durham_lad

Then I misunderstood your exchange above...

hungryhorace

You did, but admittedly I could have been clearer.

Bob

Get random spot checks on the coast though...same in tourist season up in NH/ME. Though mostly up there it's to weed out Canadians who might have boated down for the weekend and have guns on the boat, as it's easy money.

ScousePete

As an Arizona resident, I can confirm that SB1070 is alive and well. Not popular, but alive none the less.

I also had to produce my Green Card when requested at a motorway checkpoint on the way to California less than a year ago.

Steerpike

I'm not suggesting that the 9/11 attacks would have been prevented by ID checking. I've quite familiar with the history of that one. However - terrorism takes many forms and is perpetrated by many levels of people.

Sometimes simply 'checking the basics' CAN yield results in law enforcement. As an example, the Oklahoma City bomber was caught because he was driving a truck without a license plate - he was pulled over due to the simple requirement to have a plate on a truck.

You say that ID can be easily faked, well, isn't that the purpose of "REAL ID" ... to make it harder to fake?

Steerpike

Can you elaborate on 'had to'? If you are in possession of a valid US (state) Drivers License, how would they even know you were NOT a citizen? I suppose this could have been a result of a dialog with them, in which it became apparent you had a British accent, and thus, they may have asked you about your citizenship status, and then asked to see the green card.

I ask this as a genuine question, because I drive between CA and AZ all the time, and now I'm an actual citizen (having been a 'green card' holder for decades), I wonder if they could somehow ask me for my green card. If I tell them I'm UK born, but now a US citizen, they could ask to see my passport but - as mentioned above - I don't carry it, and, there's no legal requirement to do so.

Just curious!

AdobePinon

It is an issue. Theoretically, you don't have to prove US curizenship. But plenty of USCs get deported every year, when they either can't, or are not given an opportunity to prove their citizenship. Typically it happens to naturalized citizens in conjunction with minor charges and arrests coupled with inadequately updated USCIS/ICE records. I'm acquainted with one guy locally who got picked up by ICE and jailed awaiting deportation procedings seven years after he gained US citizenship. IIRC, he spent about a month in jail before his lawyer could get him out.

durham_lad

Obtaining a driver's licence does not mean proof of citizenship, certainly in Texas. When we got ours recently, after moving from Louisiana, we took our US passports with us as we wanted to register to vote at the same time. Not only were not asked to prove citizenship, we were not asked to prove we were legal residents. (and we were registered to vote at the same, just had to check the box saying we were US Citizens)

In 2012 we went to Big Bend National Park in Texas, driving there from Houston, and we were stopped twice and asked to show passports to prove we were legal immigrants. We had been forewarned and had our passports with us.

Steerpike

Are you saying, though, that if you are stopped on the road and don't show -then and there - that you are a citizen (that is, show your PP), that you can be arrested, and they won't give you reasonable means to acquire your PP? That is - go to your home (or bank for safe-deposit box) and retrieve your PP? Most citizens I know don't carry their PPs.

I know that a Drivers License doesn't mean proof of citizenship - I've had a Drivers License here since 1983 and only became a citizen in 2009. But you are only required to carry a Drivers License with you when you drive, not a PP (or proof of citizenship), so requiring you to show your PP during a traffic stop seems unreasonable.

durham_lad

It wasn't traffic stops by police it was stops by Border Control agents who patrol the roads close to the border. They also had drug sniffer dogs that they lead around the car. Even legal residents run drugs between Mexico and the USA. The Big Bend NP website has warnings to carry your passport when driving to the park as the park borders Mexico, although the stops were out side the park. The Rio Grande was extremely shallow while we were there, 6 good strides and you are in Mexico.

scrubbedexpat091

Anytime I have driven on I-8 into Arizona from California the border patrol check point along there (been there for years, at-least 16 or 17 years now if not longer) they just simply asked where I was from, I said California and off I went. Now I have no accent as I was born in the US, but my very Hispanic looking step sister has also had no issues when she has been with me along that route.

There are also check points on I-5 north leaving San Diego County as you enter Orange County, but its not always open.

I-15 N leaving San Diego County and entering Riverside County also has a check point, but its not always open either as like above they open and close randomly.

Both of the above check points have been around since I was a young child, so dating back to mid-80's.

I-8 East just outside Alpine in San Diego County also has a random check point.

I-8 West there is a check point as well just after you cross into California, but its a state agriculture check point, so unless you have plants or produce your safe.


I am not sure about the other interstates going into/out of California.

AdobePinon

Sounds like it, but I don't know the details. Perhaps if the USCIS/ICE records state someone is not a citizen, they don't allow that person to get documentation. I guess for most people, the proof would be (a) PP; (b) naturalization certificate; (c) birth certificate (putting aside the issues with BCs). A lot of people may not be able to produce any of those within a reasonable time, so perhaps that is another situation that arises.

Anyway, google deporting USCs, and you can find plenty of cases.

Steerpike

I have driven between AZ and CA at least 5 round trips this past 12 months, with most of my crossings being on I-10 at Blythe/Quartzsite. I've never been stopped, I just slow down and they wave me on. I think the I-10 checkpoint is more 'agricultural' in focus. Typically, if I don't cross on I-10, I'm taking the more northerly routes that mean I'm going from AZ->NV->CA, and I don't recall any kind of checkpoints at all going from NV->CA. So this does seem to be a 'proximity to border' phenomenon. In 2012, I did drive from Rio Rico (AZ) (just north of Nogales, Mexico) to Bisbee (AZ), and don't recall any kind of checkpoints ... but then again, if all they did was wave me through then I wouldn't have remembered it.

On my last drive - two weeks ago - I chose to explore 'Salton Sea', rather than just heading east on I-10. After seeing the (utterly bizarre) Salton Sea area, I headed back up towards Blythe on CA-78, and encountered an immigration checkpoint ... but again, was waved on without even a word . As an aside, you see some amazing sand dunes on that road!

This is all very interesting ... we have people in this thread objecting to showing photo ID at airport security, but here I'm learning that I could be arrested (and deported?!) for not carrying my passport while driving within the US legally (complying with the requirement to carry a valid drivers license) and not crossing any international border!

I just looked up passport card - http://travel.state.gov/content/pass...tion/card.html - and see that it would cost me $30 for 10 years to get a PP card. I guess I don't mind the cost, but it's one more thing to have to apply for ... . There is just no way, practically, for me as a guy who does not have a 'purse' or 'handbag' equivalent - just a wallet - to carry the conventional PP book, so if this were to be an issue I'd just have to go for the PP card. I guess I'll bury my head in the sand and assume it won't happen to me ....

scrubbedexpat091

It is a proximity to border thing, once a certain distance from the border to my knowledge they can no longer do the check points, but don't quote me on the exact distance as I have forgotten.

I am also waved through most of the time, on occasion I was stopped, but unless you look like a certain demographic or appear to be hauling drugs, they generally just wave you through without issue.

I only recall all of them as I have seen them and gone through them my entire life anytime we left San Diego County on I-5, I-15 or I-8.

http://www.alamy.com/stock-photos/B0...%20border.html

Steve_

8 USC 1304(e) is the federal law that requires you to carry your alien registration card at all times.

The provision in SB1070 that mirrored that federal law was struck down as being pre-empted by the supremacy clause.

287(g) enforcement authority is limited to jail enforcement, and MCSO's authority was revoked so there is no requirement basically under Arizona law that you have your green card, nor can the police pull you over and do anything if you fail to show it to them.

If you got pulled over on I-8 I assume it was at a Border Patrol checkpoint, which obviously isn't a State agency.