masterbaits

Sorry for all the palather , but i hope you dont mean your gonna have the car in pt for over 183 days in any one year.Of course a year ends on dec31 , and starts anew on 1 jan though in pt law and on its return to the uk is afresh , keep your tickets as proof though in the car for the return trip ready for an overzealous gnr.

AS you stated no mot needed if the car is new.

enjoy your stay and hopeful residency.

peterfc

Hi Cheshiregirl

Good solution. It will also give you the chance to bring back things you need but can't do without. I hope that when this all goes ahead it's at a time that all goes well for you.

Peter

Sue

To those it may concern ... lets be civil and keep to the facts

Many thanks ... as you were, and all that ....

Fredbargate

masterbaits you have wrongly accused me twice of criminal / illegal activities

Should I stoop to your level and point out you user name is very apt??

cheshiregirl

Thanks Peter we are looking forward to our time in PT.Regards Cheshiregirl.

peterfc

Hi All

I recently Posted about Matriculating a Car. The difference being i started about all the Crap people put on the Forums. In my case nobody on the Forums i posted it on had a word to say. Why I Posted Fact and i know it Fact because i was the one who Matriculated the car mentioned about.

While i respect Forum members i have no time for those who post information and claim it is correct. Unless information is correct and can be backed up would it not be better to have kept miss information of the post.

I should not be at this time personal but knowing Fred for so long and finding his information always of help i can't understand what things then have to become personal.

How does some of the Crap posted help the OP. Also why should new members come back to get help and also to pass on there experiences.

Well got that of my chest.

To those who want to help then make sure that you can back up what you say. It helps nobody if you give wrong advice.

Peter

masterbaits

I read your guide , found it spot on

Its not exactly centralised their system , or simple.Your guide , one of many on these forums as you have noted IMO needs to be stickied , highlighted with the added proviso that theres companies that will charge you more and that a)it was correct at the time it was done , and b)of course that like all things pt what is right today might like the wind change tommorrow , and c)prove to them they are wrong should they try it on in the office.

Its always been my view that the over beuracratic systems in portugal are need of overhaul , one thing that the rest of the eu agree on for a change is indeed change.With this austerity can only come simplicity , or longer waits which I am already finding for official paperwork approval on other matters.

You posted your opinion of the process , based on fact , so have a reason to ask that others do so in order to clear up the difference in what is opinion and what is fact.

I did the same , with the added benefit of highlighting a company faq vs national body dvla , current laws etc , and if right/wrong.Much like you did about matriculation.

Of course people think because it was a company vs an individuals post vs an individual , that the company were giving the right facts if another person agrees with it , thats the way people think , and how/why they can be conned.This is true also with your guide , where you can be told one thing from a company , another from the pt depts and again another from internet posters.

Its all too easy in the expat community and on internet forums , where an insurance agent could take your money for a worthless policy and advise against compliance of the laws of uk and where the car is being driven.A shiny shop front vs words typed on a keyboard , by someone you dont know from adam , anyones instinct tells you who they reckon is right , but then again Barclays have very nice offices not like they mis-sell products.

You still have in the community the beleif that all these cars are legal on uk plates , when most of them are not.Your guide tells them how to be legal with an ex uk car after 183 days of living there in a year , its just the same as you as a resident have to do....and to add as a legal resident you cannot drive foriegn plated cars legally.

A Sticky is overdue imo.

tombo

It would be handy if people who hold these insurance policies with the likes of Abbeygate Gib would come on here with their experiences of making a claim and the final result.

I do not know of any claims but I know of people who drive around here on UK plates and have motor insurance with Abbeygate, it costs a bit more but not as much as returning to the UK for a MOT then UK road tax then immediately SORN it for a refund.

sir recorder

What happens if you take your car from UK to Portugal for 5 months 29 days then drive into Spain for a week, coming back to PT afterwards for another 5 months 29 days?

This 6 month rule, is it 6 months in a year? Or is it 6 months in a calendar year?

what if I spent 5 months 29 days in 2011 in Portugal, and another 5 months 29 days in 2012, wintering elsewhere in the EU, not necessarily in UK?

One major problem running a UK car abroad is the cost of having to bring it home again for its annual MOT and re-registration. Is there any prospect that an EU wide system of MOTs will be introduced? The damn English Channel is so expensive to cross. And shipping a car to PT so expensive.

masterbaits

I would reckon its 6 months in any 12 month period from first entry , be that a calendar year or 12 months.The word year is used by people , 12 months is used on docs.But I would give your argument a run up the pole , as the consensus for year is 1 jan to 31 dec , then you have a technical argument say if you had the change in the cars use from one place to the other on the change.

