NeonHippy

Inspired by BB's list of posts about MM2H I thought it would be useful to add one where newbies and people still considering MM2H could voice their concerns. It's been said elsewhere that nowhere is perfect and it would be nice if people with concerns could voice them here and either get an answer to allay their concern or at least put it into perspective with the many positives

To get the ball rolling:

The weather - she who must be obeyed is worried that tropical weather means constant rainfall, after all there must be a reason the tress are called rain forest.

Crime - are you really likely to be burgled on a regular basis if you live in a house rather than a condo?

JC3

Hi NeonHippy,

I only have experience of Penang Island. It appears there is frequent burglary of both houses and condos here, and indeed a lot of poverty. The poor and the ‘rich’ live side by side.

Except in the most upscale condos don’t expect the Security Guards to be properly trained, to have procedures that genuinely keep the place secure, to necessarily speak enough English, Chinese or Malay to understand you in an emergency, or to do very much else other than register visitors or open and close the gate. They may look smart in their uniforms, but beware - about a third of the security guards in Malaysia are illegal immigrants, are often very poorly paid (working 7 days a week, for about RM5 a hour ), and are frequency arrested, jailed and deported. Being a security guard in Malaysia is not a good job, and as a result poor security is a major problem.

So, self-help is essential. If you live in a house, obviously living in a gated and guarded development makes it more secure. Adding grills on the windows, PIR sensor lighting, an alarm system, and CCTV (with warning signs) will make your house less easy to burgle than others, and hopefully less attractive to burglars.

If you rent, my advice would be to only consider houses that have good quality grills. Burglars here come armed with parangs, and will hold a kitchen knife to your throat without compunction.

A typical Chinese-Malaysian solution to the burglary problem is to get a dog (as well as grills). The downside is a street full of dogs with endless barking. Once one dog starts they all start!

If you live in a Malay area they’ll be a lot less dogs of course.

Finally, I suggest leaving your small valuables in a safe deposit box at the bank.

Please don’t let the above put you off. It’s fine to live in a house, simply make sure it isn’t the easiest one on the street to break into.

JC3

bakedbean

from JC.

I would like to,add that actually it's the same problems ANYWHERE to be honest. Even almost crime free Singapore has plenty of break ins so I hear.

You just have to plan and be sensible.

When we lived in UK, our last house in deepest darkest Norfolk....beautiful house and countryside but we had alarm systems, locking windows all round, big security lights on outside of house. It's what you do to hopefully be safe. And no different here.

bakedbean

Re the weather, no it doesn't rain all the time and, even monsoon time in Penang is not so bad......not as bad as Phuket I can tell you.

For a lot of folks, it's the severe humidity that wears you down. Generally speaking , in Penang, December January February is quite nice and a bit breezy but the other nine months are,pretty humid and 30 to 35'degrees.

For me, the humidity is probably the worst part of living here...but there are so many plus points to counterbalance that.

NeonHippy

JC3 that's sound advice, although I'm not sure about fitting burglar bars. It would feel like being in prison. The key I guess is not to flaunt your riches and attract envy.

For perspective I found this resource International statistics: Compare countries on just about anything! NationMaster.com. The total crimes per 1000 people is 110 in the UK which ranks 4th highest in the world, South Africa which my South African boss always describes as ridden with crime compared to UK has just 59 crimes per 1000 inhabitants, Thailand 8.86 and Malaysia 6.85.

Like BB when she lived in Norfolk I live in a very rural location and although we have PIR lights I've never felt the need for a burglar alarm. Then again who would hear it?

Stuurman

A former UK PM once said: "There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics"
Numbeo does, apart from a cost of living comparison, also a crime comparison here is the one for UK and Malaysia.AFAIK the results are based on contributions from readers:
Index Info United Kingdom Malaysia
Crime Index: 41.79 69.90
Safety Scale: 58.21 30.10

Crime Comparison Between United Kingdom And Malaysia. Safety Comparison.

I still feel safer in Penang then in Amsterdam but KL seems to be a whole different matter.

NeonHippy

Hi Stuurman,

I was wondering who would be the first to point out the alternative figures from Numbeo. As I see it the figures from NationMaster are objective in that they count actual recorded crimes whilst the figures from Numbeo are subjective based on readers feelings.

My take on this is if you live in a country where petty crime (burglaries say) is common it is unlikely to get reported but if you live in a country where such crime is rare it is more likely to be reported. This will skew people's subjective view. There are dozens of examples of this. Take flying, this is statistically a far safer way to travel than by car on the roads but (certainly in the UK) most car accidents go unreported but air 'disasters' stay in the news for days and many people I know are afraid to fly.

