crispy

oh well we all know about you oh bloody hell you have hijacked this thread again

Mark Paddon

The authors of this book http://gardeninginspain.com/14/your-garden-in-spain/ live near me and have written books on fruit and veg growing too. I saw them power walking through the village this morning and they certainly look healthy. They are now respected authorities on gardening in Spain and I know they promote natural pesticides etc. I am sure they can help you towards your good life goals!

livit

Last night watched Grand Designs on Channel 4 about a couple who bought a plot of land in Brittany, France.

They built there property using old tyres, which were given free too them and reclaimed materials.

The house looked fantastic, they used traditional methods which used earth to insulate and mixed a render made from earth, hair etc.

Labour was advertised on the net, so people arrived, worked for free and built the most of the labour intensive sections.

Total project cost £150,000.00, which was far cheaper for the same build in the UK.

I had to chuckle though when the subject of planning was mentioned, in the UK they had no chance, but French planning laws mean that if you can build what you want, if it falls down, thats your fault.

jowalker

Thanks for that Mark. Have had a look at their site before and am thinking of buying their book as it seems to cover everything we need to know. Haven't had much experience so need all the help I can get!

bil

To hell with the natural stuff. God gave us Roundup/glyphospahates and systemic pesticides, and I use them carefully but with joy.

I have woolly aphid on my orange trees at the moment, and anyone who wants to get them rid by natural methods is welcome to try. I could do with a good laugh.

rugbymatt

found this link, thought it might help decide the sort of thing that can be grown happily......

cavecritter

brilliant

jowalker

Thanks for that - very handy!

fionamw

:curse::curse::curse:

ok, soapbox moment done....

Brilliant list, but don't forget altitude, prevailing wind directions, frost pockets, depth of soil not to mention soil type, tendency of foraging goats (and wild boar, yes...) to make for tempting new morsels. Not everything that grows in Spain grows everywhere in Spain (at least not without a greenhouse & lots of loving care)

bil

Que? Roundup is an excellent aid, and doesn´t poison the soil, or kill anything except plants.

As for the systemic, well, you need less and they are more effective. Tell me something that will hit woolly aphid or leaf miners as well.

rugbymatt

I think Fiona is after a more organic solution to an organic problem.

fionamw

bil

It is an organic solution if the chemicals concerned are carbon based.

I hate the woolly terminology. Organic chemistry is the chemistry of carbon, and the organic farmers now want to be able to use pre 50s chems, or something, which were worse than the current ones, so I am told.

As for natural, that one just makes me heave. Atomic power, strychnine, arsenic, all are natural. Gardens and fruit trees are NOT natural in the slightest.

rugbymatt

I'm wondering if its worth arguing with you or just agreeing with you.....

fionamw

Gardens may not be, though that too could be debated ad infinitum; but I think you'll find fruit trees are, me old son!


I can't imagine any organic gardener or farmer of my acquaintance even considering using pre 50s or any other chems to use that word..... given that words seem to be the problem. Organic? Natural? Chemical? Biodegradable? Ok I get the point that definitions do sometimes make a difference but quite honestly we're not debating nuclear fusion or reinventing the wheel, most keen gardeners or horticulturalists would know what is usually meant by organic (sorry to use that word) and even if they try to tweak/cheat what they use sometimes, would know whether it was truly the organic solution. I imagine we'd have rather an unwieldy sentence or indeed paragraph if we tried to produce a pedantic accurate definition of what most people consider organic:

Harmless for non-target insects and other animals;
most obviously biodegradable without causing harm to harmless plants and animals; produced using 'natural' (sorry) non-chemical (sorry again) ingredients..........etc etc.



Just seen yours, RM.