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Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Old Nov 24th 2014, 12:41 pm
  #31  
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Pulaski
That's not peculiar to homes high in the mountains, but is relatively common even in the suburbs, and is normal in rural areas, across the whole of the US.
And not only the US
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 1:27 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Spencer14
Also, this might be crazy but I've seen a few amazing patches of land available for decent prices. Would we be out of our mind to buy a piece of land and have someone build a home/log cabin on it for us?
That is generally significantly more expensive than buying an already built home. First you have to have the plans drawn up and then get all the city approvals and building permits which is no small task. Then you have the cost to hook up to city utilities and that can be very expensive. People often complain that paying the city $50,000+ to hook up to the city's water supply and sewer (not including the cost of construction to hook up) is ridiculous since the utilities are already running by their home but what people tend to not comprehend is that as more people hook up, the city has to upgrade the infrastructure for sewage treatment plants and access to more water supplies. Then the cost of a contractor building a custom home is significantly more expensive since they have to follow plans they aren't familiar with, rent equipment and/or move construction equipment short term, tightly schedule and supervise workers as each phase is done, and have a city inspector inspect the site as each phase is completed. When they build a complex, construction equipment is on site until the project is complete, workers move from home to home, the city inspector has a regular schedule, and after the first is built, workers need very little scheduling and supervision.

A friend built a custom home in Bend Oregon and the costs far exceeded what he initially expected and the land was already subdivided and streets and utilities were already laid for the purpose of people buying the land and building custom homes.
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 1:41 pm
  #33  
 
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Michael
That is generally significantly more expensive than buying an already built home. First you have to have the plans drawn up and then get all the city approvals and building permits which is no small task. Then you have the cost to hook up to city utilities and that can be very expensive. People often complain that paying the city $50,000+ to hook up to the city's water supply and sewer (not including the cost of construction to hook up) is ridiculous since the utilities are already running by their home but what people tend to not comprehend is that as more people hook up, the city has to upgrade the infrastructure for sewage treatment plants and access to more water supplies. Then the cost of a contractor building a custom home is significantly more expensive since they have to follow plans they aren't familiar with, rent equipment and/or move construction equipment short term, tightly schedule and supervise workers as each phase is done, and have a city inspector inspect the site as each phase is completed. When they build a complex, construction equipment is on site until the project is complete, workers move from home to home, the city inspector has a regular schedule, and after the first is built, workers need very little scheduling and supervision.

A friend built a custom home in Bend Oregon and the costs far exceeded what he initially expected and the land was already subdivided and streets and utilities were already laid for the purpose of people buying the land and building custom homes.
Why do you keep taking about "city", and "hook up to utilities"? He isn't planning to build in San Francisco.
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 1:50 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Moses2013
And not only the US
I think anything out of town has a septic tank here as well. Friends of ours who moved to a small village nearby were pottering about with theirs last time we went.
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 2:01 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Pulaski
Why do you keep taking about "city", and "hook up to utilities"? He isn't planning to build in San Francisco.
My friend in Oregon wasn't in the city but up in the hills and when city water and sewage is already in the street, the city/local government usually won't let people build wells and septic tanks. Some may say that the local government is just trying to get money but wells and septic tanks are not environmentally friendly and often on mountains, not feasible.

Around Lake Tahoe, there are few if any septic tanks or wells.

Last edited by Michael; Nov 24th 2014 at 2:06 pm.
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 2:17 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Sally Redux
Worth putting into the equation when buying though. Climate change will not be reversed. It will affect different parts of the world in different ways, some will see drought and some flooding. So it's about the future and not whether it has personally affected you where you live.
Thank you...some people don't seem to understand that
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 2:28 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Hotscot
Thank you...some people don't seem to understand that
But if it is climate change that is causing the problem, California could end up being more like Florida and Florida more like California. No one knows how weather patterns will change and will affect any area except the likelihood that coastal cities will flood.
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 2:37 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

sigh...

You're absolutely correct. It could, and no one knows.

All I'm saying is that there are multi-year drought conditions currently being experienced in California.

And these conditions are affecting some negatively.

And these conditions may be an element to consider when making a substantial investment in property that will require a water supply.

Due diligence and all that...
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 2:39 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Michael
..... Around Lake Tahoe, there are few if any septic tanks or wells.
And you base that assertive statement on what exactly?

Now, please would you care to explain what all these businesses do? .... It says there are 22 of them, in the South Lake area. If each home owner has their tank pumped once every three years (which is extremely conservative IME), and each company has only one tanker and pumps only 3 tanks a day 200 days a year, 22 pumping businesses could serve 40,000 homes with septic systems. I believe my estimate is conservative, and could easily be two or three times as large.

Next perhaps you could look into what these businesses do, because by my count at least 10 of the first 15 specifically offer well drilling services in the same South Lake Tahoe area.

