Redwing

[QUOTE=Noorah101;7057193]Just to be correct, he's trying to take your son out on a VWP and then apply for his *adjustment of status to permanent resident* once there.

That is the whole crux of the matter. Plus only those who have gone through divorce and custody battles know how stressful and difficult it can be.

ian-mstm

This has to be the single most stupid comment I've seen in this thread. Why, you ask? Because the court can consent to the child leaving the UK and completely override the mother's wishes.

Ian

Folinskyinla

Hi:

Perhaps the Courts and Ex have not been helpful. However, if you have won the court cases, it might be that you are somewhat in the driver's seat. It may be that, in such situation, you may be able to take the high road -- Ex has been a jerk, but from your own words, not entirely evil. Any a 14 year old is not mature enough to make the decisions, but is old enough to have his desires considered by the adults. [And he is going to be 18 before you know it -- and I am given to understand that adolescents often really need a close connection with the same sex parent -- this is a general comment because I don't know your entire situation].

I agree that if son is to move to NY, it should be done right and not impulsively. [BTW, I wonder if your son has something going on which you really don't know about, yet. As a parent, been there, done that].

Perhaps you can say, "Ex, this is nuts. And combat doesn't get you what you want. Lets try something different." If he then refuses, you look better to your son and move on.

BTW, I hope you never bad-mouth your ex to your children. That has a nasty way of backfiring.

mumstheword

Hi Mr F - my son has consistantly changed his mind over the last year. Compounded with this, he has been diagnosed as having ADD, possibly Asperger's but my ex has managed to stop the full diagnosis taking place. I have never bad mouthed my ex to our children though he has told them that I had affairs throughout our marriage and that he is not sure that he is their father - that's a fine example of a male to set for our 2 sons.
My son does seem to be telling different people different things so who knows? I am just concentrating on getting the right procedures followed. At least this way, I get more time with my son at a vulnerable age and I can get him properly assessed before he goes anywhere. I ma very scared about him going to the NY Highschool my ex is suggesting - it has 4000 pupils and there was a stabbing there last week. Here, my son attends a private school with 500 boys and is doing very well and is very well supported. He is extremely naive - we live in a small village and has no street knowledge, so I feel very worried about him. At least if he does not go until he is a bit older he may cope better.

Deedee13

i would like to see a court overide the mothers wishes...! Unless of course its in the best interests of the child. Which does not seem to be the case here does it, as the mother is really only got her sons interest at heart! So it may be stupid to you mr ian, however hasnt the general answer to most questions of divorced families moving over here been to get the writen permission from the other parent first to save encountering problems? So that is all irrelivant is it?

I would have thought a parent bringing a child to the USA with no valid visa is definately in the childs best interest and any court in the land is going to let it happen and overide the mothers wish? I would love to see a court in the UK agree to a kid coming to the US. Stay illegally, and proceed to go to school. She appears to be the only one with any sense in this whole sorry state of affairs that is actually making sure the Ts are crossed and the I's are dotted. So give away my parental rights it would be a cold day in hell, give away my custody rights, why not if its what the child wants!! She gets more than a thumbs up from me.

clarissageo

Hopefully in the proposal pack that your ex prepared and should have copied into CAFCASS, yourself, and the court, he covered all of your sons medical / emotional / behavioural issues. For a court to take such an application seriously he should also have a proposal of how your son will be integrated into the new environment given his difficulties.

Have CAFCASS contacted your sons current school for their insight to how the move will affect your son? If not, there is no harm in getting in touch with the headmaster / mistress URGENTLY and asking them to write a quick letter that you can show to the court. All the points you have put above need to be put in bullet point format and bought to the attention of the judge.

I still think your winning point in the whole case (from a laymans view) is the method which your ex is trying to take his son. Try to steer away from the emotional side and how it is affecting YOU. The court is not interested in you or your ex, they are interested in the child. I'm pretty sure once they see the methods being employed by your ex and how it is viewed by the people who ultimately decide on your sons immigration, the rest of the points will only serve to re-inforce that your son does need more time to get his head around the whole process.

