ACCA to ICAA

Old Jun 16th 2007, 5:30 pm
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Question ACCA to ICAA

Hi,

I just had my ACCA finals and will hopefully be fully qualified with 4yrs "big 4" experience in October 2007 . Has anyone moved to australia after completing ACCA or knows how long it takes to "localise" the qualification?

So far i only found out that i'll need to apply for a skills and entry assesment to the ICAA and then complete the Tax and Law bridge exams, this seems simple enough.... but what afterwards? how many more exams are required and how many more years of additional practical experience are needed?

I really do fancy a change from audit :curse: and would like to work in industry, how easy is it to find an "accredited" employer? I'd presume any listed company would be fine?

Also does anyone know how my "chances" would stand, i.e. would i apply for a position which requires someone CA/CPA qualified and then explain to them that i am qualified in the UK but need x number of years to be ICAA, or would you recommed to go for a part-qualified position?

I fould a lot of interesting and helpfull info in this forum and hope that this will continue

P.s. in terms of visa requirements, i should be ok for independant permanent resident status.
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Old Jun 16th 2007, 5:43 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

Originally Posted by oksana21
Hi,
I just had my ACCA finals and will hopefully be fully qualified with 4yrs "big 4" experience in October 2007 . Has anyone moved to australia after completing ACCA or knows how long it takes to "localise" the qualification?

So far i only found out that i'll need to apply for a skills and entry assesment to the ICAA and then complete the Tax and Law bridge exams, this seems simple enough.... but what afterwards? how many more exams are required and how many more years of additional practical experience are needed?
If you are ACCA qualified, you will also need to do the CA Program in order to become an Australian CA. You will also need around 3 years experience in Australia under the supervision of an Australian CA (or equivalent such as an English or New Zealand CA).


I really do fancy a change from audit :curse: and would like to work in industry, how easy is it to find an "accredited" employer? I'd presume any listed company would be fine?
Most larger companies are accredited by the ICAA. The Australian CAs are more flexible about training outside practice than is the case in many peer institutes.


Also does anyone know how my "chances" would stand, i.e. would i apply for a position which requires someone CA/CPA qualified and then explain to them that i am qualified in the UK but need x number of years to be ICAA, or would you recommed to go for a part-qualified position?
You should aim your sights as high as you can. Explain that ACCA is CPA equivalent but not fully recognised for "political" reasons, and that you are planning to become an Australian CA.

Have you got a university degree? (including the ACCA Oxford Brookes BSc degree?)


P.s. in terms of visa requirements, i should be ok for independant permanent resident status.
ACCA (full membership) is acceptable to get an ICAA or NIA skill assessment. So in principle, it's acceptable to migrate.

Regarding your work experience, which you will need for the full migration application, if you wish to use any time before becoming a full member of ACCA then you need professional assistance to see will it be acceptable or not. The answer will depend on the skill level (Big Four is a good start), pay level and whether you already have a degree or not.

You should be aware that DIAC are on the lookout for people who are skill assessed as accountants but who are really book-keepers.
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Old Jun 16th 2007, 7:31 pm
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Lightbulb Re: ACCA to ICAA

Originally Posted by JAJ
If you are ACCA qualified, you will also need to do the CA Program in order to become an Australian CA. You will also need around 3 years experience in Australia under the supervision of an Australian CA (or equivalent such as an English or New Zealand CA).
I was hoping that my UK experience, which was supervised by an UK CA (ICAEW), might be recognised for at least part of the 3-yr period, but unfortunately this does not seem to be the case... never mind, i'm sure that the time will fly by....


Originally Posted by JAJ
Most larger companies are accredited by the ICAA. The Australian CAs are more flexible about training outside practice than is the case in many peer institutes.

