petitefrancaise

I saw the same thing happen in London when Thatcher removed all benefits for under 18 year olds. Almost overnight, these kids were sleeping in the doorways of shops.

Rete

Any number of circumstances could have caused her to start panhandling, i.e. divorce, lack of child support, not speaking the language makes getting a job difficult (at least one that pays well), etc.

Being in NYC 5 days a week for over 40 years, I've seen homeless men, women and children. I've seen the dressed in rags sleeping on St. Bart's church steps, forced twisted bodies begging for money only to learn that they were able to straighten up after the day's work had been done, teenagers panhandling for money to "go home", to the man who needed funds because he was underemployed and once feel for the sign and words of a young man asking passerbys for money for food for his hungry children who were at home because the food banks were too far for him to travel to to get staples. Down here in Mississippi my husband and I are running a food bank from our kitchen for two neighbors. One earns only a few hundred less than we do on social security benefits and the other is on social security disability. How do you turn away or say no to people who call you and tell you they are hungry?

fakey

I was homeless on & off for 15 years. I know or knew a lot of homeless people. And nobody wants to hear it, but homelessness is largely a consequence of personal factors, rather than a manifestation of 'the evils of capitalism'.
The posters on this thread live in arguably the wealthiest part of the world, in one of the richest times in human history. Life's not easy & this is not to dismiss anybody's pain, but decrying our 'inability to solve poverty' or feeling bad because there is suffering in the world is a posturing banality.

fakey

You think 18 year olds are entitled to free money ?

fakey

Romanian lives matter too dude

DandNHill

It's not always about affordability. Mental health can play a bit part in homelessness. It can be a huge downward spiral.

fakey

Which didn't happen, at all, btw.
Believe me, you don't want to debate the generosity of the benefits system under Lady Thatcher with me, my friend, lol

petitefrancaise

I disagree with you about feeling bad because of suffering being a posturing banality. It's empathy with fellow human beings which spurs us to try and do something. I don't know how it felt to you and I'm really sorry you experienced homelessness but even when people make bad decisions they deserve better than being cold and hungry.
I have a friend in Paris who knows many homeless people and he says a lot of these people have undiagnosed, untreated psychiatric problems. They've slipped through the support system. He does what he can.
We do what we can even if it is only to acknowledge that these people are our fellow human beings. I read that one of the worst things about having to beg is that people don't want to look at you, that you aren't seen.
Also, fakey, one of the things that really, really scares me about the USA is that it is so bloody easy to end up with nothing.
Sending hugs your way for sharing your story.

Steerpike

What were the factors that caused you to become homeless, and how did you get out of that situation?

I've determined that there are at least two distinct 'classes' of homeless people begging on the streets. There are those who are truly down on their luck, and who are desperately trying to get back on their feet. But there are also those who are choosing homelessness/begging as a lifestyle choice, preferring it to the harsh realities of living with family and working a minimum wage job. The former deserve as much help as we can give them, and I try to do my part to help them. The latter, however, are a different story. I don't know the statistical breakdown between the two classes.

I was travelling in Oregon some time back, and encountered a huge homeless population of young adults in Eugene. I was mystified why able-bodied, seemingly intelligent adults were on the street, and I started talking to them about their situation. I heard that they didn't want to be a cog in the wheel of a corporate monster like McDonalds, or working minimum wage in some local hotel. One guy told me he just 'wanted a piece of land, enough to grow his own vegetables, and be self-sufficient'. Another guy told me he had left home because his parents didn't approve of his lifestyle. There were some shelters in town, but they didn't want to stay there because those shelters had curfews, and 'no alcohol/drug' policies.

This was quite an eye-opener for me, and made me realize the situation is very complex. Again, this does not diminish the genuine suffering and need for help for many of the homeless population.

petitefrancaise

I think children aged 16 -18 years old that can't live at home and aren't in full time education deserve support. After Thatcher removed it for this age group, what the hell happened? Please do tell me what you think happened.

fakey

It may be so bloody easy to end up with nothing here, but I personally found it a place where it was so bloody easy to make money. Especially by comparison to the London/ Europe I left, even with its vast, very expensive & largely ineffectual (imho) welfare safety net. If the problem is mental illness, disordered, chaotic personal lives & the disintegration of many family units, this is a very different issue & one that is more cultural - especially in the US with its cult of the individual & sometimes ruthless personal callousness. In the UK, we threw billions of pounds at 'the homeless problem' - the streets of London were still tramped by thousands of homeless people.
Thanks for the hugs though lol

Pulaski

Italians are eligible for the VWP, whereas Romanians are not. ..... And therein lies the origins of an argument about visa-free travel between the US and the EU that us about to come to a head.

fakey

The factors that led to my experience were family problems, substance abuse & to some extent wild youthful foolishness.
The kids you talk about in Oregon are not that a-typical imho. It is, to some extent, a choice. And in my experience, for me, it was great lol. Some of the time. All that stuff about 'not being a cog in the corporate machine' etc is a bs rationalization largely for middle class kids who don't want to accept the realities of the system (who does ?). But imho we live in a culture that infantilizes people & indulges their stupidity so they can go on inhabiting an adolescence prolonged by several decades, sustained by trust funds & the wealth of American society & meanwhile many other liberal types will nod & agree & say 'it's Thatcher/ Reagan/ Trump's fault' & see it as a failure of America I see it as kind of the opposite.

fakey

I was 18 in the Thatcher years & the nasty Thatcherite government gave me a sh#t load of money. And a free place to live.
Mrs Thatcher didn't remove benefits (it would not have been politically possible for her to do so) - the benefits system in the UK has eventually been reformed, years later, started by the Blair labour gov I believe - & to some extent I agree with it. The benefits system used to be a blank check gravy train ridden by millions in Britain - the labour party fought tooth & nail against any kind of reform - & now it has happened, under the austerity climate that prevails, arguably the balance has (inevitably) swung too far the other way.
And as an illustration (to me anyway) of the failings of a massive beaurocratic benefits system, when I was first in the streets & most desperately in need, I didn't qualify, because I was too young.

fakey

This is very nice, but the trouble is, lots of people deserve lots of things.
I deserve a day off, but I ain't getting it. Largely because I'm working a 70 hr week running a business to ensure my own 16 & 18 year olds don't end up in the very situation we're talking about.