tebo53

BE is an exceptional forum to aquire valid and honest information and imho I don't think it should be a platform to encourage members to live in Spain illegally or how to avoid paying their taxes etc, etc.
Steve

Fred James

I don't see anyone suggesting evading taxes, quite the opposite by pointing out that you become tax resident, de facto.

As for not registering, in theory, that is illegal, but I am sure you will find that the police take a very pragmatic view about high spending Brits being in their country for a few months without registering (which costs them time and money to administer registration). They probably treat Romanian burglars slightly differently!

lurchio

Its a matter of personal choice if you stay below the radar, or do things 'compliantly'. There are two separate issues. Registering to remain over 90 days (aka 'Residency', but its NOT really as you are currently an EU citizen with the right to free movement within the Community), its just that Spain require you to register after 90 Continuous days, or in fact on the first day you are here if you intend staying permanently for over 90 days, but that's being fussy I guess and I can't see how that can ever be proven. That's hardly enforceable and as I said previously, you can start and stop / restart the 90 days if you are concerned.


What happens in the case of a 'hard Brexit' to the above is anyones guess at the moment, but IF the right to freedom of movement goes as part of the final deal, the extreme scenario may be that there will be a lot of 'illegal immigrants' in Spain with UK passports!!!!!! That's the extreme in my opinion, however.


The 183 days 'de facto' TAX residency, to me, is the one to watch really. Again, probably thousands of people live in Spain permanently without being tax resident (even though, by definition, they certainly ARE), depends how you like to sleep at night and basically your attitude to risk.


To be clear,I am not suggesting that applies to you, or anyone else on here.


The whole point of the matter is that everything could be okay, until such time as a person may draw attention to themselves and then the system will close in on you.


My Scottish friend, found himself in such a 'pickle' two years ago. It started over the sale of his house, and purchase of another and other matters that I won't go into here, but they were connected with his living in Spain (under the radar, business wise).


The Agencia Tributaria operate on an adverse 'burden of proof', in other words, they tell you what they think you have done and what you need to pay to put matters right, and you have to prove that their version is not the case. In other words. 'Guilty until proven innocent'. Fred, you can correct me here, but you may even have to pay and fight for the money back! to do this they used:


1. Bank account transactions including Cash machine withdrawals , get out of that one..... (they have access, can even RAID your account for their fines if they please)
2. Electricity bills (they have access to these, you could say family were there to use the electricity, again PROVE it... can you hear the spade digging?)
3. Facebook (in the public domain, used the same as the UK for investigations where there is reasonable grounds) Lovely pictures of him, always in Spain
4. Mobile phone records (again access with reasonable grounds, like the UK)
5. They were obviously linked to the UK systems during the investigation (Spain have an agreement with the UK to share info of all sorts), just to get the rope tighter, the DSS in the UK also prosecuted him for fraud based on the Haciendas interest and information.
6. Traced every flight in and out of Spain (wondered why you passport number and DOB is required?)
7. Checked when he purchased cars etc., or in fact any time his NIE number was used in Spain.


You may say he was unlucky and an isolated case, but its that easy when attention is drawn to a person. I cannot believe that Hacienda are big time 'pro active' (but it was said that they were carrying out pro active checks on non Spanish in the CdS), but Good enough for me that lot was!


Tax fraud is tax fraud, in the UK, 'manana' Spain or anywhere else in the World.


Anyway, not scaremongering or moralising (far from it), but I sleep great! I also put something back into the lovely Country I am pleased to call home, apart of course from the VAT everybody pays anyway. (Guess that was moralising , there!)


My view, anyway.

Reeders

Am I missing something here or is everyone ignoring Brexit?

Two years from now, Brits who want to winter in Spain or anywhere else in the EU will be limited in the same way as anyone from any other non-EU country. That means 90 days in any 180 calendar day period for all the Schengen countries combined. So no, pop over the border to Portugal or wherever and back.

Rosemary

Yes you are missing something here........the fact that at the present time NO-ONE knows what will happen in the future regarding Brexit. So your statement is a supposition not a fact.

Rosemary

Reeders

Well I know it is an unknown Rosemary but people seem to be writing AS IF it is a known and that it will be a favourable outcome in regards to this thread's topic. There is no more evidence of that than that it will not be a favourable outcome.

The chances of both sides agreeing to 'freedom of movement' are pretty low I'd say. So I don't see how this topic can be discussed and ignore that possibility entirely as has been the case on this thread other than by lurchio.

missile

Some of us like to abide by the law and observe the rules :-)

lurchio

We've all been there, more questions than answers. If someone uses the forum to get an answer my feeling is they should get the correct and (as best we can) legal answer. Its up to them after that as regards whether they follow it, or otherwise.

Bridie55

Just do what's right and legal. Stay within 90 days or within 183 days Flights are cheap what are you trying to cheat on. Maybe I'm too honest by abiding rules but there you go...

tebo53

I fully agree with you and missile. If you want to be here in this great country then do the right thing.....