Simply returning to spain for a day would not matter , as soon as the car is in pt for a second that actually counts for a day.I would think that any legal argument would be on the "normally used" or "normally parked".THe only real exceptions being work related cars , ie registered as a commercial for constant driving in and out of eu states and the rule would not apply anyway.

There is exclusions which is TOURING and without being actually resident (think glampsy), but even then theres still not an eu wide consensus , ie the uk can impart specific plates for between 183 days and up to 2 years depending on criteria on non uk vehicles.So even though your just shy of 183 days in one country and in another with a uk car , you asked about that specifically , its safe to do so , but then your into another zone entirely with regard to the eu conditions being met and importantly whether the uk now class the car as exported.

Then you have the Mot aspect , you simply cannot be out of the uk for a year anyway and drive on eu roads without it.So being out for a year , unless the car is new which has no need for 2 years , it needs one to get back for another.You can only drive on uk roads on the way to a boooked appointment without one , and having it trailered to the eu exit point is the legal way without one being current.

I think by now anyone with a brain knows that MOT docs not done in the uk are illegal if they actually read the papers , despite arguments from a couple of legal cases that went through the uk system to uk levels abroad , there was two companies offering mots in spain and as they said "legal mot" but if vosa cannot and will not check them , and the computer is not linked to vosa then they argued it wasnt legal , with these conditions not being met and importantly that the eu would not allow them to mot abroad because its out of their territorial jurisdiction.

I would like to see a eu system myself , after all ec compliance is mandatory for cars and bikes at the retail end.

I dont like the current levels of mot in the eu , I would prefer a system of mots mandatory yearly and every 15k miles with a touch of tuv and like the japanese system of near complete overhauls.But with my opinion being at one end of the scale theres always the other end of bodging....and backhander mots.

It is pretty expensive to do a freight , or travel to the ports just to be legal , hence why so many people just give up as it simply isnt worth the hassle...unless they are driving cars that are very expensive in the first place , so a trip is nothing compared to matriculation.

However as I mentioned already , a few times , that like the cars anyone resident for 183 days in a year in an eu state like pt has to register as a resident , which will make driving a PRIVATE use foreign registered car illegal at least in pt .... whether you own it or not , whether its registered in your name or someone back in the uk , if its not pt plated its a pull and impound which could well be much more expensive than a return to uk.

The other GREY but legal area option being a UK ltd company car for work related use , just dont expect a porsche to be able to be used as a commercial LT and of course have the road tax and registration changed from PLG.Again this is best exploited when your using expensive cars , new rangies ,yank trucks , hummers etc and of course higher insurances as well , but when you again consider the price of matriculation or buying the same car in PT then its a considerable saving even with the extra overheads , especially so if your already S.E and working this way anyway.

steve01

Hi ,
i asked the police -
they said you can have the car here for any 6 months (inlcuding returns to the UK or Spain etc) from the first date you enter within a 12 month period starting from that date.
So leaving the country for a day or a week etc makes no difference to the overall situation.
They also said that you must have prrof of the entry/departure dates otherwise if it suits them they'll assume the worst case..

steve01

On a different note car prices have dropped dramatically here.
I visited a garage for a service last week and mercedes and Audi both had 'nearly new' - less than 500km on the clock cars with over 20,000 euros off. - yes 20,000euros.

sir recorder

Driving one-way from my home in UK to Portugal via France and Spain according the Viamichelin is as follows

Costs
233.28 GBP
Toll 71.25 GBP | Petrol 155.57 GBP | Road tax 6.46 GBP
Time
21h19m which 19h23 on motorways
Distance
1342 miles which 1304 mi on motorways

This excludes the ferry for which you can add for a single one way

Folkestone to Calais | Friday 15 June 2012 £75


21 hours suggests to me at least 2 nights stay en route [I don't like driving at night] one in France one in Spain

Cost
France - Tours £60 to £70 per night
Spain - Burgos £50 per night

Total £428

Plus Breakdown cover extra, Plus Com Insurance extra

I reckon you haven't got much change from £1,000 both ways

gedscottish

__________________________________________________ ___
Certainly new list prices on new cars have not dropped! This was official Audi & Merc garages?

Benny Dorm

Still ridiculously expensive and nearly double the price compared to the UK, example: Portugal 2010 Mercedes C200 CDI Classic Manual €33,000 £26500) - UK 2010 C200 CDI Avantgarde with Auto, €17,500 (£14,000)