OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
May 2nd 2004, 11:15 am
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OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
I am sure many of you have been asked why this process is so complicated, why there are so many delays, etc, etc! However, a friend of mine is convinced that in applying for a marriage based visa we have complicated a very simple matter. She bases this assumption on the fact that she has a friend who has been living in America for the past twenty years without applying for any kind of visa!
Apparently, her friend returns to England for a week or two every six months, he has been doing this for twenty years and claims that the IO's at the POE have never questioned his intentions.
When I said that the VWP only allows stays for up to 90 days, she said that once in America he simply applies for an extension with the explanation that he needs to extend his stay 'to help a friend'.
Even if he had applied for a tourist visa and this allowed him to stay for six months at one time, I do not see how he would not have encountered difficulties at the POE. Afterall, it is a far stretch of the imagination to accept that someone is simply on vacation for eleven months of each year over a twenty year period!
Her friend also seems to think that those of us who apply for marriage based visas create our own problems! It is easy, you can live in America so long as you are prepared to return to your home country for a short period twice a year!
I have pointed out that the VWP is only intended to be used for tourism but she insists that the IO's at the POE are only interested in where you are going to stay during your time in America. Apparently, we could all do this, our mistake in all of this is that we were honest about our intentions and so we, and we alone, are the ones to have problems with IO's at the POE!
I do not believe the story I am being told and think that her friend is just spinning a yarn! There is no doubt that he lives in America, but I am convinced that he must have some kind of visa and for some reason is omitting this vital fact from his story.
Nevertheless, being that she is so insistent that she has her facts right, I wonder whether perhaps I am missing something? Obviously my knowledge of immigration only extends to that of marriage based visa's, and so I said I would put this scenario to the NG. So, does anyone know whether this is possible?
Apparently, her friend returns to England for a week or two every six months, he has been doing this for twenty years and claims that the IO's at the POE have never questioned his intentions.
When I said that the VWP only allows stays for up to 90 days, she said that once in America he simply applies for an extension with the explanation that he needs to extend his stay 'to help a friend'.
Even if he had applied for a tourist visa and this allowed him to stay for six months at one time, I do not see how he would not have encountered difficulties at the POE. Afterall, it is a far stretch of the imagination to accept that someone is simply on vacation for eleven months of each year over a twenty year period!
Her friend also seems to think that those of us who apply for marriage based visas create our own problems! It is easy, you can live in America so long as you are prepared to return to your home country for a short period twice a year!
I have pointed out that the VWP is only intended to be used for tourism but she insists that the IO's at the POE are only interested in where you are going to stay during your time in America. Apparently, we could all do this, our mistake in all of this is that we were honest about our intentions and so we, and we alone, are the ones to have problems with IO's at the POE!
I do not believe the story I am being told and think that her friend is just spinning a yarn! There is no doubt that he lives in America, but I am convinced that he must have some kind of visa and for some reason is omitting this vital fact from his story.
Nevertheless, being that she is so insistent that she has her facts right, I wonder whether perhaps I am missing something? Obviously my knowledge of immigration only extends to that of marriage based visa's, and so I said I would put this scenario to the NG. So, does anyone know whether this is possible?
May 2nd 2004, 11:30 am
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
In my experience, the more I travelled to the U.S. the more suspicious the immigration officer gets at the POE.
I have a good reason always, as my parents live and work in New Orleans. So I say that i'm either coming to visit my parents, or friends which is not a lie. I do leave out my fiancee.
Angie made the mistake once of mentioning she was coming to see her fiancee at London Heathrow, 45 minutes later and after a severe grilling we learned never to mention that word again.
In regards to your friends friend who's been doing this for 20 years. If they didn't have a machine readable passport (new ones they scan with the number on the bottom) then maybe her previous visits don't show up which is why its not causing alarm to the immigration officer at POE. Not sure, interesting though. So what does this person do for money and work?
