Go Back   British Expats / Living & Moving Abroad / Europe / Scandinavia

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old May 15th 2017, 10:33 am   #16
BE Forum Addict
 
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,064
Moses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMak View Post
Can you elaborate about the overall trends and why they are seen as negative, thats what I really need to understand. Its the same here, anywhere in the UK you go I can feel, see and sense its not going well...buts that because I live and work here so for any other country be interesting to see whats going on beneath the surface....and why?

Ireland a consideration for sure for many reasons. My youngest is only a few months so thats all good, older kids are staying in UK with my ex, so its only the little one that would move.

Every country will have it's flaws and people will be people and always moan about something. Well, Ireland isn't tiny if you look at population compared to Norway. Anyone I know who complained about prices here, complained about prices in Norway. Again it will depend on the individual, what they earn and how they live.




After a short visit to the UK, I really appreciate what a great country Ireland is and know that it was the right decision to come here. Yes, even with all the flaws and challenges (you will find in any country), for me personally it was a very easy move. Yes, I know that I won't have the same services in the West of Ireland if I compare to a populated area of the UK but that's also the beauty of it and I knew that before I moved.


Overall the job situation is good in the larger cities and you have so much beauty on the doorstep. Of course housing can be expensive in cities like Dublin but you'd have the same challenges in Rejkjavik or Oslo and maybe even worse. I don't find shopping expensive here and Aldi/Lidl are opening more stores all the time and very easy with online shopping from UK compared to the other mentioned countries.
Moses2013 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th 2017, 1:36 pm   #17
Lt Col (Retd)
Premium Member
 
Pulaski's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Dixie, ex UK
Posts: 42,909
Pulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMak View Post
For us the UK is going backwards in so many ways, not just possibly financially but socially and thats a genuine worry. Attached with safety, education and so much else ....
The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence, eh?

If/ when you move to another country you will find that there are similar issues there too, and others that you maybe hadn't even considered. No country anywhere the EFTA free travel area (EU+4) is ideal/perfect as if it was everyone would be moving there.

Ironically if you measure the "quality of life" of a country by its attractiveness to immigrants and therefore migrant inflow from other countries in Europe, then the UK is probably a better place than any country in Europe to live and work.
__________________
As quoted in the Grauniad.

Last edited by Pulaski; May 15th 2017 at 1:46 pm.
Pulaski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th 2017, 1:43 pm   #18
BE Forum Addict
 
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 3,285
morpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMak View Post
Can you elaborate about the overall trends and why they are seen as negative, thats what I really need to understand. Its the same here, anywhere in the UK you go I can feel, see and sense its not going well...buts that because I live and work here so for any other country be interesting to see whats going on beneath the surface....and why?

Ireland a consideration for sure for many reasons. My youngest is only a few months so thats all good, older kids are staying in UK with my ex, so its only the little one that would move.
One trend is employment in the area you have experience or expertise in, The other is trends in either cities vs rural areas. I think for trends besides visiting speaking with people living in the area especially expats, and reading various newspaper articles a good start. As I wrote I think defining what it is about lifestyle that matters, comparing each issue, and its importance.

Education seems to be of a higher quality in Norway, Sweden and Finland, competition for employment I don't know.
morpeth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th 2017, 1:58 pm   #19
BE Forum Addict
 
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,064
Moses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by morpeth View Post
One trend is employment in the area you have experience or expertise in, The other is trends in either cities vs rural areas. I think for trends besides visiting speaking with people living in the area especially expats, and reading various newspaper articles a good start. As I wrote I think defining what it is about lifestyle that matters, comparing each issue, and its importance.

Education seems to be of a higher quality in Norway, Sweden and Finland, competition for employment I don't know.

Indeed these countries do seem to offer more services for children, or let's say the higher taxes help to provide better services in these areas. Then again the money saved in other areas by living in the UK, would make up for that and if you can't find a job due to language, pointless having better day care for children.
Moses2013 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 15th 2017, 4:03 pm   #20
BE Forum Addict
 
Joined: May 2012
Location: Cayman Islands
Posts: 3,255
Gordon Barlow has a reputation beyond reputeGordon Barlow has a reputation beyond reputeGordon Barlow has a reputation beyond reputeGordon Barlow has a reputation beyond reputeGordon Barlow has a reputation beyond reputeGordon Barlow has a reputation beyond reputeGordon Barlow has a reputation beyond reputeGordon Barlow has a reputation beyond reputeGordon Barlow has a reputation beyond reputeGordon Barlow has a reputation beyond reputeGordon Barlow has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

BigMak - I wish you well, of course, but I think you're over-analysing to billy-oh. You won't be emigrating to Norway or wherever: you'll be emigrating to a particular city or village - or city-suburb. Your child will be going to a kindergarten or school of your choice, not simply to "a Norwegian school". Your lives will depend to a large extent on what job you can land (if indeed you can get one at all, not speaking the local lingo). Norway gave my son a wonderful work-life balance, but that came at the price of a relatively low wage. Taxation is high. The cost of living isn't bad, as long as you don't eat or drink out.