If he succeeded, I would imagine that the court would make two orders - one would be a contact and residency order stating what contact you get, and that the child resides with the applicant father - at the bottom would still appear the 'small print ' in bold that states something about resident parent not leaving the country for more than 28 days and not changing the childs name without the permission of the non resident parent or the court (Can't remember the exact wording, and mine is all packed away in a case ready for our departure tomorrow) and then an additional order stating that he has been given permission to remove the child from the UK jurisdiction. He needs both of those orders to get your son a visa.

mumstheword

Ex denies there is anything wrong with my son - like he knows from visiting 1/2 times per year.
I am concentrating on the whole visa thing now - it gives me time with my son to sort things out better.
Wow - going tomorrow. Thanks for sparing time to give me advice. Loads of luck with your new life. I'm sure you'll have an exciting Xmas over there. Our loss is their gain xx

Folinskyinla

Hi:

Good luck. It is OK to vent on us that your ex may be a jerk, but keep your son in mind.

BTW, the fact that your ex visits 1or 2 times a year from overseas can be a favorable factor for him if you think about it. And you apparently don't cut-off contact -- so that is favorable for you.

Also, I wonder if there is any way to "register" any British judgement with the New York family law courts?

Again -- good luck.

meauxna

MrF, do you have any comment on the ex's side legitimizing the VWP express as a method for the boy to come over?

Folinskyinla

Hi:

None that I care to discuss here other than to note that child is 14, but dad is still an alien, and I wonder about CYA with la migra.

clarissageo

There is - the OP needs to make sure that any order that is made in the UK courts Jurisdiction also has a 'Mirror Order' made in the US courts for the area where the child will be residing. I would also get a new order made for Child Support and have that mirrored at the same time.

Without a mirror order its going to be a hell of a battle to get the UK order enforced in the US, unless you start quoting the hague convention, but I believe that the hague convention only kicks in when the child is taken without the other parents consent ('abducted' seems to be a common term).

http://www.divorce.co.uk/Divorcewhat...8/Default.aspx

I think another consideration when getting a mirror order is what happens if the parent with residency moves to another state? The order needs to be enforceable in whatever state the child resides, so it could be worth having a clause put in that a mirror order is obtained in whatever state the child resides in prior to the move.

Like I've said many times - I'm not a lawyer, but I went through getting a Leave to remove order with my children and did so much research and spent ours going over stuff with my lawyer.

(Em... Not a problem sparing time to do this, the nerves are kicking in now and I'd be rocking and dribbling in a corner if I didnt have something to take my mind off the move!)

Folinskyinla

Hi:

In the US, the term is "recognition." You note the problem with enforcement of foreign judgments in the United States. If the foreign judgment is from another state, it will be recognized pursuant to the "Full Faith & Credit" clause in the US Constitution. If the foreign judgment is from another country, principles of "comity" will be used. [I believe that a UK family law judgment would get such comity. I can see huge problems with a UK libel judgment -- US and UK libel law are at extreme odds with each other].

So, once the equivalent of "mirror judgment" is set up in any of the United States, it will be a foreign judgment subject to enforcement in any other state.

That said, once a child is in the US, jurisdiction over modifications of custody, support and visitation would shift to the US court. As for support arrears, those cannot be modified since they are the same as a money judgment.

clarissageo

Thanks for clarifying I'm just a dizzy blond speaking from experiences of the process this side of the pond, its helpful to know the terminology from the US.

I wasn't aware that child support issues shifted to the US court I thought it all had to be done with REMO .... so does that mean the US courts would make a Child support order against a UKC parent resident in the UK for UKC kids in the US?

I'm not only asking for myself, but I'm wondering if that also means that the OP's ex would be eligable to claim Child support for the son he is trying to move?