dc koop

It was not a a war where heroes were made and legends born. It was a war that was wedged between the Revolutionary War and the Mexican American war the latter of which is well known to every American for the siege of the Alamo and later the defeat of Santa Ana. 1812 has tended to be a bit on the back burner as far as history is concerned.

Certainly the war of 1812 was never on the curriculum of any school I went to in the UK and I was completely unaware of it until Lonnie Donnegan had a hit in the late 50s with a song titled "The battle of New Orleans" That started on me doing a little research and that was the first I heard of it. Prior to that I had always thought that after American independence peace had always existed between them and England

carcajou

The "Special Relationship" is a relatively new thing. Post-independence there were tensions and problems between the Americans and the British that lasted well into the 20th century, including attempted and discussed British interference in the US Civil War on the side of the Confederacy.

One of the biggest factors in the US's delayed entrance into World War 1 was the large German and Irish descendant population. It's often a surprise to people to learn that German descendants, not British ones, form a plurality (but not majority) of the American population today; I'm not going to bother looking up the census figures from 1914 but the bulk of German emigration happened in the 1800s so they were an enormous group, if not a plurality then.

There was serious concern by the American Government at the time that the German and Irish population could cause major unrest and civil disobedience if the US entered a war on the side of the British, who many of even the British-descendant Americans weren't all that sympathethic too. Many of the British descendants who were in the US then, were descended from people who left Britain because of political and religious oppression, and thus didn't have any special affection for the British Government; loyalist clans had left for Canada several generations prior. People didn't migrate then for "changes of scenery" or "something different" like they do today.

robin1234

What political and religious oppression did people suffer in England that led to them migrating to the American colonies or the USA? Surely they were mostly economic migrants? There was probably more religious oppression in New England than in England in the 17th century!

S Folinsky

I'm curious why you think the Mexican War is famous for the siege of the Alamo and the later defeat of Santa Ana? Although Texas is a large state, most Americans do not live there.

Also, I had to look up Lonnie Donnegan inasmuch as Johnny Horton recorded Battle of New Orleans in 1959.

morpeth

Actually the war of 18 did create "heroes" who used the experience to help heir political careers, most notably Andrew Jackson. Throughout the 19th century quite a few Presidents were "heroes" in various military engagements prior to becoming President.

morpeth

The religious "oppression" in the colonies were by state- most states had an established church, whereas in Britain you one established state church. So if one was a Quaker Pennsylvania a good bet, but not say Massachusetts, and Rhode Island originally populated by people seeking to escape nearby oppression, Maryland was founded partially as a haven for Catholics . The Pilgrims most definitely were escaping religious oppression, as were the Puritans , and then one can add from Europe the Anabaptists.

The growing immigration of people of different denominations did eventually lead to a freedom of religion as otherwise there would have been too much social conflict. This is why the separation of church and state was considered so vital- to avoid the of religious conflict that had been seen in England and Europe, and to bring in more and more labour it seemed prudent to accept different denominations.

morpeth

I think the story of the defense of the Alamo captures the imagination, and the several movies about the Alamo have cemented the image of the battle in the minds of most Americans. The subsequent defeat of Santa Ana, while perhaps more significant, I doubt many Americans know much about.

caretaker

Donovan recorded Remember the Alamo so the people in the UK would learn about it.

robin1234

You claim that the "Pilgrims" we're most definitely escaping religious oppression. Who were the "Pilgrims?" What political oppression were they subject to?

As for the Puritans, I think their name gives them away. They were the sort of people who oppressed others, rather than meekly being subject to oppression. Obviously before 1660, puritans weren't oppressed (they were the revolutionaries, in the ascendant.) After 1660, the Restoration, as far as I know, the Church did NOT oppress Puritans. In general it was live and let live, broad church. (Unless you were a regicide, and very few of those were prosecuted.)

My point is that this US founding myth about people coming to America from England to "escape oppression" is just that - a myth.

S Folinsky

I did not question knowledge of the Alamo and the subsequent defeat of Santa Ana. My question is how it came up in the discussion of the Mexican American War. I'm still curious.

BTW, on a tour in Mexico City a long time ago, I remember a discussion with another US tourist about "Los Seis Ninos Hereos" -- I mentioned they were part of a very famous American song. She was quite surprised and asked me what it was? The song is the Marine Corps Hymn which notes the "Halls of Montezuma." From the viewpoint of Mexico, the Marines killed six kids.

Leslie

Snort.

All of those Mexican wars look alike to me.

Lion in Winter

This. The "pilgrims" wanted a stricter, more repressive religious regime than the government was prepared to provide. That was the "oppression" in question, I believe.

Leslie

Which, if you think about it, hasn't changed one bit. You've got people like Roy Moore, who wants to curtail the rights of others, constantly crying about oppression.

Lion in Winter

Well no shipping him back to the UK, thanks very much.

kimilseung

Jackson has been mentioned, but another future President also made a hero out of himself, Harrison, particularity among the people of the then North West and Kentucky.

On the Canadian side there was Brock, who has a Nelson style column with him atop of it on the edge of the Niagara river, looking across at the US.

Also for Canada, a woman, Laura Secord, who sneaked off to warn of an attack, although I am not sure if her warning was actually taken serious or not at the time.

The Canadian side of the mythology seems to be that the war was won by citizen militiamen, rather than by professional soldiers. The US miltias often refused to cross the border.