Taffyles

Oh and I left out sickness benefit too- imagine that- handouts for being sick!!! that's a blast from the past . And what about Pension credit, Attendance allowance, mobility allowance, even free cars for some people- my mother's next door neighbour had a brand new car every 2 or 3 years because she had a heart condition and lived on a big hill....see that happening in the US? LOL

The only thing that comes close to ISAs is the Roth IRA but that's for retirement. ISAs can be used for whenever and in many cases instant access to savings- bloody good rate too. I just opened a Post Office one for my Mum she gets over 7% interest tax free and instant access. Wish I could have opened one for myself.

Mally Lass

[QUOTE=Taffyles]
Value for money? Well lets see in UK with your national health, housing benefits, unemployment benefits, income support, child allowance, single parent allowance, job seekers allowance. yeah you get nothing. Gawd almighty, hurry up and emigrate lady and then you can live in the real world- don't mean to be offensive but bloody hell- Brits really are a nation of moaners (and they are the ones who get more back from the government than MOST other countries).

QUOTE]

I said nothing about what benefits are available, yet you seem to forget that these benefits are only available to people that DON'T WORK. And lets not forget mobility/disability benefit, refugee benefit, refugee hardship allowance etc etc there are loads of benefits, that I personally will NEVER benefit from because for one reason or another (mainly that I WORK) I will never be eligible !!!! Yes there is Disability benefit that allows certain claimees to go without a proportion of their benefit in exchange for a spanking new car....how wonderful, most don't need it, yet I still have to pay for it !!!

So if I'm moaning, as you put it, it's because my taxes are high as I have to Support everyone else that doesn't want to Work !!!

As for emmigrating to live in the Real World, I have already lived abroad, hence my reason for stating that most people who have done this, can compare. As for distribution of wealth having no divide in the UK, I suppose living in the US makes you an expert on the UK too

Mally Lass

As I said, SOME Brits that have 'experienced' living abroad are able to Compare.

I would say a population increase of around 30,000+ a year is quite a rise, wouldn't you ??? and that's the ones they know about !! and yes taxes do rise to pay for the rise in population and /or the taxes you pay are more stretched because of it, so people DO see it affecting them personally, whether it be in the Hospital service they get or local facilitites being affected.

Cape Blue

[QUOTE=Mally Lass] Didn't take long for refugees to appear - they are probably the reason the Gov has to steal the IHT from you in the first place!

I wish I was so sure that I would never be out of work, never have children, never be sick, never become disabled, never need a pension, never have a low paying job and not meet my bills and onwards.

Mally Lass

[QUOTE=Cape Blue] I will never have to pay IHT as my elderly mother doesn't own her own home and never will. I do have low paying job, and struggle to pay my bills, but I DO and it would be easy for me to just quit and let someone else pay for me to live, but I don't because I have pride and believe everyone should input to get something out. Hopefully I will never be in a position that I need any of these benefits and I will work hard for as long as I physically can to support MYSELF, and I suppose that makes me a bad person for moaning about supporting everyone else does it ?

Cape Blue

[QUOTE=Mally Lass] If you have a low paying job you are not paying enough tax to be supporting anyone else. You will be taking as much, if not more, out of the system as you are putting in - NHS, roads, military, police, fire, ambulance, etc etc.

Taffyles

[QUOTE=Mally Lass]
Oh dear. Soo you don't use National Health, have never gone to school, you never get sick, never get prescriptions, won't claim maternity leave and benefit, have a private dentist, don't have kids and won't get old.... and I truly hope you never become unable to work. Well I think they should make a special case for you as you are completely self sufficient and let you off your taxes. Or come out to the US and you'll pay more taxes and have no benefits at all, but then neither will anyone else so at least you won't be paying for 'them' and that will make you happy

There have been many studies done on the UK and US distribution of wealth- do some research, it may surprise you.

Cape Blue

The UK population increase is an order of magnitude higher than that - currently around 300,000 per annum. This is the same as a room of 200 people with one more person joining each year - it is actually quite small.

Those coming into the country are also paying tax and contributing to society so they are not relying on your tax to fund their services, they are funding it themselves.

Taffyles

Well Swansea University (that's in Wales) recently published a study saying they think UK needs to increase immigration by about 17% to help support the system (seeing as the birth rate is decreasing alarmingly in UK and other European countries).

Comparing to which country?? See the US admittedly takes in fewer refugees than UK percentage wise, but has an estimated 12 or is it 13 million illegal immigrants- they are, arguably 'good for the economy'. A lot of them pay taxes and will never be able to claim their little bit of social security when they get to 90 (or whatever the retirement age will have risen to by then).

Hey its fun comparing...

Mally Lass

Not for an Island this size it isn't.