You should aim your sights as high as you can. Explain that ACCA is CPA equivalent but not fully recognised for "political" reasons, and that you are planning to become an Australian CA.
Glad to hear so, in the UK its fairly hard to get your CA in industry, this takes away a bit of pressure ... also do companies have a lot of input in the training in Oz? In the UK the training support given by firms adds a lot of value to your basic pay (which simply means that companies can get away paying low salaries but give you a number of days off as study leave and pay your course and examination fees)


Originally Posted by JAJ
Have you got a university degree? (including the ACCA Oxford Brookes BSc degree?)
No i haven't, and no longer eligible for the Oxford Brooks scheme as registration is required before being part-qualified. (the story is that apparently a particular box on my initial application form was not ticked which i thought had been grrrrr - someone should explain the concept "substance over form" to their admin department)

I was considering completing a degree through distance learning once i get my ACCA results in August. I haven't yet researched much into this area but my guess is that i'd get exemptoins for two of three years?

Also a choice between Australian and an English degree needs to be made... Common sense would tell me that an australian degree would be better if i moved to australia, on the other hand many people say that an australian degree is not highly seen, thus a british degree might be better. What would you say?




Originally Posted by JAJ
ACCA (full membership) is acceptable to get an ICAA or NIA skill assessment. So in principle, it's acceptable to migrate.

Regarding your work experience, which you will need for the full migration application, if you wish to use any time before becoming a full member of ACCA then you need professional assistance to see will it be acceptable or not. The answer will depend on the skill level (Big Four is a good start), pay level and whether you already have a degree or not.

You should be aware that DIAC are on the lookout for people who are skill assessed as accountants but who are really book-keepers.
Yes, there is a lot of debate on that topic out there, from reading official info, the experience is not necessary post qualification experience, however you're absolutely right, i will need to prove to the authorities that my experience has been at an appropriate level. Evidence such as references with detailed description of my role and certified copies of payslips should held to persuade them (my salary is £23k pre qualification and will be £35k post qualification) i.e. AUD $50k (23*2.3) would seem high for a book-keeper, right?


Thanks again for your help, and if anyone else has been exposed to similar circumstances, don't be shy to share your thoughts!

Oksana
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Old Jun 16th 2007, 7:54 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

Also info for anyone else on this topic:

The structure of the ICAA program is; once you're enrolled (i.e. after bridge exams):

There are four "technical units" (Financial accounting and reporting, management accounting and analysis, Audit and Assurance and Tax) and a the "CA integrative" module.

20% of marks are from the submission of a project (team one for the technical units and an individual one for CAI)

30% of marks are for your contribution and results of unit knowledge quizzes (UKQ) at focus sessions. These are face to face group meetings, four 3hr sessions per module.

50% remainder obtained from open books exams.

Three modules can be completed in 12 months. Please note that part of the requirement is that you're in relevant employment while studying for these modules, i.e cannot start the qualification before getting a job.

http://www.charteredaccountants.com...._march2006.pdf
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Old Jun 16th 2007, 9:30 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

Originally Posted by oksana21
Glad to hear so, in the UK its fairly hard to get your CA in industry, this takes away a bit of pressure ... also do companies have a lot of input in the training in Oz? In the UK the training support given by firms adds a lot of value to your basic pay (which simply means that companies can get away paying low salaries but give you a number of days off as study leave and pay your course and examination fees)
Can't comment on the details other than to say that the Australian CAs in general have a more flexible program than the ICAEW.



I was considering completing a degree through distance learning once i get my ACCA results in August. I haven't yet researched much into this area but my guess is that i'd get exemptoins for two of three years?

Also a choice between Australian and an English degree needs to be made... Common sense would tell me that an australian degree would be better if i moved to australia, on the other hand many people say that an australian degree is not highly seen, thus a british degree might be better. What would you say?
In principle you should be looking for exemptions from 2 out of 3 years for a bachelors degree. However not every university is willing to give credit transfer.

If you were staying in the UK, then the Open University would be a good option.

If in Australia, a good distance learning option is the University of New England. You may want to do tax/law bridging study with them if you are planning to get a degree from them as well. You would need to talk with the university as to what credit they would be willing to give. The ICAA skill assessment will make it clear that ACCA is equivalent at least to an Australian bachelors degree.

Your choice as to whether to do your degree first, or the CA Program, or pursue the two simultaneously. My suggestion would be to get your CA first priority, but long term you should plan to get a bachelors degree as well. For example, should you later on find yourself in Canada or some other countries, not having a university degree will seriously limit your options to become qualified locally.