I have a good reason always, as my parents live and work in New Orleans. So I say that i'm either coming to visit my parents, or friends which is not a lie. I do leave out my fiancee.
Angie made the mistake once of mentioning she was coming to see her fiancee at London Heathrow, 45 minutes later and after a severe grilling we learned never to mention that word again.
In regards to your friends friend who's been doing this for 20 years. If they didn't have a machine readable passport (new ones they scan with the number on the bottom) then maybe her previous visits don't show up which is why its not causing alarm to the immigration officer at POE. Not sure, interesting though. So what does this person do for money and work?
May 2nd 2004, 12:13 pm
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by mcjimbo
In my experience, the more I travelled to the U.S. the more suspicious the immigration officer gets at the POE.
I have a good reason always, as my parents live and work in New Orleans. So I say that i'm either coming to visit my parents, or friends which is not a lie. I do leave out my fiancee.
Angie made the mistake once of mentioning she was coming to see her fiancee at London Heathrow, 45 minutes later and after a severe grilling we learned never to mention that word again.
In regards to your friends friend who's been doing this for 20 years. If they didn't have a machine readable passport (new ones they scan with the number on the bottom) then maybe her previous visits don't show up which is why its not causing alarm to the immigration officer at POE. Not sure, interesting though. So what does this person do for money and work?
In my experience, the more I travelled to the U.S. the more suspicious the immigration officer gets at the POE.
I have a good reason always, as my parents live and work in New Orleans. So I say that i'm either coming to visit my parents, or friends which is not a lie. I do leave out my fiancee.
Angie made the mistake once of mentioning she was coming to see her fiancee at London Heathrow, 45 minutes later and after a severe grilling we learned never to mention that word again.
In regards to your friends friend who's been doing this for 20 years. If they didn't have a machine readable passport (new ones they scan with the number on the bottom) then maybe her previous visits don't show up which is why its not causing alarm to the immigration officer at POE. Not sure, interesting though. So what does this person do for money and work?
Obviously, I wouldn't know when this person last renewed their passport. So, you are saying that it is possible that the authorities might not even be aware that he has been living in America for six months at a time over such a long period of time? If that were the case then the IO at the POE would only be aware of the stamps in his passport, and that would only show two visits per year, which would not be a cause for suspicion. However, I then wonder what return ticket he enters with, as surely one dated 6 months later would result in him being questioned? To be honest, I am surprised that so little information is available to the IO just because you don't have a machine readable passport!
In answer to your question, this person has been working in America for the last twenty years, but this work is for his 'friend' and therefore only he and his friend (and, of course, everyone else that he tells his story to!) is aware of the fact that he is working illegally.
May 2nd 2004, 1:14 pm
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by 207lonsdale
I am sure many of you have been asked why this process is so complicated, why there are so many delays, etc, etc! However, a friend of mine is convinced that in applying for a marriage based visa we have complicated a very simple matter. She bases this assumption on the fact that she has a friend who has been living in America for the past twenty years without applying for any kind of visa!
Apparently, her friend returns to England for a week or two every six months, he has been doing this for twenty years and claims that the IO's at the POE have never questioned his intentions.
When I said that the VWP only allows stays for up to 90 days, she said that once in America he simply applies for an extension with the explanation that he needs to extend his stay 'to help a friend'.
Even if he had applied for a tourist visa and this allowed him to stay for six months at one time, I do not see how he would not have encountered difficulties at the POE. Afterall, it is a far stretch of the imagination to accept that someone is simply on vacation for eleven months of each year over a twenty year period!
Her friend also seems to think that those of us who apply for marriage based visas create our own problems! It is easy, you can live in America so long as you are prepared to return to your home country for a short period twice a year!
I have pointed out that the VWP is only intended to be used for tourism but she insists that the IO's at the POE are only interested in where you are going to stay during your time in America. Apparently, we could all do this, our mistake in all of this is that we were honest about our intentions and so we, and we alone, are the ones to have problems with IO's at the POE!
