Education

Old Apr 21st 2014, 10:27 am
  #46  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Kim67
The thing is, if you live in a warm climate (like we do in Queensland Australia, local state schools have swimming pools, some private schools have olympic size pools) and kids have weekly lessons during summer. The school my kids go to here has a pool, dance studios (and the use of the studios of our state ballet company), soccer fields, golf course, tennis courts, gym (new gym being built with huge rock climbing facility), use of the adjoining University facilities - it's a non-fee paying state school. Every classroom has wifi and interactive whiteboards etc - they all have laptops. It is selective if you don't live within the catchment. The catchment includes children of people that work at the University, are students at the Uni and employees of the main hospital and medical research facilities in the state. So we have heaps of kids from all over the world, including loads of Emirate and Saudi Nationals. Dubai is a great place for ethnic diversity, but it's not the ONLY place in the world where you can experience it. Sure there's no tax to pay in Dubai, but it does get on your nerves that fees are so expensive and choices are so limited. Don't believe the hype they feed you - it's not a matter of parents thinking their kids are all little angels, it's that most parents want what's best for their kids and Dubai doesn't offer excellence in most of the activities it charges over the top prices for.
Sounds like an awesome school.

The swimming pool at my secondary school was green, outdoors and full of fish.

Not disagreeing with you at all, but I've yet to hear of anyone not coming to Dubai or leaving in fact, because they didn't think the schooling was good enough. Just like Qatar - not heard of anyone having to leave because they couldn't get a place (different topic though).

It is what it is, sounds like you've struck gold though!
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 10:29 am
  #47  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Bahtatboy
You've just defined every business' pricing model in free markets.
I disagree, try charging more than 5-10% in retail, or in construction. Many markets are self regulating, education seems like it is not.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 12:01 pm
  #48  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Dumbo
I disagree, try charging more than 5-10% in retail, or in construction. Many markets are self regulating, education seems like it is not.
Sorry, but you agree. Self-regulating = businesses charging what they thing they can get away with.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 12:07 pm
  #49  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Dumbo
I disagree, try charging more than 5-10% in retail, or in construction. Many markets are self regulating, education seems like it is not.
Gotta disagree on retail (I know nothing at all about construction). Look around Debenhams or M&S where you will find the UK price on the items. Even with a generous exchange rate, there is a lot more than 10% margin.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 12:28 pm
  #50  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by TheShed
Gotta disagree on retail (I know nothing at all about construction). Look around Debenhams or M&S where you will find the UK price on the items. Even with a generous exchange rate, there is a lot more than 10% margin.
You might be right, I know nothing about how much the cost differences in rent works for M&S out here, or how much duty they have to pay on merchandise etc. Who really does? But it seems to me like there is probably more to it than just an exchange rate.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 12:31 pm
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Bahtatboy
Sorry, but you agree. Self-regulating = businesses charging what they thing they can get away with.
The point is that self regulation does not happen with education and therefore the market does not control the price. I am yet to meet a parent who thinks that AED60k+ per year for schooling is reasonable. Maybe you are that exception.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 12:34 pm
  #52  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Dumbo
The point is that self regulation does not happen with education and therefore the market does not control the price. I am yet to meet a parent who thinks that AED60k+ per year for schooling is reasonable. Maybe you are that exception.
In countries like UAE, of course the market controls the price. Schools (businesses) will charge what they think parents (customers) will pay. Reasonableness is irrelevant in respect of an essential commodity.

Edit: And what parents (customers) will pay in a market where demand outstrips supply has little, if any, bearing on reasonableness.

Last edited by Bahtatboy; Apr 21st 2014 at 12:48 pm.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 12:40 pm
  #53  
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Default Re: Education

What gets on my nerves is the exploitative "non refundable deposits". Just taking a cool 500dhs for registering under the guise of an assessment fee.

Of course there are not enough places in Dubai for all the students, and they know that parent will have to register at a few places to ensure they actually get into a place. Why no governmental oversight on how the 'system' works other than to aid their assessment regime to allow the schools to up their fees with justification.

As for Scamp. Just because you have been educated and have an opinion does not mean you have an educated opinion. Best to say nothing and appear ignorant than to speak and remove all doubt.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 12:52 pm
  #54  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Bongoman2
What gets on my nerves is the exploitative "non refundable deposits". Just taking a cool 500dhs for registering under the guise of an assessment fee.