Needless to say, in order to get your skill assessment from ICAA you must be a full member of ACCA - just passing the final exams won't do.
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Old Jun 24th 2007, 5:00 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

Nice discussion here.

I recently did my Alevels (June 07). I'll be starting my ACCA very soon from Pakistan. What i need to know is regarding the 'appropriate work experience'. I was thinking of starting my training for ACCA in a Big 4 a few months after i start my ACCA and continue my training and studies simultaneously.

I want to migrate to OZ (to do CA) right after i am a fully qualified ACCA i.e around three years time. What i want to know is that would my training for ACCA be regarded as 'work experience' in my migration application? Obviously i won't be getting a top notch position after my Alevels but would it suffice the work experience requirement?

Also any advise as to what other important things i should do? I know a bachelors degree is important, but i'll think about it once i have done my ACCA. For now, i'll be happy with the Oxford Brooks degree.

Last edited by silentgear; Jun 24th 2007 at 5:11 pm.
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Old Jun 24th 2007, 5:24 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

I just had my ACCA finals and will hopefully be fully qualified with 4yrs "big 4" experience in October 2007
One question for Oksana. Are you 21 yrs old? If so, did when did you start your ACCA? I mean how old were you when you started your ACCA?

Last edited by silentgear; Jun 24th 2007 at 6:03 pm.
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Old Jun 24th 2007, 5:41 pm
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Red face Re: ACCA to ICAA

Hi Silentgear,

Congratulations on passing your A-levels and starting your training. It is good to see that you're planning ahead. 

I myself started to work for the Big4 Co. straight after a-levels and did CAT and then ACCA. So good luck but it won't be easy!

Unfortunately there isn't a "yes/no" answer to your question and it will depend on your experience (and the references which you'd get).

What i can say is that from reading the booklets+other info on official web-sites i did not find a definition for 'appropriate work experience', so this is left up to the "professional judgement" of the assessor of your application.

I hope that having worked for a Big4 and achieving a qualification which is partly recognised by the ICAA will meet the criteria. Also, it may be worth considering the description of an external auditor per the following web-site (i am assuming this will be your role).

ww. australia-migration.com/asco/2212-11.htm

I am planning to move around Nov07-Jan08, and will let you know what evidence i provided and whether i was successful.

Sorry that i couldn't give a more definitive answer.

Oksana
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Old Jun 24th 2007, 5:52 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

Thanks for the reply, oksana.

Also, it may be worth considering the description of an external auditor per the following web-site (i am assuming this will be your role).
From the website:

Skill Level:
The entry requirement for this occupation is a bachelor degree or higher qualification. In some instances relevant experience is required in addition to the formal qualification. Registration or licensing is required.
I'll be starting my training/work experience after my Alevels so i won't be able to work as a External Auditor.

I don't really know at what position i would work. What position should i expect after, say completing the first part of ACCA?

What role did you get after your Alevels?

I myself started to work for the Big4 Co. straight after a-levels and did CAT and then ACCA. So good luck but it won't be easy!
I'm won't be going for CAT route. I'll be starting ACCA directly. I have also heard that it won't be easy, but i'm up for it. Hopefully things will work out.

I am planning to move around Nov07-Jan08, and will let you know what evidence i provided and whether i was successful.
I'll really appreciate that.

Plus : http://britishexpats.com/forum/showp...53&postcount=7


Thanks..

Last edited by silentgear; Jun 24th 2007 at 6:04 pm.
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Old Jun 24th 2007, 5:56 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

Originally Posted by silentgear
One question for Oksana. Are you 21 yrs old? If so, did when did you start your ACCA?
Hi (again lol),

Yes i had my 21st birthday last month... (everyone is telling me its all downhill from now) lol i'm sure they are all wrong!!!!

I was lucky enough to skip a year at school when i came over from Germany to England (the German teacher argued that the system in Germany is harder, although I’m not sure if that’s true...) Anyways... that meant that i finished my A-levels just after my 17th birthday (summer 2003) and a few months later i applied and got a job at the Big 4 Co (after a few failed attempts at other companies) its quite funny really, because at time i didn't even know who the Big 4 Co were

As mentioned above i did CAT first, this is a low level accountancy qualification and took 2 yrs (was a waste of time, designed for people who are not good enough to get into uni in my opinion) then after being exempt from the first stage of ACCA i sat papers 2.1-3.2 in a year. Then i had to miss out and not sit any exams last December and this June i had the last core papers 3.1, 3.2 and 3.3. Results are coming out is August so fingers crossed!!!!