I do not believe the story I am being told and think that her friend is just spinning a yarn! There is no doubt that he lives in America, but I am convinced that he must have some kind of visa and for some reason is omitting this vital fact from his story.
Nevertheless, being that she is so insistent that she has her facts right, I wonder whether perhaps I am missing something? Obviously my knowledge of immigration only extends to that of marriage based visa's, and so I said I would put this scenario to the NG. So, does anyone know whether this is possible?
I am sure many of you have been asked why this process is so complicated, why there are so many delays, etc, etc! However, a friend of mine is convinced that in applying for a marriage based visa we have complicated a very simple matter. She bases this assumption on the fact that she has a friend who has been living in America for the past twenty years without applying for any kind of visa!
Apparently, her friend returns to England for a week or two every six months, he has been doing this for twenty years and claims that the IO's at the POE have never questioned his intentions.
When I said that the VWP only allows stays for up to 90 days, she said that once in America he simply applies for an extension with the explanation that he needs to extend his stay 'to help a friend'.
Even if he had applied for a tourist visa and this allowed him to stay for six months at one time, I do not see how he would not have encountered difficulties at the POE. Afterall, it is a far stretch of the imagination to accept that someone is simply on vacation for eleven months of each year over a twenty year period!
Her friend also seems to think that those of us who apply for marriage based visas create our own problems! It is easy, you can live in America so long as you are prepared to return to your home country for a short period twice a year!
I have pointed out that the VWP is only intended to be used for tourism but she insists that the IO's at the POE are only interested in where you are going to stay during your time in America. Apparently, we could all do this, our mistake in all of this is that we were honest about our intentions and so we, and we alone, are the ones to have problems with IO's at the POE!
I do not believe the story I am being told and think that her friend is just spinning a yarn! There is no doubt that he lives in America, but I am convinced that he must have some kind of visa and for some reason is omitting this vital fact from his story.
Nevertheless, being that she is so insistent that she has her facts right, I wonder whether perhaps I am missing something? Obviously my knowledge of immigration only extends to that of marriage based visa's, and so I said I would put this scenario to the NG. So, does anyone know whether this is possible?
Ubran legends are created from the stories of a "friend of a friend."
VWT is for 90 days only as you note, no extensions. However, a B-2 tourist entry with a visa can be extended. Brits used to be issued "indefinite, multiple entry" B-2 visas before the advent of the MRV's. However, all of those visas were converted into 10 year visas by regulation and have since expired. [If a person managed to board a plane with such an "exired" indefinite visa, they would probably be paroled in if they truly didn't know].
I wonder about the times given. However, given certain circumstances, it is possible under limited situations to spend extensive time in the US on a B-2 -- there ARE retired "snow-birds" who winter in the US.
May 2nd 2004, 1:47 pm
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
In message <[email protected]>, Folinskyinla
<member4043@british_expats.com> writes
>Brits used to
>be issued "indefinite, multiple entry" B-2 visas before the advent of
>the MRV's. However, all of those visas were converted into 10 year
>visas by regulation and have since expired. [If a person managed to
>board a plane with such an "exired" indefinite visa, they would probably
>be paroled in if they truly didn't know].
On my first visit after the introduction of VWP [before my B-2 was 10
years old] it was cancelled "without prejudice" at the POE, and I was
told to use the VWP next time. I asked if I could get a "new" B-2 from
the Embassy in London, as it was more convenient than VWP for me, and
the POE said "no, they will refuse to issue you one if you qualify under
VWP".
--
Roland Perry
<member4043@british_expats.com> writes
>Brits used to
>be issued "indefinite, multiple entry" B-2 visas before the advent of
>the MRV's. However, all of those visas were converted into 10 year
>visas by regulation and have since expired. [If a person managed to
>board a plane with such an "exired" indefinite visa, they would probably
>be paroled in if they truly didn't know].