His kids have grown up watching American cartoons on the telly, and following international fashion trends. They look forward to the bitterly cold winters, and enjoy cross-country ski-ing and watching ski-jumping. They aren't academically inclined, and have attended Steiner schools since the age of seven, which is when Norwegian kids begin school, by the way. They speak English only haltingly, because their father was so intent on learning Norsk that English wasn't spoken much when they were together.

Oslo has street beggars by the bucket-load - much worse than any town in England besides London, in my observation.

So much to learn, so little time...
Gordon Barlow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th 2017, 4:57 am   #21
BigMak Male
Just Joined
 
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 24
BigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

No country in the world is perfect, no place, no city, no town. no street, no house.

I think coming on here was not trying to convince myself that at all, I am pragmatic and realistic enough to know that as is my partner who has moved around Europe a lot more than me.

Every place in the world has issues, every place will be this or that that we dont like or that "back home" was better or that in fact wasn't better or worse but we just got used to or preferred.

The issue is if that was the case no one would ever move, not from there street let alone town or city or country, everyone would stay put and just make the best they can.
Now my ex-inlaws thought this way, they thought in exactly these terms and for them life was good just staying put and not contemplating of ever moving from there small town, doing the same thing as they had for generations, nothing wrong with that.

However for me life is a little to short for that and I/we would rather see the world, nit just visit at times but maybe something more and thats what we intent to do.

Coming on here was not to be fair for anyone to convince us we are doing the right or wrong thing, thats up to us, but rather to help give us an idea of the places we are thinking about....both the good and bad sides, but we are not trying to find perfection, it doesnt exist and it would be damn boring I think!

So while I appreciate all the help its really more not thinking should we do this or not, thats a very very personal choice, but if we do what can we do to best make it work and prepare ourselves....thats true of wherever we end up.

So its back to my original post, not if we should move but rather when we do how can we make sure we have the best chance of making it work, after all thats al you can ever do in anything in life, take the plunge and see how it goes. Thanks all.
BigMak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th 2017, 11:54 am   #22
BE Forum Addict
 
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 3,285
morpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMak View Post
No country in the world is perfect, no place, no city, no town. no street, no house.

I think coming on here was not trying to convince myself that at all, I am pragmatic and realistic enough to know that as is my partner who has moved around Europe a lot more than me.

Every place in the world has issues, every place will be this or that that we dont like or that "back home" was better or that in fact wasn't better or worse but we just got used to or preferred.

The issue is if that was the case no one would ever move, not from there street let alone town or city or country, everyone would stay put and just make the best they can.
Now my ex-inlaws thought this way, they thought in exactly these terms and for them life was good just staying put and not contemplating of ever moving from there small town, doing the same thing as they had for generations, nothing wrong with that.

However for me life is a little to short for that and I/we would rather see the world, nit just visit at times but maybe something more and thats what we intent to do.

Coming on here was not to be fair for anyone to convince us we are doing the right or wrong thing, thats up to us, but rather to help give us an idea of the places we are thinking about....both the good and bad sides, but we are not trying to find perfection, it doesnt exist and it would be damn boring I think!

So while I appreciate all the help its really more not thinking should we do this or not, thats a very very personal choice, but if we do what can we do to best make it work and prepare ourselves....thats true of wherever we end up.

So its back to my original post, not if we should move but rather when we do how can we make sure we have the best chance of making it work, after all thats al you can ever do in anything in life, take the plunge and see how it goes. Thanks all.
Gordan has first-hand experience which I think is the type of advice which is invaluable, especially if moving with children. Others on BE have experience moving between countries which is also helpful.

I think hard to do analysis unless determining what one wishes to move from, hence some fo the questions/observations made. Had to judge though unless one has recent experience or has visited a country.
morpeth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th 2017, 1:15 pm   #23
Lt Col (Retd)
Premium Member
 
Pulaski's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Dixie, ex UK
Posts: 42,909
Pulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by morpeth View Post
Gordan has first-hand experience which I think is the type of advice which is invaluable, especially if moving with children. Others on BE have experience moving between countries which is also helpful.

I think hard to do analysis unless determining what one wishes to move from, hence some fo the questions/observations made. Had to judge though unless one has recent experience or has visited a country.
It always amuses me when people say "I'll just learn the local language". For many people reaching even a basic conversational level of proficiency is a challenge that takes years, for some even that isn't possible. So what sort of job will most people be able to get if they can't communicate effectively with their manager and colleagues, never mind customers?

Taking such a step, and finding out if you can make it in a foreign country is all very well when you're foot loose and fancy free, but taking your children along on your own personal experiment in living in a non-English speaking country doesn't seem to me to be the best idea.
__________________
As quoted in the Grauniad.

