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Old Dec 17th 2017, 5:56 am   #61
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Originally Posted by jam25mack View Post
Oh I dunno, I thought about running over some kid this morning as he was wearing a Citeh shirt!

Seriously though, who would think wearing a dish dash would be a good idea...?
I was living in Riyadh around the time that the nutters were going around blowing things up and chopping Westerners heads off. Some of us regularly commuted to work in full Saudi dress as a form of camouflage !! With slightly tinted windows, you'd be amazed how effective it was.
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Old Dec 17th 2017, 6:28 am   #62
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Default Re: A question about women.

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I was living in Riyadh around the time that the nutters were going around blowing things up and chopping Westerners heads off. Some of us regularly commuted to work in full Saudi dress as a form of camouflage !! With slightly tinted windows, you'd be amazed how effective it was.
OK, fair call.... I'll give you that.... loss of head or wear a dish dash....

Many years ago a mate of mine went to pick his best mate up from DXB airport. He's Brit Portugezzer and so looks a bit Arabic. He also drives a Patrol with blacked out windows. So for shits and giggles he dressed up in a dish dash, drove up and parked up at arrivals leaving his patrol running at the kurb and strolled in. His mate walked straight past him and even apologised when my mate bumped into him....... its amazing what a bit of camouflage and the right props will do.
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Old Dec 17th 2017, 6:36 am   #63
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Default Re: A question about women.

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Seriously though, who would think wearing a dish dash would be a good idea...?
I saw one at the airport recently catching a flight home to Europe. Mental. Just totally mental.

I mean, I know they look comfy as **** but just don't.
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Old Dec 17th 2017, 9:01 am   #64
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Default Re: A question about women.

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I saw one at the airport recently catching a flight home to Europe. Mental. Just totally mental.

I mean, I know they look comfy as **** but just don't.
I worked in a huge organisation and I did see them from time to time. Almost all those doing it fit the category of "mental" and were eventually asked "window or aisle."
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Old Dec 17th 2017, 9:11 am   #65
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Default Re: A question about women.

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I was living in Riyadh around the time that the nutters were going around blowing things up and chopping Westerners heads off. Some of us regularly commuted to work in full Saudi dress as a form of camouflage !! With slightly tinted windows, you'd be amazed how effective it was.
I am not saying this to take a swipe at you - but this sounds like major overkill for the context of Riyadh at that juncture. I work extensively in conflict zones and Riyadh was never, ever close to something like Baghdad or Kandahar and even at the height of the problems there you could walk around with confidence unless you were in a "problem neighbourhood" which very few Westerners ever had a reason to.

As well it is more difficult to pull off - in this dishdasha, were you also driving a Toyota Landcruiser, some other 4WD, or a luxury 2WD? A man in a dishdasha driving, say, a Toyota Yaris 2WD would raise suspicion as it doesn't "fit." That suspicion would come both from bad guys and Saudi authorities. The entire point of camoflauge is to avoid detection.

What would seriously concern me would be living in a Westerner compound since it would be obvious to any bad guys where to go, to pop a Westerner. Better to try to pretend to be an Arab Expat driving the make and models popular with them, vary your routes to and from work (or have a trusted local recommend a driver to you, who can take you through the appropriate back roads) and trying to find off-the-grid compounds would be the way to go. Driving through way nastier places, I have never, ever worn a disguise.

The most dangerous road in any conflict zone is the road to and from the airport, since there is usually only one way in (or out) and any bad guy can just set up camp and wait for a target to drive by, which is what would concern me about the compounds. Plus they wouldn't likely spare Saudis since a Saudi coming to/from one would be seen to be aligned to the infidels.
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Old Dec 17th 2017, 9:53 am   #66
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Default Re: A question about women.

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I am not saying this to take a swipe at you - but this sounds like major overkill for the context of Riyadh at that juncture. I work extensively in conflict zones and Riyadh was never, ever close to something like Baghdad or Kandahar and even at the height of the problems there you could walk around with confidence unless you were in a "problem neighbourhood" which very few Westerners ever had a reason to.

As well it is more difficult to pull off - in this dishdasha, were you also driving a Toyota Landcruiser, some other 4WD, or a luxury 2WD? A man in a dishdasha driving, say, a Toyota Yaris 2WD would raise suspicion as it doesn't "fit." That suspicion would come both from bad guys and Saudi authorities. The entire point of camoflauge is to avoid detection.