On my first visit after the introduction of VWP [before my B-2 was 10
years old] it was cancelled "without prejudice" at the POE, and I was
told to use the VWP next time. I asked if I could get a "new" B-2 from
the Embassy in London, as it was more convenient than VWP for me, and
the POE said "no, they will refuse to issue you one if you qualify under
VWP".
--
Roland Perry
May 2nd 2004, 1:58 pm
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by Folinskyinla
Hi:
Ubran legends are created from the stories of a "friend of a friend."
VWT is for 90 days only as you note, no extensions. However, a B-2 tourist entry with a visa can be extended. Brits used to be issued "indefinite, multiple entry" B-2 visas before the advent of the MRV's. However, all of those visas were converted into 10 year visas by regulation and have since expired. [If a person managed to board a plane with such an "exired" indefinite visa, they would probably be paroled in if they truly didn't know].
I wonder about the times given. However, given certain circumstances, it is possible under limited situations to spend extensive time in the US on a B-2 -- there ARE retired "snow-birds" who winter in the US.
Hi:
Ubran legends are created from the stories of a "friend of a friend."
VWT is for 90 days only as you note, no extensions. However, a B-2 tourist entry with a visa can be extended. Brits used to be issued "indefinite, multiple entry" B-2 visas before the advent of the MRV's. However, all of those visas were converted into 10 year visas by regulation and have since expired. [If a person managed to board a plane with such an "exired" indefinite visa, they would probably be paroled in if they truly didn't know].
I wonder about the times given. However, given certain circumstances, it is possible under limited situations to spend extensive time in the US on a B-2 -- there ARE retired "snow-birds" who winter in the US.
I didn't realise that the the VWP could not be extended, thank you for pointing this out! Given that my friend insists she has her facts correct and that this person has never applied for any kind of visa, he must be travelling on the VWP; thus his claim to extend the 90 days allowance to 'help a friend' cannot be correct.
To be honest, I tend to get irritated when she regards our actions in applying for a marriage based visa as not being necessary and only for those who want to bring complication to a simple issue.
Perhaps the point you have raised might make her question the validity of her friend's story, rather than just assume that we are all stupid.
May 2nd 2004, 4:30 pm
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by 207lonsdale
I didn't realise that the the VWP could not be extended, thank you for pointing this out! Given that my friend insists she has her facts correct and that this person has never applied for any kind of visa, he must be travelling on the VWP; thus his claim to extend the 90 days allowance to 'help a friend' cannot be correct.
To be honest, I tend to get irritated when she regards our actions in applying for a marriage based visa as not being necessary and only for those who want to bring complication to a simple issue.
Perhaps the point you have raised might make her question the validity of her friend's story, rather than just assume that we are all stupid.
I didn't realise that the the VWP could not be extended, thank you for pointing this out! Given that my friend insists she has her facts correct and that this person has never applied for any kind of visa, he must be travelling on the VWP; thus his claim to extend the 90 days allowance to 'help a friend' cannot be correct.
To be honest, I tend to get irritated when she regards our actions in applying for a marriage based visa as not being necessary and only for those who want to bring complication to a simple issue.
Perhaps the point you have raised might make her question the validity of her friend's story, rather than just assume that we are all stupid.
May 2nd 2004, 4:54 pm
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by mcjimbo
Hey if he or she pisses you off enough let INS know about this dodgy character
Hey if he or she pisses you off enough let INS know about this dodgy character
I am not 'educated', or perhaps it would be better to say that I don't have several letters after my name, whereas my friend does. So, in a situation such as this, I am made to feel as though I don't know what I am talking about. To be honest it is all rather silly, but this subject has been raised so many times that I finally decided to try and find out whether there was any truth behind it!
May 2nd 2004, 5:32 pm
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by 207lonsdale
The situation only irritates me!
I am not 'educated', or perhaps it would be better to say that I don't have several letters after my name, whereas my friend does. So, in a situation such as this, I am made to feel as though I don't know what I am talking about. To be honest it is all rather silly, but this subject has been raised so many times that I finally decided to try and find out whether there was any truth behind it!
