DXBtoDOH

I'm rereading Plato's Republic. Surely some of you have read it (my top two suspects are Miss Anne and Baht).

Anyone fancy having a discussion about the book?

Miss Ann Thrope

Yeah you're not getting many takers for this one.

How about Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone?

littlejimmy

Fifty Shades of Grey?

DXBtoDOH

I wanted to talk about the cave allegory in the Republic but I should probably find a philosophy forum for that. There must be one on Reddit.

But perhaps something that can be more broadly discussed is the concept of the sacred truth that must be guarded or even hid from most people. The Republic touches on this concept, and so does Harry Potter to an extent.

Is there truly a sacred truth that must be guarded and protected, regardless of what it is, or is it merely the figment of imaginations? It does beg the question what is/are the sacred truth(s). The Republic talks of the Forms protected by the Guardians.

It's interesting to see how the human mind does lend legitimacy to the concept of sacred truths to be protected or guarded and it manifests itself on so many levels and in different forms. Religions come to mind, naturally. But quite common are the various plebeian beliefs that the "government" is hiding truths, or mass conspiracies led by secret societies (Knights of Templars, the Rothschilds, the Masons, Dr Strangelove). The sensible laugh at the notion but yet we crave the concept of hidden knowledge and truths.

I suppose it's because it fulfils a inner need that if we "know" this "truth" then suddenly everything will be fine and there's an answer to all the unexplained mysteries of reality and life will suddenly stop being so uncertain (and thus the "meaning of life" has been answered), and it's easier to want to believe this rather than accept the frank reality that the only truth out there is....bugger all. And yes, I mean bugger all.

Bahtatboy

Grapes of Roth.

function_analysis

Great book mate...well a school of thought actually. Hope we all become able some time to read it in original Classical Greek ---foreign language even for native Greeks. For one, the title of the book (Plato's Republic) doesn't reflect the actual meaning of the original word that he used back in his time. The original term 'Po-li-ti-a' has a little to do with the English translation 'Republic'.

Other than that it is Plato's best-known work, and has proven to be one of the world's most influential works of philosophy and political theory, intellectually and historically. By the way, although Bertrand Russel has studied and interpreted Plato in his own book on the history of western philosophy (that won him the Noble pize), unfortunately it is overgeneralized.

kostik3000

Read it in school but hardly remember it now but I've liked it back then. One thing which stuck with me for life from there is saying that each person has both good and bad in them, regardless who they are and what they do.

DXBtoDOH I am surprise that with mind of yours, you ended up in Doha. Most unphilosophical place on Earth, after Kuwait, of course.

DXBtoDOH

We can argue that the western mindset can trace itself to Socrates. There are other influences of course, but it was Socrates who planted the seed that began it all, both in the elenchus method, or Socratic method, of questioning and analysis, and, of course, the very subjects of Plato's Republic: justice.

I have read Bertrand Russel's analysis though it's been some time. The Republic is so dense that it's tempting to resort to other people's summaries and interpretations rather than one's own readings. One of the intriguing and complicated aspects of reading the Republic is the translation issues you mentioned. The Greek concept for certain ideas and imperatives do not neatly translate into the modern world with tit for tat definitions and do call for greater understanding of the ancient Greek political and social contexts. I have read both Allan Bloom's translations (the current draft I'm reading) and a version from 1854 by Henry Davis and it's startling how different the text can be. The story is still there but translated quite differently. Bloom was translating for the 21st century English-speaking reader whereas Davis was translating for the 18th and early 19th century audience and that adds a level of complexity of its own. But that is part of the fun.

Millhouse

I’ve just rewatched the rocky box set.

DXBtoDOH

The Republic is provocative because it offers many very direct observations we can't deny while in everyday life we either ignore them or cloak them under complicated lies and distortions to justify doing the wrong thing. It's why Socrates was condemned to death, his quest for truth challenged the prevailing order of the day and it couldn't be tolerated without questioning your own justification for existence.

As for Qatar, well, true, introspection is not something that lends itself easily to the Islamic mindset. But on the flip side, as there's bugger all to do I have the time to read Plato's Republic

scrubbedexpat141

Is it a new restaurant?

littlejimmy

Yeah, it's full of pretentious people (like most in Dubai, to be fair).

Dubaiexile

Part 2 has been a long time coming out, but I bet it will be worth the wait zzzzzzzzzz

function_analysis

Re translation issues may I point out that Classical Greek is literally a 'foreign language' that even native Greeks (like myself) have hard time dealing with.

Hence, it doesn't come as a surprise that we either take the bumpy road -i.e. read the original book AFTER we master Classical Greek- or just rely on translations to Modern Greek that brings us again to the very same startling comparison between Russel's and Davis's works.

BTW, the other day I was watching a lecture from a British Uni Prof at Oxford on a very similar matter and guess what...the Prof himself was giving the lecture in Modern Greek while also admitting that he had to study Classical Greek in the hope of grasping the social and political context of the author (Socrates in that case).

scot47

Those with an education probably read and discussed this in their teens.