What would seriously concern me would be living in a Westerner compound since it would be obvious to any bad guys where to go, to pop a Westerner. Better to try to pretend to be an Arab Expat driving the make and models popular with them, vary your routes to and from work (or have a trusted local recommend a driver to you, who can take you through the appropriate back roads) and trying to find off-the-grid compounds would be the way to go. Driving through way nastier places, I have never, ever worn a disguise.

The most dangerous road in any conflict zone is the road to and from the airport, since there is usually only one way in (or out) and any bad guy can just set up camp and wait for a target to drive by, which is what would concern me about the compounds. Plus they wouldn't likely spare Saudis since a Saudi coming to/from one would be seen to be aligned to the infidels.
No offense taken, but yes, I was in a white land cruiser so felt that the two kind of went together well. After that time, I was sent on a hostile environment course by my company and learnt far better ways to do things since.

You offer some good advice above.

When we had a direct threat against me and another staff member, we were driven out to Bahrain as the security company didn't want us walking through the airport.
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Old Dec 17th 2017, 10:21 am   #67
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Default Re: A question about women.

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When we had a direct threat against me and another staff member, we were driven out to Bahrain as the security company didn't want us walking through the airport.
Yes, excellent. The best fences are the ones made up of your neighbours. The Shia in Bahrain really hate the Wahabi and Sunni extremists, and will quickly sniff one out (much, much faster than Westerners can) trying to sneak over the border to cause problems, and merrily report suspect activity to the authorities - as the Shia themselves could possibly be the targets.

In some places, who knows who has infiltrated airport security, but much less likely to happen in Bahrain which is crawling with a Shia majority population, pro-monarchist Sunnis in key positions, and US military personnel.

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Old Dec 17th 2017, 11:04 am   #68
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Yes, excellent. The best fences are the ones made up of your neighbours. The Shia in Bahrain really hate the Wahabi and Sunni extremists, and will quickly sniff one out (much, much faster than Westerners can) trying to sneak over the border to cause problems, and merrily report suspect activity to the authorities - as the Shia themselves could possibly be the targets.

In some places, who knows who has infiltrated airport security, but much less likely to happen in Bahrain which is crawling with a Shia majority population, pro-monarchist Sunnis in key positions, and US military personnel.
interesting....i had no idea Bahrain was Shia majority.
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Old Dec 17th 2017, 11:35 am   #69
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interesting....i had no idea Bahrain was Shia majority.
Yes, it is, but King Hamad, the royal family, and most of the senior government figures are Sunni.

One of the rumoured reasons for the construction of the King Fahd Causeway was so that the Saudis could quickly rush troops over to crush any Shia rebellion and preserve the Sunni government . . . as happened in 2011.
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Old Dec 17th 2017, 4:20 pm   #70
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Default Re: A question about women.

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I was living in Riyadh around the time that the nutters were going around blowing things up and chopping Westerners heads off. Some of us regularly commuted to work in full Saudi dress as a form of camouflage !! With slightly tinted windows, you'd be amazed how effective it was.
A friend of a friend was doing exactly that around that time and he was beheaded at a fake police checkpoint on the eastern ring road. Not saying that the dress caused it, but it certainly didn't save him.
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Old Dec 18th 2017, 3:40 am   #71
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A friend of a friend was doing exactly that around that time and he was beheaded at a fake police checkpoint on the eastern ring road. Not saying that the dress caused it, but it certainly didn't save him.
Wow. I’m going to cite this story in future, a friend of a friend of a poster on BE.
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Old Dec 18th 2017, 6:15 am   #72
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How did it affect him 24/7?
Community destroyed; house prices plummeted. By the time he realised it was happening, it was too late to get out.
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Old Dec 18th 2017, 6:30 am   #73
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Wow. I’m going to cite this story in future, a friend of a friend of a poster on BE.
I know of this case, if it is the one I am thinking of (I had no involvement, I just remember hearing about it).

I am always very suspicious when Westerners just happen to end up in the wrong place at the wrong time in these cases. Most likely scenario is the Westerner was specifically targeted and the terrorists had inside help. Least likely scenario is that a fake road block netted random Westerner as a stroke of luck for the bad guys.

Please see my comment earlier about "who knows who has infiltrated" security.

My heart goes out to the family of the victim, who over a decade later will still be suffering.
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Old Dec 18th 2017, 6:31 am   #74
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Community destroyed; house prices plummeted. By the time he realised it was happening, it was too late to get out.
Quite the effect of some blokes in pyjamas.

Sounds like the problem was his own, not them.
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Old Dec 18th 2017, 6:48 am   #75
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A friend of a friend was doing exactly that around that time and he was beheaded at a fake police checkpoint on the eastern ring road. Not saying that the dress caused it, but it certainly didn't save him.
are you serious
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