I beg your pardon ??? Last year I worked in a City area which is predominantly Pakistani amongst others (Iraqi, Irani, Romanian, Turkish, Afghan, Kurdish + many more) and worked for a Sikh Charity. The street I worked in had roughly 17 other ethnic Charities in it (just 1 street), all of which are funded by our Government, for these communities that do not work. I am not racist, hence working for a Sikh Charity in the first place. These people were given accommodation by our Council, given free adult education courses + driving lessons free, given mobility cars etc, given benefits (regardless of the people that say they can't claim, I had to deal with the paperwork on a daily basis for them, and the majority of them are claimants), and were not 'asked' to work, because they all had 'Issues' of one or another. These charities, cater for the most part, for immigrants who need to attend the said charity in order for them to be 'released' from working ??? Please don't patronise me by saying they all fund themselves, and pay their taxes, because I for one personally know very different and if you knew half of what the average city's expenses were for these kinds of areas, you would fall over backwards.

Mally Lass

[QUOTE=Taffyles] I pay for prescriptions as do many and Dental is not free, so I pay for that too, unless you are not working. Yes I use the NHS when I need it, and why the hell shouldn't I ??? I pay enough in taxes each year to fund private medical insurance for a whole family. I'm not saying I'm self sufficient and never have, so why the attitude ??? I 'joined' the thread in stating why I think some are leaving the UK. Attacking me for having an opinion is a little harsh don't you think ?

Cape Blue

The vast majority of immigrants are from EU States such as Poland - they have no rights to most benefits unless they are working & their unemployment rate is less than that for the UK as a whole.

Asylum seekers are a much smaller percentage and are not permitted to work whilst their cases are being assessed - they are forced to claim.

Illegal immigrants are not entitled to benefits.

martinw01908

[QUOTE=Taffyles] I had to jump into this one too. I'm with Mally on this. Yes I use the national health, and why shouldn't I - I pay enough in tax for it! The problem with the NHS is that it may be 'free' to tax payers, but the service is shoddy and you can litrally die waiting for treatment. I myself, have had to wait 4 months form doctors referral to hospital consultant, who turned out to be useless and I am no nearer finding out what is wrong. I would gladly opt out of the NHS and stop paying for it and go private, so I can get decent treatment promptly. I can't afford both, and why should I pay for both even if I could?

Prescriptions aren't free, Yes some items are subsidised, but others are inflated. Maternity does not apply, I am male and I do not want to father and/or cannot afford to father any children living in this country. I would not want any unplanned children of mine growing up in this country anyway - it is not a good place in which to raise them.

Dentists, I cannot find an NHS dentist, so I have to go private, as do the majority of brits these days. Yes NHS dentists are pretty much non -exsistant.. remind me what are we paying all these taxes for again?

Coming to the US would be excellent, I cannot see how you pay more tax than us. Yes you are right, I like the fact the US has no social security safety net. This way the non-working lazy good for nothing leeching scroungers that we have here, won't be paid for by hard working me.

Taffyles

[QUOTE=Mally Lass] Right- so you do get something back for your taxes after all.

Refresh my memory, how much do you pay for prescriptions? What is the standard now- a fiver? six pounds per item? A laughable amount really when you know how much drugs cost. For example- My son's prescription for two medications last week came to nearly $300 and one of the meds was a generic substitute for the prescribed medication (which was 4 times more expensive). My hubby's monthly prescription for his type II diabetes comes to just over $200 (and that's with very good, and very expensive, health insurance).

My son had a big accident last year- 5 days in hospital came to $49,000, the 30 min chopper ride to the trauma centre was $8,500, the 5 min ambulance ride to meet the chopper was $900 and I can't remember what the surgeon, x-rays, medication etc came to altogether. He had no health insurance at the time. How much would that have cost him in UK? nothing.

The point of the argument is you DO get a lot back for your taxes and NI in UK. Compared to other countries, in my case the US, where pay just as much and sometimes more in taxes and social security and medicare.. and get nothing back. Leaving UK because of perceived high taxes is uniformed and downright silly IMO.

LMUK

[QUOTE=martinw01908] I'm sorry to break it to you but private care is pretty crap too. The only people I personally know that have had problems in the Uk were both with private care - in both cases sending them home too soon, probably because profit was their number 1 priority.

Here in the US I pay a fortune for healthcare and again I know of people treated badly. We have a friend who's only in his 30s that had a stroke last year, was kept waiting for hours in the ER and is worse because of it.

People seem to think that private healthcare is some amazing thing where they get perfect treatment, in reality its just the same as the NHS and you're just totally screwed if you can't afford it.

No, prescriptions aren't free for most people but in reality you get a very good deal and I think most people have no comprehension of how much the drugs actually cost. My husband had a pretty basic antibiotic prescription a few months ago - over $50 for just 1 pill!!

You say you can't see how taxes in the US can't be similar to the UK, but as someone who lives here I can say they definitely are - we pay federal income tax, social security, state income tax (some don't have it but usually have sales tax instead), and property tax and it does all add up. On top of that you have to think about health insurance etc as well - we pay well over $300 a month just for 2 of us and that's with no prescription coverage at all and we still have to pay a fortune if we're ill.

Most people in the UK just aren't realistic about how good they've got it and I guess you won't realise until you go live somewhere else.