So that’s my life story so far.. who knows what the future will bring??!!

Oksana

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Old Jun 24th 2007, 6:10 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

Originally Posted by silentgear

I'll be starting my training/work experience after my Alevels so i won't be able to work as a External Auditor.

I don't really know at what position i would work. What position should i expect after, say completing the first part of ACCA?
Why not??? maybe it works differently in Pakistan then here, i started as a trainee external auditor straight away... very summarised you would expect the following positions:

1st year:
Auditing simple balances + controls, e.g. banks and cash, fixed assets and prepayments. You'll be also performing a lot of substantive audit procedures (basically a lot of ticking and adding up - you'll be surprised how many people can't use the "sum function in excel")

2nd year:
You'll be getting to audit more complex and judgemental areas, such and P&L and Inventories. You'll be holding meeting with clients and discussing key processes and risks of the business.

3rd/4th year:
Getting more involved with the planning and completion of audits, training 1st+2nd year students and liasoning with clients. Researching and solving technical matters by referring to the relevant accounting standards. You'll be starting to "in-charge" jobs, i.e. be the key communicator between the audit team and the manager.

This is a very broad question... but i tried to be as helpful as i could.

Oksana
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Old Jun 24th 2007, 6:20 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

Originally Posted by oksana21

As mentioned above i did CAT first, this is a low level accountancy qualification and took 2 yrs (was a waste of time, designed for people who are not good enough to get into uni in my opinion)
ACCA set up the CAT qualification in the mid 1990s, when for some unknown reason they decided not to continue with the Association of Accounting Technicians (AAT) which is an established body for para-professional accountants. The AAT had been set up in the early 1980s by the major British accounting bodies.

In recent years the AAT have become well established in Australia under the sponsorship of the Australian accounting bodies (ICAA, CPAA and NIA). Also, AAT has good relationships with the College of Accounting Technicians of the New Zealand Institute of Chartered Accountants.

I would think that ACCA's CAT qualification is unknown in Australia and hence not worth a great deal in the Australian employment market. Even in the United Kingdom, AAT is better known. The other professional bodies all continued to sponsor AAT.
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Old Jun 24th 2007, 6:23 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

This was really really helpful. Thanks alot, oksana.

I'll try to find how it works in Pakistan. Hopefully i'll get into PwC and work my way from there.
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Old Jun 24th 2007, 6:48 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

Originally Posted by JAJ

I would think that ACCA's CAT qualification is unknown in Australia and hence not worth a great deal in the Australian employment market. Even in the United Kingdom, AAT is better known. The other professional bodies all continued to sponsor AAT.
I totally agree, it does not add any value at all, and nobody knows about it. As far as i am aware the reason why my employer decided to go down the CAT route is because AAT has a project as part of its syllabus which takes up a lot of the employers time and CAT is purely exam based. Their policy has changed since and now college students start directly with ACCA but are only allowed to take 2 papers at a time.

Although saying all that, CAT did give me "basis" for ACCA which enabled me to confidently do 4 papers at a time... so wasn't so useless after all.
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Old Jun 25th 2007, 4:19 pm
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Default Re: ACCA to ICAA

Originally Posted by oksana21
I totally agree, it does not add any value at all, and nobody knows about it. As far as i am aware the reason why my employer decided to go down the CAT route is because AAT has a project as part of its syllabus which takes up a lot of the employers time and CAT is purely exam based. Their policy has changed since and now college students start directly with ACCA but are only allowed to take 2 papers at a time.

Although saying all that, CAT did give me "basis" for ACCA which enabled me to confidently do 4 papers at a time... so wasn't so useless after all.
I was reading through some of the old threads and found this thread and got a bit confused:

http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=449772

If Pre-qualification experience does not count for immigration purpose i won't be able to apply after my ACCA, as i would also gain the work experience during attempting my papers. Same would be the case with, oksana i reckon.

Anyone has any insights?
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