Of course there are not enough places in Dubai for all the students, and they know that parent will have to register at a few places to ensure they actually get into a place. Why no governmental oversight on how the 'system' works other than to aid their assessment regime to allow the schools to up their fees with justification.

As for Scamp. Just because you have been educated and have an opinion does not mean you have an educated opinion. Best to say nothing and appear ignorant than to speak and remove all doubt.
No need to be rude and insulting because you don't agree with what someone else has said.

I disagree with the bit in bold. People might not get their kids into the first choice school immediately, or for a little while but they don't have to leave Dubai because they can't get any school places.

I agree the fee for registering is just a money-making spin, but it's like so many other things in the world where admin fees are involved - gym memberships, loan arrangements etc etc. They supply what you want, they can charge that shit and know full well they'll get away with it.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 1:33 pm
  #55  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Bahtatboy
In countries like UAE, of course the market controls the price. Schools (businesses) will charge what they think parents (customers) will pay. Reasonableness is irrelevant in respect of an essential commodity.

Edit: And what parents (customers) will pay in a market where demand outstrips supply has little, if any, bearing on reasonableness.
You can hide behind free market economies and capitalism all that you want, in my opinion when it comes to services like education, health care, etc there should be some control over the level of profiteering that we see. As others have rightly mentioned charging non-refundable deposits to be even considered for places is not in anyway justifiable, at least not in any real world that people actually live in.

Last edited by Dumbo; Apr 21st 2014 at 1:38 pm.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 1:39 pm
  #56  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Scamp
I disagree with the bit in bold. People might not get their kids into the first choice school immediately, or for a little while but they don't have to leave Dubai because they can't get any school places.
But then you really do not know what you are talking about from a customer perspective at all other than your limited frame of reference.

Maybe you could answer this? Is your other half involved in any way with the "assessments"? I'd be interested if they have any basis in educational value other than pure $$. I paid 500dhs to have my son "observed at play" for 15 minutes then shooed away with a tick. It seems they have their own interests at heart rather than the students.

What is the regulation regarding schools taking registration fees? Is there a cutoff limit when they stop taking the cash when they know that the kid has no chance of getting to the top of the list for enrollment?

A spokesperson for GEMS, which has over two dozen schools, said: “At GEMS schools we aim to keep our waiting list numbers below 300, and once this number is reached, we close registrations for that year group. In some schools and in some year groups, the number of students on a waiting list could easily surpass 1,000, but the probability of them getting a place in that school is limited.” source
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 1:44 pm
  #57  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Dumbo
You can hide behind free market economies and capitalism all that you want, in my opinion when it comes to services like education, health care, etc there should be some control over the level of profiteering that we see. As others have rightly mentioned charging non-refundable deposits to be even considered for places is not in anyway justifiable, at least not in any real world that people actually live in.
I'm not hiding, I'm trying to explain to you very basic economics. Few would disagree that controls are necessary--but if you're calling for the government to legislate "reasonableness" for what you're charged for your offspring's education, then you should also accept legislation to restrict the price for whatever products or services your and/or your spouse's employer sells, which might result in a lower income for you and/or your spouse.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 1:47 pm
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Bahtatboy
I'm not hiding, I'm trying to explain to you very basic economics. Few would disagree that controls are necessary--but if you're calling for the government to legislate "reasonableness" for what you're charged for your offspring's education, then you should also accept legislation to restrict the price for whatever products or services your and/or your spouse's employer sells, which might result in a lower income for you and/or your spouse.
Should we compare it every other controlled product or service in Dubai?

No one complains that their water, electricity or petrol is subsidised and cost controlled.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 1:52 pm
  #59  
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Default Re: Education

Originally Posted by Bongoman2
Should we compare it every other controlled product or service in Dubai?

No one complains that their water, electricity or petrol is subsidised and cost controlled.
I guess we all have our own views. I disagree with state intervention in prices, except that I believe that critical, significant industries should be state run: health, education, main transportation and energy.
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Old Apr 21st 2014, 1:56 pm
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Default Re: Education

And breeding. It is time to make Eugenics fashionable again. Otherwise those F***wits will outbreed the smart ones !

Last edited by scot47; Apr 21st 2014 at 2:16 pm.
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