Some people make a lot of money creating $billion industries by stirring up fear in people. Just google "USA preppers" to see what I mean.

Another example from personal experience, I took a fly drive holiday to Miami and the Florida Keys. At the airport I upgraded the car to a convertible and had the hood down the whole time. We toured a fair section of Miami including some fairly run down areas. At the end of the holiday, sitting in the airport waiting for our flight I got bored and started reading the card that the car hire firm had handed me at the start. It was full of do's and don'ts to avoid being rear ended, robbed mugged and killed. It was an absolute wonder that I survived that experience.

Having said all that, even objective measures need to be considered with a degree of care. In countries where there is widespread police corruption or little confidence in the police many crimes will go unrecorded.

I do take your point about location being important. I feel far safer in the Forest of Dean than I would living in certain areas of Liverpool.

Stuurman

But can these "objective" data be compared? Who gathers these data and more important who decides what's being published and what not? Malaysia is a third world country with a semi functioning police corps, lots of (petty) crimes indeed don't even get reported and will therefore not turn up in the data.

NeonHippy

Yes I agree you need to be careful with objective data. But I also think you need to be even more careful of public perception.

bakedbean

I think you do best listening to those who have been living here for a few years. It's the best advice you will get. I've been here 4+ years. I think Mr Stuurman has been here longer. JC3 also been here a while I believe.

Penang: it isn't crime free. But it's not crime riddled either, despite what you read. Like most tourist destinations, you just be aware. Play the game. Be sensible.

I was born and bred in London UK. Where would I feel safest walking about, Penang or London? Oh Penang wins hands down.

You want a house? Do what JC3 advises. Or pay big bucks at Seri Tanjung Pinang for 24 hour security going round the estate. Y'know but this is not a Penang thing. There were plenty of break ins in Norfolk UK when we were living there but folks don't make a big deal about it. Ha! And if you nab a burglar in Norfolk you may end up in prison yourself for harming the burglar Err you don't get that here.

NeonHippy

Consider myself well and truly admonished. But please don't get me wrong, I value the opinions of yourself, JC3 & Mr Stuurman and I'm pleased to hear none of you feel threatened in Penang.

The point I so spectacularly failed to make is that where something is based on mass opinion it needs to be viewed in the light of other extenuating circumstances and with a degree of care.

Anyway, here is wishing you all a very merry Christmas.

bakedbean

Hehe You have a good Christmas. It's a beautiful Christmas morning here. I might just have to post a picture.

bakedbean

It's an old thread but just wondering if Neon's concerns have been alleviated at all.

I go through my own concerns now (being recently widowed) whether I want to stay here forever, but I think I'm too lazy to move again and all the upheaval and paperwork attached. Mind you, plenty of paperwork just to stay here

NeonHippy

By the time I had started this thread I had done enough research to convince us that MY was a good choice for retirement but had only spent a short time travelling through the country. So there were a few questions in mind.

The weather app on my phone seems to be stuck on thunder storms for locations in MY. Yet we only experienced one day of light rain during a month in Penang. Two weeks in KL was an interesting experience. Every day we woke to glorious sunshine which lasted well into the afternoon. At around 3pm the clouds would start to build and an hour later it would suddenly get very humid with the heavens opening shortly after. A very impressive storm would then ensue for up to an hour after which the heat quickly dried things up. So yes it can be stormy every day but AFAIK the storms are short lived and it is easy to just stop under cover and have a coffee. Microclimates can also exist. Staying on Langkawi on the beach in the SW of the island we were bathed in sunshine all day everyday. But looking north towards the mountain I observed that warm moist air from the west was hitting the mountain, cooling as it rose and constantly shrouding the skywalk in cloud. I observed to my son that it was probably raining on the far side of the mountain. Sure enough, on the day we all rented motorcycles to ride around the island we hit rain and found a waterfall on that far side.

Security wise, I had read a fair bit about crime and problems in MY. Our experience so far has been far from this. Wandering around KL I would occasionally stop to refer to the map. I rarely had time to work out where we were before someone would stop and offer help. A couple of times we have found ourselves in the centre of a Hindu festival where we have been welcomed and offered free food. Like any place on earth there will be some rogue elements but I have not felt threatened in MY. The only time I have been robbed was in Rome. On that same trip I thwarted an attempt by a team of pickpockets trying to get into my pocket and my wife's bag just a few days later.

Having said all that we will most probably move into a condo rather than a house, because we intend to travel frequently and it will be a safer option to leave unoccupied.

InVinoVeritas

You're right - methinks Malaysia should change its advertising agency.

When I invite friends to come and stay in Penang they will often say that Malaysia is far too Muslim and yet it's the same people who then take a holiday in Tunisia, Dubai or Bali!