The situation only irritates me!
I am not 'educated', or perhaps it would be better to say that I don't have several letters after my name, whereas my friend does. So, in a situation such as this, I am made to feel as though I don't know what I am talking about. To be honest it is all rather silly, but this subject has been raised so many times that I finally decided to try and find out whether there was any truth behind it!
But at the end of the day it seems highly unlikely that its all fact more like Chinese Whispers lol.
I don;t doubt what you have been told or your friend either just reckon that there is more too it
Anyways neally everyone has a machine readable passport these days so he will come un stuck soon lol and when you have a new passport that little bar code at the bottom, will reveal all past visits as they just get transfered from the expired or lost passport to another, so I have been told??...........
oh wait now I am making Chinese Whispers Lol.
Susanna
May 2nd 2004, 5:36 pm
#10
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
I am not british but I had a multiple-entry visa good for 10 years which always let me go in no questions asked...
After meeting my boyfriend and starting to date, I was spending most of my time in the States just to be with him for about 2 years, only going home every 4 months or so to take care of bills and to not break the 6-month-in-the-USA rule and stay within legal limits -or so I thought. I never knew I was in fact breaking the law by practically living here instead of home.
Soon enough I was stopped and questioned on the frequency of my travels and the lengths of my stays, even though I never ever said I was visiting a boyfriend, I was always here on vacation, researching my thesis, or visiting parents, sister or friends, which were also true.
I find it very difficult to believe many of us were detected of pulling this after year or two (whether intentional or not, and by the way some even got deported on the spot) yet some guy could pull this off for 20 years, not to mention in the height of post-sept-11 paranoia.
And I too got the "you're making your life too difficult by applying for the fiancee visa" bit. My sister and at least three of her friends married americans while on student or tourist visas and just adjusted status after marrying. With zero complications so far.
Me, I have a very loud Jimminy Cricket. I can't do something I know is wrong, even if it means less pain/time/money and even if I really want to. What I've done wrong I've done out of ignorance of the law, but I made sure to make it right afterwards.
After meeting my boyfriend and starting to date, I was spending most of my time in the States just to be with him for about 2 years, only going home every 4 months or so to take care of bills and to not break the 6-month-in-the-USA rule and stay within legal limits -or so I thought. I never knew I was in fact breaking the law by practically living here instead of home.
Soon enough I was stopped and questioned on the frequency of my travels and the lengths of my stays, even though I never ever said I was visiting a boyfriend, I was always here on vacation, researching my thesis, or visiting parents, sister or friends, which were also true.
I find it very difficult to believe many of us were detected of pulling this after year or two (whether intentional or not, and by the way some even got deported on the spot) yet some guy could pull this off for 20 years, not to mention in the height of post-sept-11 paranoia.
And I too got the "you're making your life too difficult by applying for the fiancee visa" bit. My sister and at least three of her friends married americans while on student or tourist visas and just adjusted status after marrying. With zero complications so far.
Me, I have a very loud Jimminy Cricket. I can't do something I know is wrong, even if it means less pain/time/money and even if I really want to. What I've done wrong I've done out of ignorance of the law, but I made sure to make it right afterwards.
May 2nd 2004, 7:45 pm
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by bequibar
I am not british but I had a multiple-entry visa good for 10 years which always let me go in no questions asked...
After meeting my boyfriend and starting to date, I was spending most of my time in the States just to be with him for about 2 years, only going home every 4 months or so to take care of bills and to not break the 6-month-in-the-USA rule and stay within legal limits -or so I thought. I never knew I was in fact breaking the law by practically living here instead of home.
Soon enough I was stopped and questioned on the frequency of my travels and the lengths of my stays, even though I never ever said I was visiting a boyfriend, I was always here on vacation, researching my thesis, or visiting parents, sister or friends, which were also true.