Last edited by Pulaski; Nov 24th 2014 at 3:10 pm.
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 3:01 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Pulaski
And you base that assertive statement on what exactly?

Now, please would you care to explain what all these businesses do? .... It says there are 22 of them, in the South Lake area. If each home owner has their tank pumped once every three years (which is extremely conservative IME), and each company has only one tanker and pumps only [b]3 tanks a day 200 days a year[/b, 22 pumping businesses could serve 40,000 homes with septic systems. I believe my estimate is conservative, and could easily be two or three times as large.

Next perhaps you could look into what these businesses do, because by my count at least 10 of the first 15 specifically offer well drilling services in the same South Lake Tahoe area.
Mound House is on the other side of Carson City Nevada which is on the other side of the mountains in the dessert, Gardnerville is also in the desert in Nevada, and Reno is no where close and isn't on any mountain. I suspect Truckee serves the isolated cabins near Donner Lake along I-80. The only one that I can see that would probably serve Lake Tahoe homes is the one in south Lake Tahoe. I've rented about a half dozen cabins/homes (with groups) in all parts around Lake Tahoe and none of them had septic tanks or wells. It is not very common around the Lake.

Last edited by Michael; Nov 24th 2014 at 3:12 pm.
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 3:09 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Michael
Mound House is near Carson City Nevada which is on the other side of the mountains in the dessert, Gardnerville is also in the desert in Nevada, Reno is no where close and isn't on any mountain. I suspect Truckee serves the isolated cabins along I-80. The only one that I can see that would probably serve Lake Tahoe homes is the one on south Lake Tahoe. I've rented about a half dozen cabins/homes (with groups) in all parts around Lake Tahoe and none of them had septic tanks or wells. It is not very common around the Lake.
So when you rent home or cabin for a vacation you routinely research the sewage disposal system? If you visited my home you would have no idea that it is on a septic system unless you went wandering around the back yard, where a pump box protrudes above ground level, and a valve has an access pipe, and even then you'd need to know what they are. Two adjoining properties have absolutely no signs whatsoever above ground level, or inside the house, that they are on septic systems.
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 3:16 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Spencer14
Wow! I didn't mean to cause such a heated debate.



Our main thinking is to provide a place that our family and friends can use when we're not there. It seems like renting will be more hassle than it's worth but we would hope to have the place full about 6-8 months a year with our family and friends.

I'll look into Bear Valley and Murphys. We'll be heading out again early next year to have another 'final' look before putting some offers in. Does anyone else have any suggestions for places for us to explore with our requirements?

Also, this might be crazy but I've seen a few amazing patches of land available for decent prices. Would we be out of our mind to buy a piece of land and have someone build a home/log cabin on it for us?

Just a thought
I have to ask why you think you'd be able to have the place full for 6-8 months a year with family and friends? Bishop isn't exactly a holiday destination, and while it's pretty, the only people I know who return again and again are climbers, and they all camp. It's very difficult to get to from the SF side of California, in the winter, as once the pass is closed it's a 10 hour drive. Why would your F&F want to return to the same place over and over each year?

Looking at the amount of houses for sale in Bishop, it looks like it's very difficult to sell there too.
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 3:19 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Hotscot
sigh...

You're absolutely correct. It could, and no one knows.

All I'm saying is that there are multi-year drought conditions currently being experienced in California.

And these conditions are affecting some negatively.

And these conditions may be an element to consider when making a substantial investment in property that will require a water supply.

Due diligence and all that...
Personally I would be more concerned about the earthquakes in the Mammoth Mountain area since it shakes and rolls on a daily basis.

More than 600 small earthquakes have rattled the Mammoth Lakes region in less than 36 hours as ripple effects continued across one of the most seismically active volcanic regions in California, according to the U.S. Geological Survey..

Mammoth earthquake swarm is the largest in nearly a decade - LA Times
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 3:24 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

I would also take this into account.

(Gorgeous area too. They recently settled their water dispute.)

Last edited by Hotscot; Nov 24th 2014 at 3:26 pm.
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Old Nov 24th 2014, 3:32 pm
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Default Re: Holiday home in the Eastern Sierras

Originally Posted by Pulaski
So when you rent home or cabin for a vacation you routinely research the sewage disposal system? If you visited my home you would have no idea that it is on a septic system unless you went wandering around the back yard, where a pump box protrudes above ground level, and a valve has an access pipe, and even then you'd need to know what they are. Two adjoining properties have absolutely no signs whatsoever above ground level, or inside the house, that they are on septic systems.
Your links weren't much evidence that there is much service for septic or well services around the lake. Only one septic company was listed that would likely serve the area around the lake and no drilling companies (those were all listed plumbing companies).

And yes generally when a cabin/home is rented, you know if a septic tank is used since there are generally signs not to dispose certain things in the toilet and there never is a garbage disposal unit.
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