Dubaiexile

I think some are watching with great interest, to see exactly what happens, as this is a blue print for any that wish to give the EU two fingers as well. The sudden surge of right wing nationalism was recognised for what it was, outright racism. If they had not taken such a right wing stance I think the said elections would have had a lot different outcome, even the Germans are now sick of the enforced immigration!

A very interesting couple of years ahead, and I believe that we will not be on our own in leaving the failed experiment that the EU has become in federalism!

weasel decentral

You keep throwing in these kind of opinions as if they are facts or have you canvassed the population of the EU? Saying it repeatedly doesn't make it so.

jam25mack

You can say similar about pretty much every discussion on the subject....

Remainers saying its a shit show even though essentially nothing has happened as of yet.... the leavers saying the EU is a dead duck and everyone with abandon the sinking ship after Brexit. Personally I keep out of the discussions these days as they just go round and round in circles.

Dubaiexile

Yes they are my opinions, which I clearly stated....you are the one that is somehow convinced that I am stating facts, I am far from being an expert on the matter I assure you and have never represented myself that way either!!

It is a discussion board, well it was the last time I looked, so I will carry on in my own way expressing my opinion...if you or others want to turn it into something bigger or take offense that I have an opinion tough tit!!

Dubaiexile

Could not agree more, damned if you do and damned if you don`t.....god help free thought and discussion, it has been abandoned to do as we do or else, by both sides usually in a fit of hysteria!

Miss Ann Thrope

A perfect encapsulation of the nonsense and misinformation that led us to Brexit!!

All external treaties by the EU have to be ratified by all member governments - that includes trade. Remember the fuss caused about the trade agreement with Canada last year that was held up by the Wallonia regional parliament for example? This idea that the EU is some faceless nameless bureaucratic monolith is actually nonsense. It is a club of members and like any such club, the members have to agree all of the rule changes - some rules can now be decided by majority but nothing fundamental. Of course there is a bureaucracy to administer the rules but guess what: that's also made up of citizens of the member states including plenty of Brits, many in prominent and influential roles.

After Brexit the UK will certainly have no say in the club rules. And unless the UK government is committed to economic hare-kiri, there will be some kind of post-Brexit trade agreement with the EU a la the EEA or EFTA, or, the latest proposed model (which perhaps starkly illustrates the new world stature of the UK): Andorra. In this case the UK WILL be bound by EU trade agreements while having absolutely no input into their establishment.

Therefore the horrible circumstance you describe only comes into place exactly BECAUSE of Brexit. Well done! Well done!

weasel decentral

I'm not offended in the least I'm just pointing out that these are being presented as statements of fact.

You mentioned you believed that others will leave, which is an opinion of course but that they are leaving a failed experiment which is a statement.

Anyhow I assume the emotive terms are in order to get a bite and I guess I have bitten

weasel decentral

Very true, I'm not pro or against Brexit. I was just pointing out that colourful or emotive type of description.

weasel decentral

From the country which brought us mad cow disease and foot and mouth epidemics!

Eeyore

As Miss Ann Thrope has pointed out, that's utter nonsense - and yet you clearly believe it. Why aren't you interested in finding out how the EU actually works?

Miss Ann Thrope

I think the use of throwaway contentions like "failed experiment" is very characteristic of much of the Brexit argument (and indeed of Putinesque/Trumpian disinformation campaigns). It's a silly contention that simply does not stand up to any analysis: if the 60+ year old EU has failed then why has no party advocating leaving the EU come anywhere close to power in any of the other member states ever? And in fact the few that exist at all have retreated in recent elections across the EU. There are plenty of parties in power with dubious positions on governance and democracy who want to change a lot about the EU, like Jobbik in Hungary or Law & Justice in Poland. But not even the French NF want to leave the EU.

I'm clearly not neutral but there is definitely one side of the argument that has largely abandoned fact for fantasy. I really really really would like to hear a scenario outlined with reasonable specificity about how the UK can prosper post-Brexit. But nobody has said anything plausible yet that comes close. Vague notions of being "free to do trade deals and control our borders" tells me nothing about how even a fraction of the UK's current trade with the EU is going to be replaced.

Dubaiexile

I guess I was stating my opinion...which is a statement!!

And yes you did bite

mrken30

You forgot the salmonella eggs, the self igniting appliances and the flammable cladding.

IKnowNothing

Let's have a beer and a proper discussion....

Loca?

uk_grenada

Nah, rum ZZZZzzzzzzz