I find it very difficult to believe many of us were detected of pulling this after year or two (whether intentional or not, and by the way some even got deported on the spot) yet some guy could pull this off for 20 years, not to mention in the height of post-sept-11 paranoia.
And I too got the "you're making your life too difficult by applying for the fiancee visa" bit. My sister and at least three of her friends married americans while on student or tourist visas and just adjusted status after marrying. With zero complications so far.
Me, I have a very loud Jimminy Cricket. I can't do something I know is wrong, even if it means less pain/time/money and even if I really want to. What I've done wrong I've done out of ignorance of the law, but I made sure to make it right afterwards.
I am not british but I had a multiple-entry visa good for 10 years which always let me go in no questions asked...
After meeting my boyfriend and starting to date, I was spending most of my time in the States just to be with him for about 2 years, only going home every 4 months or so to take care of bills and to not break the 6-month-in-the-USA rule and stay within legal limits -or so I thought. I never knew I was in fact breaking the law by practically living here instead of home.
Soon enough I was stopped and questioned on the frequency of my travels and the lengths of my stays, even though I never ever said I was visiting a boyfriend, I was always here on vacation, researching my thesis, or visiting parents, sister or friends, which were also true.
I find it very difficult to believe many of us were detected of pulling this after year or two (whether intentional or not, and by the way some even got deported on the spot) yet some guy could pull this off for 20 years, not to mention in the height of post-sept-11 paranoia.
And I too got the "you're making your life too difficult by applying for the fiancee visa" bit. My sister and at least three of her friends married americans while on student or tourist visas and just adjusted status after marrying. With zero complications so far.
Me, I have a very loud Jimminy Cricket. I can't do something I know is wrong, even if it means less pain/time/money and even if I really want to. What I've done wrong I've done out of ignorance of the law, but I made sure to make it right afterwards.
Based upon your description, you were on the bleeding edge of a "legal" visit. I would not have said you were "breaking the law" but the POE inspectors were justified in questioning it and they happen to have absolute power.
May 3rd 2004, 2:04 pm
#12
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by 207lonsdale
Her friend also seems to think that those of us who apply for marriage based visas create our own problems!
Her friend also seems to think that those of us who apply for marriage based visas create our own problems!
Ah well!Juliet
May 3rd 2004, 3:18 pm
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by 207lonsdale
To be honest, I tend to get irritated when she regards our actions in applying for a marriage based visa as not being necessary and only for those who want to bring complication to a simple issue.
Perhaps the point you have raised might make her question the validity of her friend's story, rather than just assume that we are all stupid.
To be honest, I tend to get irritated when she regards our actions in applying for a marriage based visa as not being necessary and only for those who want to bring complication to a simple issue.
Perhaps the point you have raised might make her question the validity of her friend's story, rather than just assume that we are all stupid.
May 3rd 2004, 3:39 pm
#14
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by bequibar
Me, I have a very loud Jimminy Cricket. I can't do something I know is wrong, even if it means less pain/time/money and even if I really want to. What I've done wrong I've done out of ignorance of the law, but I made sure to make it right afterwards.
Me, I have a very loud Jimminy Cricket. I can't do something I know is wrong, even if it means less pain/time/money and even if I really want to. What I've done wrong I've done out of ignorance of the law, but I made sure to make it right afterwards.
Kate. xxxxx
May 3rd 2004, 5:31 pm
#15
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Re: OT: Are we all stupid? ;)
Originally posted by NevAnna
Why is it all of the sudden folks become experts on something they know nothing about? This always irritates me...
Why is it all of the sudden folks become experts on something they know nothing about? This always irritates me...
*sigh*
I didn't even bother telling her anything about the AOS process.
We've also gotten some comments about how England is a "friendly" country and why in the world would it take SOOO long to bring him over from there? "There's got to be someone you can call, have you checked that out???"
As much as you try to educate people regarding this process, unless they are going through it themselves, they will never truly understand. But put yourself in their places: would *you* have believed this before you did it yourself? I wouldn't have!
~SecretGarden