LondonSquirrel

Just thinking about the latest death, with the Australian girl shot in her pyjamas. I think she may have been on a K1? At least I read that she was in America to get married. The cops seem so trigger-happy. All this Black Lives Matter and now this latest incident stands out because the officers had both turned their bodycams off. I know it is not at all unusual for cops to shoot peoples' dogs dead if they so much as growl. They just say they 'felt threatened' and get away with it. I mean it obviously has happened that UK police have shot people, but it just seems so much more common over the pond. And in this latest incident, where the lady was just calling to report a neighbour's argument, the equivalent cops in the UK wouldn't have been armed.

Not trying to stir, just wanted to understand why, and what people think of it. I think if I witnessed a crime over there, I would just keep quiet.

markonline1

I suspect it has something to do with the fact that cops spend the majority of their working day dealing with the dregs of society. Now arm those dregs, and you can see why the cops sometimes get a little trigger happy.

LondonSquirrel

Maybe in their minds it's 'them and us.' Only 'them' is not just the criminals, but anybody who isn't a cop, including people reporting crimes. I can believe that. A lot of people I know don't trust the police (here in the UK). My DH and I called the rozzers several years ago to report vandalism on the downstairs property below us (now a flat but then a café). When they turned up, the first thing they asked was 'Did you do this?' Of course we said no, but they made us give them our names and dates of birth. I asked why and they said it was just procedure. But I reckon they ran us through the police database to see if either of us had a record for vandalism.

Giantaxe

When you are dealing with such a heavily armed populace, the police have to assume every interaction with the public could be potentially lethal. I presume that really influences one's judgment and actions.

dc koop

They don't shoot people for nothing and that's ignoring the very, very isolated cases where some cop has shot a person without due cause and it gets to become media news.
Plenty of cops die on the job here too. But the reality is that you have to be doing something really stupid or crazy to get shot. Pointing a gun or wielding a knife or other dangerous weapon and ignoring warnings to put them down can get one shot.

This is a very different society from that of the UK. There are more firearms than people and there are plenty of nutters who have them

Pollyana

So what do you reckon Justine Damond was doing to get shot in her pyjamas at point blank range the other night? Something stupid and crazy like reporting an incident.....
And why did the cops have their cameras off at the time?

Leslie

Exactly. I'm sick of all of these excuses.

ian-mstm

Sad to say, I suspect it's because she approached the police car... which, in the US, isn't generally something you ever do! She may have expected them to react as might happen in the UK... welcoming help.


They hadn't yet gotten out of their car... so I guess there was either no need or no protocol for that. The dash cam video faces front, so when something happens at the side of the vehicle it's not recorded.

This is a tragedy, to be sure - but it seems like a perfect storm of ignorance and protocol on both sides.

Ian

moi

When my step father and mother have visited in the past and gone into NYC. I will always remember my step father saying, "WOW, you don't mess with the cops here." After been here for many years, cops and the public is a whole different ball game than in the UK. Even in our small crappy town in NJ, there is an air of arrogance from the cops. Just the other day, they pulled over a truck and had 3 cop cars and bullet proof vest on. My husband and I joked that he was probably 3 miles per hour over the limit.

My son became friends with a boy at school whose dad is a cop in town. One of the most racist guys I know. The kid is a bit of a bully too and started calling my son gay. Apple doesn't fall far from the tree. I told him to keep away from him. I have learnt over the years to distance yourself from cops here.

You call the cops to your house in England they will come and talk the situation through and offer advice etc if you are dealing with violent situations (domestics etc). You call the cops in the US to your house someone is going to be pulled out of your house dead or alive.

tom169

If ever I've heard exaggeration...

moi

Ok maybe a little exaggeration, but I certainly would think twice or 3 or 4 times before calling the cops here. I have first hand experience of it here many years ago to get help. They pulled out my ex in his boxer shorts - there is no talking the situation through. In England, they do try to talk and settle the situation. Certainly not here. Action first, talk later usually with lots of money paid to lawyers.

Pulaski

Why was she wandering around outside? .... I am not saying that means she deserves to be shot, but for all the reasons given above, people need to be very careful when there are police around who have been called to an "incident".

Bumble around, with your hands out of sight, move too quickly, etc, and generally not do as instructed by the police "managing the incident", puts you at risk of being shot. Again, I am not saying that is "right", "fair", or even "acceptable", but if you call the police, or are at a location where the police are called, you need to "behave appropriately", meaning keep your hands in sight, don't move quickly, move away from whoever is most likely to get shot at by the police, at night stay in, or move to, a well lit area/ turn on the lights, and do as you're told by the police.

carcajou

I remember about 10 years ago, talking with some police college instructors, who pointed out that cops are a lot more likely to get shot and killed in quiet neighbourhoods than they are in rough ones, because in the rough one, the officer is a lot more prepared for an incident and situationally aware than they are in the quiet neighbourhood, where they can get complacent.

This Minneapolis incident strikes me as extraordinarily odd, and I have concerns we will find something very dirty on the other end aside from just trigger-happy cop or poor judgment.

carcajou

Pulaski, having just read your comments, I do agree with most of what you say. In many cases the public (and the protesters!) overlook certain elements, as far as I am concerned if you antagonise the police (or do something extremely foolish like try to grab their gun and then run off) - you are inviting a violent response because now the officer fears for his own safety, and any sort of predictability about the situation is now gone.

But it doesn't look like there were any of those hallmarks in this case, otherwise we would be hearing about it from the police. Just wandering around outside shouldn't be enough to trigger the level of alarm in the police for this sort of incident.

Pulaski

Er, yes!
So when the police in the UK are called to a violent domestic situation, they can (sometimes) "talk it out", and leave without removing the violent spouse from the home? .... Presumably this requires nice cups of really hot tea? Excuse me, but I am going to call BS on that one!