Last edited by Pulaski; May 16th 2017 at 1:20 pm.
Pulaski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th 2017, 1:22 pm   #24
BE Forum Addict
 
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,064
Moses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond reputeMoses2013 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pulaski View Post
So what sort of job will most people be able to get if they can't communicate effectively with their manager and colleagues, never mind customers?
A challenge many Scots face moving to England or vice versa

Last edited by Rosemary; May 16th 2017 at 1:59 pm. Reason: corrected quote
Moses2013 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th 2017, 3:43 pm   #25
BE Forum Addict
 
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 3,285
morpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pulaski View Post
It always amuses me when people say "I'll just learn the local language". For many people reaching even a basic conversational level of proficiency is a challenge that takes years, for some even that isn't possible. So what sort of job will most people be able to get if they can't communicate effectively with their manager and colleagues, never mind customers?

Taking such a step, and finding out if you can make it in a foreign country is all very well when you're foot loose and fancy free, but taking your children along on your own personal experiment in living in a non-English speaking country doesn't seem to me to be the best idea.
The language issue I agree is always an interesting one, not always that easy to pick up a foreign language, especially the older one gets. I watched a show the other day that used the American department of state guidelines, and other specialists, on how easy it was for an English-speaker to learn other languages. The conclusion was the easiest foreign language for an English speaking person to learn was Dutch, Africaans, and Frisian, if one doesn't count Scots and Geordie/Northumbrian.

The second group in terms of greater difficulty, included Danish, Swedish, and Norwegian.

The third was German, then after that in group four the Romance languages.(Surprised me as I always thought French easier than German).
morpeth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th 2017, 3:53 pm   #26
Lt Col (Retd)
Premium Member
 
Pulaski's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Dixie, ex UK
Posts: 42,909
Pulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by morpeth View Post
The language issue I agree is always an interesting one, not always that easy to pick up a foreign language, especially the older one gets. I watched a show the other day that used the American department of state guidelines, and other specialists, on how easy it was for an English-speaker to learn other languages. The conclusion was the easiest foreign language for an English speaking person to learn was Dutch, Africaans, and Frisian, .....
Frisian is quite closely related to Yorkshire dialect as they are both closely connected to old English, and Dutch has a number of similarities to English. I have said in the past that Dutch is what you would end up with of you tried to create modern English without using any words from the romance languages.

On one occasion at lunch a Dutch colleague approached the table where I was seated, placed her hand on the chair next to me and asked "Is this one free? .... Except she was asking a Dutchman on the other side of the vacant seat "Is deze een frie?" ..... That said, I still can't imagine myself achieving any degree of fluency in Dutch even if I were to live there for years.
__________________
As quoted in the Grauniad.

Last edited by Pulaski; May 16th 2017 at 4:20 pm.
Pulaski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th 2017, 4:54 pm   #27
BigMak Male
Just Joined
 
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 24
BigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Thanks again all.

However again I would say I think everyone is different and everyone can handle it in different ways, my another has lived in 4 countries and picked up 4 languages, doesn't mean she will again or that i would but again life is a challenge no?

As for the kids they are certainly not an experiment! If you read back its my youngest only moving, hes 4 months, which means he is a way off speaking anything and by the time he does we would hopefully be at least proficient if not fluent....its what you want to put in and get out....nothing is impossible especially learning a language.

So we will research, we will visit, we will take advise but after all that its down to a gut feel what is best for us and like most things in life its a very personal decision.
Appreciate the advise but like anything in life something worth doing isn't always easy....and hey if it doesn't work out its a hell of an experience, or do all leave by certainties and sure things only?! that would be rather boring....for us anyway.
BigMak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th 2017, 5:03 pm   #28
Lt Col (Retd)
Premium Member
 
Pulaski's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2001
Location: Dixie, ex UK
Posts: 42,909
Pulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond reputePulaski has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMak View Post
.... As for the kids they are certainly not an experiment! If you read back its my youngest only moving, hes 4 months, which means he is a way off speaking anything and by the time he does we would hopefully be at least proficient .....
Sorry, that is not at all what I meant in your context - I meant that your limited ability to speak the local language may significantly impact your ability to (i) find work, and (ii) fulfill your earning potential, thereby reducing your ability to provide for your family.
__________________
As quoted in the Grauniad.
Pulaski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 16th 2017, 6:15 pm   #29
BigMak Male
Just Joined
 
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 24
BigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond reputeBigMak has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Indeed and I agree and thats why unless its an English speaking country it would be a long and considered decision....plus if we decide a lot of language courses, reading and watching films in that language to help us before we get there....and then continueing once we do.
BigMak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 17th 2017, 7:49 am   #30
BE Forum Addict
 
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 3,285
morpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Looking at possible move to Norway....or Iceland.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigMak View Post
Indeed and I agree and thats why unless its an English speaking country it would be a long and considered decision....plus if we decide a lot of language courses, reading and watching films in that language to help us before we get there....and then continueing once we do.
Out of curiosity do you already speak a second language ?

Can't comment on gut feelings, those are hard for someone else to quantify.
morpeth is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   British Expats / Living & Moving Abroad / Europe / Scandinavia


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT. The time now is 5:36 pm.


We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
Powered by vBulletin: ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
© 1999-2010 BritishExpats.com