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Old Sep 18th 2017, 6:43 am   #46
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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No connection? Well the people driving vans and trucks into crowds of people aren't C of E lily white Anglo-Saxons are they ?
So you are equating 'dark people' with 'terrorist' then.

Did you do that at the time of the Irish troubles; 'white people' = 'terrorist'?
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 6:43 am   #47
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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No connection? Well the people driving vans and trucks into crowds of people aren't C of E lily white Anglo-Saxons are they ?
The riggt wing nutter who drove into worshippers outside of a mosque in Finsbury was.
The nutter who shot Joe Cox was.
Both sharing views just as extremes as the radicalized Islamist.
I heard another suggestion BBC that it was time that the UK started to 'de diversify its population and start returning immigrants to their country of origin including UK born but of migrant parentage.
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 8:48 am   #48
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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The riggt wing nutter who drove into worshippers outside of a mosque in Finsbury was.
The nutter who shot Joe Cox was.
Both sharing views just as extremes as the radicalized Islamist.
This focus on "terrorism" is just the latest trick in the racists toolbox, use the fear of attack to encourage division. The fact that IS and their ilk are still killing far more Iraqis and Syrians in one day than they have ever killed in the UK has nothing to do with it......
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I heard another suggestion BBC that it was time that the UK started to 'de diversify its population and start returning immigrants to their country of origin including UK born but of migrant parentage.
This has long been the agenda of the extreme right; No question whether you're integrated or not, if you're black (or anything else they don't like) you're out.
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 11:20 am   #49
 
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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No connection? Well the people driving vans and trucks into crowds of people aren't C of E lily white Anglo-Saxons are they ?
Are you really suggesting that a form of genetic diversity that determines skin colour, along with ethnicity and national origin, determines violent or criminal behaviour? Because that is what you have said. And C of E?

I think the Archbishop of York might like a word with you. Or not.
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 11:57 am   #50
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

Immigration should always be a controlled trickle rather than a wave as assimilation and integration takes time and patience. Large inflows of people, any kind of people, is overwhelming for a society, any society, if left unchecked. The locals protesting against mass tourism in Barcelona evidence of one such example.

I had no problem with my student daughter bringing a friend home for the weekend, however untidy they were, as it was manageable. But I'd balk at half a dozen staying for a week as it was more likely to get out of hand and because it affected our quality of life, and not because I have a problem with students.

Some people have a genuine desire to sustain their society and culture, are fearful of change, and others are purely racist or xenophobic. One group feeds off the other and that's the problem.
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 12:18 pm   #51
 
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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Immigration should always be a controlled trickle rather than a wave as assimilation and integration takes time and patience. Large inflows of people, any kind of people, is overwhelming for a society, any society, if left unchecked. The locals protesting against mass tourism in Barcelona evidence of one such example.

I had no problem with my student daughter bringing a friend home for the weekend, however untidy they were, as it was manageable. But I'd balk at half a dozen staying for a week as it was more likely to get out of hand and because it affected our quality of life, and not because I have a problem with students.

Some people have a genuine desire to sustain their society and culture, are fearful of change, and others are purely racist or xenophobic. One group feeds off the other and that's the problem.
And none of this, whether one agrees with yoyr comments or not, causes things like bombings. Those have other causes.
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 1:16 pm   #52
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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Originally Posted by iano View Post
Immigration should always be a controlled trickle rather than a wave as assimilation and integration takes time and patience. Large inflows of people, any kind of people, is overwhelming for a society, any society, if left unchecked. The locals protesting against mass tourism in Barcelona evidence of one such example.

I had no problem with my student daughter bringing a friend home for the weekend, however untidy they were, as it was manageable. But I'd balk at half a dozen staying for a week as it was more likely to get out of hand and because it affected our quality of life, and not because I have a problem with students.

Some people have a genuine desire to sustain their society and culture, are fearful of change, and others are purely racist or xenophobic. One group feeds off the other and that's the problem.
Good post !

I think there is nothing wrong with any group wishing to sustain their society and culture. I remember years ago in Bali the concern from locals about the number of Australian tourists and residents and effect on the culture. Certainly wasnt racist though perhaps xenophobic in some ways.
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 1:34 pm   #53
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

Can we not just all cry Allahu Akbar and get on?
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 1:44 pm   #54
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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Originally Posted by iano View Post
Immigration should always be a controlled trickle rather than a wave as assimilation and integration takes time and patience. Large inflows of people, any kind of people, is overwhelming for a society, any society, if left unchecked. The locals protesting against mass tourism in Barcelona evidence of one such example.

