

As far as security goes, you will need to find a place to live in a security complex as a minimum.

I think it is worth reading the newspapers etc online to give you a flavour of what is going on. try the following links

news24.co.za
mg.co.za
sundaytimes.co.za
carteblance.co.za (a south african current afairs programme)

personally i would not move back to south africa, although i do miss family/ friend / some of the familiarity. But it is probalby hard enough of a decision for you so im happy to give you advice as good as i can. Ten years is a long time though, has your husband been back recently to visit/ compare south africa now with what it was when he left.

best of luck...

Pablo

I too lived in the Northcliff area. I loved it. But how it was then, and how it is now, are two different things.

Ken Kirsten returned to SA after being away for 8 years,and was gunned down while walking his dog.

http://www.thestar.co.za/index.php?fArticleId=3198026

littlebrit

Yes my husband has a UK passport and we will rent out our London house so that if we have to come back, we can.

I will get fat if I don't walk - it's my only exercise! I walk 4-5km a day, going to baby groups, cafes, the shops, swimming with my baby. I don't relish the prospect of having to drive everywhere but I guess I will get used to it.

My main concern is definitely the crime. My husband's family say they feel perfectly safe in their day-to-day lives. Of course they take precautions that in the UK we don't have to take, but they are used to it and they say I will get used to it as well.

My husband does not have all that many friends in SA. Many of them have left, including his siblings. His mum is really the only person he intends seeing regularly, once we move there.

Thanks everyone for your replies. It's very hard to find objective views on the crime situation. On the one hand people there are telling me not to worry, yet many of the SA expats I've met would be scared to go back.

Pablo

Sorry to be blunt, but this is just untrue - objectively. You are being lied to. Or, to be charitable, their feelings are out of sync with reality.

Bijilo123

Pablo is right and I fear from your replies that you might be denying or a little unrealistic. You can't go out walking regularly and survive.

Pugsy

Many SA resident families splinter due to reasons of crime/economy/employment, mostly crime though. So of course they are telling you not to worry, they are playing it down. I'm sure they cannot believe their luck and are exited at the prospect of you going to live there. After saying goodbye to so many friends and family, who wouldn't!? But... what is best for you as a 3-unit family. That is a question no one but yourselves can figure out.

I would never go back, never take my little ones. I never want to live in fear again. Sadly most opinions you receive of SA, objective or not, will be negative.

whalewatcher

I never drove nor owned a car in he UK. I got a licence, but was always nervous about traffic. In SA there was no choice. I learned to drive in the Kruger Park! It has the safest roads in SA, and you learn to reverse quickly in the face of oncoming elephants.

Now after ten years of experience of the South African roads I find British roads are an absolute pleasure. So civilised, like going to an afternoon tea-dance after an all-night death metal concert.

But the reality is, your day-to-day risk on the road is as great as that of violent crime. SA drivers are insane.

whalewatcher

I got used to it, but after a while started to resent it. It was such a relief to come home to the UK (or go anywhere outside of SA) and not have it. Felt like going back to a sort of huge prison camp.

newkiwi

I suppose it is more likely to feel normal about the crime/ security situation if you have always lived in south africa, as you see that as just the way it is. It will take getting used to for you not having lived in south africa (locking car doors when driving, never having bags in sight inside a car when you stop at traffic lights, taking note of people by the side of the road in hijack hotspots sites. small things if youre living in south africa but something you would not be used to moving from abroad.

in terms of feedback, you will be getting two sides of the story. people who left did so for whatever reason, often related to crime/ economic instability. people still in south africa havent left, so will be more positive. I guess if you asked people who moved out of london to the countryside their views of london you will get negative responses, whilst if you ask those living in belgravia their views it will be more positive. same sort of thing, only more intense because a number of people left south africa after being victims of quite serious crimes.

best to get as much research and views to enable you to take an informed view. Views on crime is almost by definition going to be subjective, fine if its never happened to you and appalling if it has.

have you visited there with your husband before?