pdr

I'm not trying to be pedantic, but the Tories did not win the election! Yes, they secured more seats than any of the opposition parties but won only 318 seats out of a total of 650 - or in other words 332 seats were won by others.

mrken30

Has Theresa May got a thing about orange men?

mfesharne

The party that wins the most seats (as in more seats than any other individual party) wins the election & can form a Government but if they win a majority over all rivals combined then they hold an absolute majority........ Which IMO is never a good thing because it allows them to do whatever they like.

In the current case they won by a very narrow margin which has resulted in a hung Parliament.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hung_parliament

But they did still win albeit by not much more than a whisker. Which is why the Conservatives are forming the government.

pdr

The party that wins the most seats is invited to form the next government, but it is still possible for a party with fewer seats to do so. That will not happen, as a Corbyn minority government will be even more fragile than Theresa May's.

In a strange way, the Tories lost the battle but won the war.

Red Eric

Trying to form a government

Red Eric

They haven't won anything yet - this war is far from over, even if you restrict it just to the election and its consequences.

May is toast, even if they do succeed in forming a government. Another leader has to be found and there is a very strong possibility of another election within this year to "ratify" the new PM.

mfesharne

As I said previously, my guess is she'll resign & another GE called but my preference would be for her to stay & not call another GE but rather form a cross party (Brexit) negotiating team who are intent on striking the best deal for the country rather than scoring political points off each other & pressing for a deal that'll suit them rather than the country as a whole......... but I won't be holding my breath on that one.

Time will tell though.

Red Eric

Either way, hard Brexit is being re-thought, which is good. That is one direct and positive outcome of the election, even if we do continue to have to put up with a Tory government.

Another might well be what sort of policies, Brexit aside, the Tories put in their manifesto for the next election. They're being forced away from the path May chose and if they don't see that and abandon the austerity politics they risk Corbyn's Labour in power.

GeniB

I see you read my post no 25

EMR

The Tories were expected to increase their majority by at least 50 seats, they lost seats.
Labour was supposed to be humiliated , they won seats.
May was supposed to emerge as a stronger leader with more authority.
She was humiliated.
UK politics is a little more complicated than the number of seats.

mfesharne

As I see it the Cons are the best of a woefully poor choice......... Certainly nowhere near good & their last manifesto was almost targeted at putting their core voters off of voting for them so let's hope the new manifesto will concentrate on fewer, fairer & more important issues.

Red Eric

I have to say I'm reading these calls for cross-party agreements and consensus with some considerable astonishment right now. I see May and Gove are at it too and no doubt plenty of others will join in.

However, to date the whole thing was being done secretively and coercively and with no opportunity whatsoever of involvement from other factions of the Conservatives let alone other parties - to the point where even the legality of what was going on was quite rightly called into question through the courts.

And it was all cheered on (in the most unpleasant manner, if I may make so bold) by those who voted leave, who seemed petrified that following normal democratic processes would somehow snatch their little victory away from them.

And now you want concensus?

mfesharne

Anyone that's ever negotiated any kind of a business contract will know you never let the other side know what you hope for because if you do, they'll nail you to the minimum for you & the maximum for them and the Brexit negotiations are no different so I'm not at all surprised the UK Govt doesn't want to lay out it's plan beforehand.... anyone that did would be a fool......... and that's why May hasn't even committed to anything with regard to EU immigrants that are already in the UK....... to do so would weaken her hand.

As I see it, the issue of whether Brexit will or will not happen was decided a year ago when the votes were counted & now all that remains is for the deal to be decided & the way to get the best deal is to have the best negotiating team possible no matter what party they're from.

But of course, that relies on all of them being able to bury the hatchet & get on with the job which (IMO) is highly unlikely because none of the politicians of any party are trustworthy.

Red Eric

I wouldn't disagree in the slightest that the issue of whether the UK would leave was decided a year ago.

However, what constitutes leaving is very much up for discussion and holding an election in order to endorse a particularly dangerous negotiating strategy after triggering article 50 (having allowed no previous discussion on the matter) was sheer lunacy.

Whether you acknowledge it or not, you have conceded that the opposition to May was, in fact, quite strong enough. It got the public behind it, endorsed a different approach (both to Brexit and yo other matters) and has the Tories well and truly on the back foot and changing their stance considerably.

mfesharne

I can't help but feel the whole thing was a stuff up because DC expected an overwhelming remain vote & so phrased the question on the ballot paper too plainly but we have to live with what was actually voted on which was simply to leave as opposed to leave under this, that or the other condition so effectively it's a moot point.

I agree May was indeed strong enough, didn't need a GE & made a massive cock up by calling one & she made it a whole lot worse with that stupid manifesto that targeted her core voters, especially the grey vote.

But as with the Brexit referendum & DC's negotiating trip before it, what's done is done & we must all live with the situation as it is rather than as we'd like it to be.