I had no problem with my student daughter bringing a friend home for the weekend, however untidy they were, as it was manageable. But I'd balk at half a dozen staying for a week as it was more likely to get out of hand and because it affected our quality of life, and not because I have a problem with students.

Some people have a genuine desire to sustain their society and culture, are fearful of change, and others are purely racist or xenophobic. One group feeds off the other and that's the problem.
In part, I agree with you - in an ideal world. However, the destabilization of the Middle-East is a fact, the mass displacement of people is a fact - and it isn't those fleeing who caused the problem. So how do you deal with the real-world situation? Pull up the drawbridge, close your eyes to the deaths, block your ears to the screams? (Maybe easier if you're in California, unless the Mexicans kick off...)

If you're in Greece, faced with boatloads of people and bodies washing up on your shores, it's rather different. So then, what do we do - leave it as Greece's problem? Send them back (back where?) ..... if only life was as simple as you'd like.....
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 1:51 pm   #55
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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I think there is nothing wrong with any group wishing to sustain their society and culture. I remember years ago in Bali the concern from locals about the number of Australian tourists and residents and effect on the culture. Certainly wasnt racist though perhaps xenophobic in some ways.
There are about 15% immigrants in the UK - and actually a lower percentage than in Ireland. Most of these are not muslims - so, again, why the issue now?

Something about sustaining "culture" (or should that be Kultur) makes the hairs stand up on the back of my neck.....
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 1:52 pm   #56
 
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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There are about 15% immigrants in the UK - and actually a lower percentage than in Ireland. Most of these are not muslims - so, again, why the issue now?

Something about sustaining "culture" (or should that be Kultur) makes the hairs stand up on the back of my neck.....
The volk.
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 1:56 pm   #57
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

Parsons Green tube attack: arrested man named as Yahyah Farroukh
Suspect, 21, thought to be from Syria and had reportedly lived with other arrested man at Sunbury foster carers’ home

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...ahyah-farroukh
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 3:01 pm   #58
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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it isn't those fleeing who caused the problem. So how do you deal with the real-world situation?
By 'doing our bit', and then attempt to address the root cause of the problem.

I'd happily buy a sandwich for a homeless person but wouldn't offer him use of our spare room, and I shall no longer vote Tory in its present guise.

Similarly, the UK should take its fair share of refugees in a crisis, in agreed manageable proportions along with all its European partners. It should then take a good hard look at foreign policy and its effects. Arguably, one of which is native-born as well as immigrant bombers.
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 3:38 pm   #59
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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There are about 15% immigrants in the UK - and actually a lower percentage than in Ireland. Most of these are not muslims - so, again, why the issue now?

Something about sustaining "culture" (or should that be Kultur) makes the hairs stand up on the back of my neck.....
There is an issue of dealing with Islamic terrorism so that is the issue- what contributes to it now , and in the future, and how to deal with it.

Well, reasonable people can have different opinions whether they wish to maintain the prevailing culture, or adopt another, or create a new one.

The Islamists and many average Muslims quite believe their religious ideology provides an overall way to live, political governance, a moral code that can be enforced with Sharia law. Certainly one could debate the merits or faults of society run in such a way, but definitely a different society that most in the West would prefer. Is it unreasonable say in Sweden or Germany to debate whether one wishes to maintain the existing culture, or bring in enough people with a different worldview to fundamentally change things ?
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Old Sep 18th 2017, 3:50 pm   #60
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Default Re: Bomb Explodes on London Tube

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There is an issue of dealing with Islamic terrorism so that is the issue- what contributes to it now , and in the future, and how to deal with it.
I'd say not selling arms to them or their supporters might help. This genie was let out of the box by the CIA as a cracking ploy to have a pop at the soviets and they haven't got it back in yet.....

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The Islamists and many average Muslims quite believe their religious ideology provides an overall way to live, political governance, a moral code that can be enforced with Sharia law. Certainly one could debate the merits or faults of society run in such a way, but definitely a different society that most in the West would prefer. Is it unreasonable say in Sweden or Germany to debate whether one wishes to maintain the existing culture, or bring in enough people with a different worldview to fundamentally change things ?
Most muslims I know believe that one should abide by the law of the land and sharia, if applicable at all, should only apply to muslims. To fundamentally change the position would require a population far in excess of the 15% that covers ALL immigrants into the UK, so regardless of the vocal few who provide headlines for the Daily Mail, it's a non-issue.
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