Boomhauer

Don't those chaps know that no one steal as good as government.

Norm_uk

False association and accusations of racism aren’t productive either but you didn't ask me to ignore those before.
The British government doesn't do enough to plug the huge trade deficit we have. More people in Britain need to be making things or offering services that other countries want to buy, and or we have to accept a major dip our quality of life (or rather, reign in our consumer culture) if we want to balance the books. You seem to suggest supporting Capitalism bounds people to follow it to some sort of dog eat dog extreme. I think it’s better to pick whatever works best and apply it – and revise regularly as needed...politics isn’t religion, we should be able to question and change things when we see it’s going wrong.
As for the Polish people (and many other immigrants who work hard) there's no simple answer but its clear many native Britons are simply too lazy to work hard in jobs that might not be as glamorous as they had hoped. Using a broad brush this could be a cultural issue - ultimately down to parents not instilling a work ethic in their children...it's bad enough that the Government needs to look at it and ask serious and uncomfortable questions. If I use a jingoistic saying I feel the UK has thrown the baby out with the cultural bathwater.
I have seen first-hand what welfare does to people’s ability to strive for a better life. Welfare in my opinion is the number one enemy of the black community for example. Since Welfare has been introduced we have seen more fragmented families, more teenage pregnancies, more delinquency and increasingly younger and younger criminals in black communities (and this of course is not limited to blacks today). Rewarding laziness and punishing work is a terrible thing for a human being – we simply do not value anything we don’t earn – that’s basic psychology. I think a sink or swim mentality is too simplistic as trying to provide for all would be too simplistic. I also think countries who can afford to should help the weak, the disabled and those who have served the country well. So no, I do not object to welfare on principle...I object to welfare in practise as it stands in Britain today. I call for examination, revision, rewarding people who try hard to earn money despite the hard economic climate and punishing those who don't try to find a job.
I have to say by naming it "your beloved capitalism" you've revealed a lot. My world isn't as black and white as Capitalists vs. Socialists despite what you think. Perhaps your only experience of what you perceive as the right has been YouTube videos of obviously uneducated thugs and popularists who half read Murray, Hitchens, Spencer or whoever and mould it to fit their views…no different to a lot of the anarchists we see at G20 protests (I prefer to call them unproductive street battles which cause a lot of harm and waste a lot of money) who read Marx and Engels.
I’ve said this before – the Government is inefficient at welfare administration. But how can we get every able-bodied adult into work in Britain when we have literally hundreds of thousands who have no social skills to engage the mainstream, and no desire to work – coming from homes where neither parents (if they are lucky to have both at home that is) have worked.
Better integration policy isn’t the be all, end all solution to all of Britain’s woes. Better integration is part of a wider solution…the doctrine of multi-culturalism (which basically teaches people should behave according to their family background/ethnic culture and not even attempt to integrate) contributes to ghettos as much as the racist thugs who treat immigrants badly…more so in my opinion and experience.
Suggesting it is the treatment of immigrants at the hands of locals which turns them sour against the country is very simplistic and suggests that non-white people are weaklings who pander to the victim mentality because of something that happened to their parents. I find that insulting. The major stumbling block today for integration is the lack of cultural pride in the native population - why would anyone want to integrate into a bunch of spineless wimps who are always apologising for something their grandfather did and who are terrified of even flying their national flag for fear of offending someone who isn't white?
I wouldn’t expect anything else…integration can take several generations. This is why I think the UK should be saying we can’t give hundreds of thousands of people a year citizenship until we’ve found a way for the people whose parents were given citizenship to integrate. And the UK should be seriously considering what to do with the many immigrants who do not want to integrate at all and raise their children to hate the British state and people…and not because of how they were treated by working class thugs. I know middle class people who spew venomous hate against native Britons and people who integrate with them… But alas, saying that puts me in the same group as the people who say deport all non-whites, non-whites are bad, blah blah blah. I’ll deport half of myself

Norm_uk

But he has addressed that by explaining (or so it seems) the awful treatment some immigrants get from native Britons when they arrive, which turns them against the host population.

And while there has certainly been terrible stories which can explain some behaviours there are also some cultures which even when treated well will not adapt or integrate into ours...especially when given the chance to keep in separate areas surrounded by their own cultural bubble.

This is why major, sustained immigration adds to the social problems in Britain and in the majority of countries. Keeping the incoming numbers down and giving people time to settle will erode the problem and see more people mixing after a generation or two, making the country more multi-ethnic and less multi-cultural. The ruling governments have allowed too many people too quickly for a long time. Now's the time to put the brakes on and work at a system where the guest adheres to the host's culture instead of the other way around.

N.

sherri

Quality

Norm_uk

Quite true.

There are so few Orthodox Jews in Britain though and their numbers are declining. I don't know of any outwardly hostile and violent Jews in Britain who want to see Britain turned into a Jewish state either. I don't of any Jews who leave Orthodox Judaism and are killed by their own family for doing so in Britain.

N.

littlejimmy

this must be some kind of record. 260 posts to get the subject on to Muslims...

Norm_uk

And without mentioning Muslims at all in the post!

Muslims aren't the only people who engage in so called "honour killings"...just the most famous thanks to the frequency of media reports. I think there's more of a cultural element than just a religious one. But I do know Islam sanctions killing people who leave it.

I'll mention the Nazis again soon - am getting sloppy

N.

littlejimmy

kittycat1

Little shits!

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/scooter-rid...085938566.html

Charismatic

The Economist: Historically-illiterate judgement.

Bahtatboy

I like that. You tell and try the kids (sorry, Dail Fail readers) of today that, and they won't believe you...

littlejimmy

Good find.

From the Daily Mail in 1956...

"It is deplorable. It is tribal. And it is from America. It follows rag-time, blues, dixie, jazz, hot cha-cha and the boogie-woogie, which surely originated in the jungle. We sometimes wonder whether this is the negro's revenge."

Paracletus

I do wonder..Has this been mentioned by anyone yet?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_contract

It has been missing in England for centuries now. It's gonna take time to remodel this underclass into functioning and productive members of society..and Cameron is hardly the man for the job.

Charismatic

At least they are consistent racists.

Over 85% of the UK's population identify themselves as "White British" in the last census, if you count the Indians (who like cricket, Indian food and tea so they are all right with me ) and Irish (who used to be British but now only retain vestiges like culture, cousin, music, governmental systems etc.) it's almost 90% of the population! Looking to blame problems on these 'bloody foreigners coming over here with their culture...those bastards' is attempting to blame 10-15% of the population for influencing the other 85-90%.

It's so utterly ridiculous...humiliating in fact to see British people, educated people who should know better, saying such utterly stupid things. .[/rant]

Norm_uk

Rag time & blues didn't glorify violence like "gangsta" rap but you have a point of course.

It is annoying how other issues like social cohesion, immigration and everything else are thrown into this debate on the riots. I'm probably guilty of it myself.

But looking at the Mods vs Rockers riots of yesteryear it's clear Britain is still very British despite immigration and the policies of multiculturalism.

N.