KarenE

Hi,

my family are planning on moving to the Algarve next year, my partner has a job already. I have 3 daughters aged, 10, 10 and 9 and wandered if anyone could tell me about their expereinces of schools here. I know about the International schools but wandered if anyone had placed their children in a Portuguese public school and how this worked out.

Many thanks


karen

Diane_76

Hi Karen,

I moved to the Algarve recently with a view of placing my daughter in a Portuguese school. I considered the International Schools, but was put off by the fees. However, after visiting local Portuguese Schools and hearing some rather dramatic stories about the problems faced by the current educational crisis in Portugal, I opted for an International School. I looked at the International School and VVIS International School Algarve. I was particularly impressed by Vale Verde International School and am probably going to enrol my daughter there. I believe that they have a 100% IGCSE pass rate and the web site www.vvis.org seems to want me to enrol my daughter even more. There fees are much more moderate than the other International Schools. I am sure that the Portuguese Schools are just as good, but there has been a lot of trouble in the past with teachers going on strike and the Ministry of Education being in a turmoil. I suggest you do your own research as all the International Schools in the Algarve seem quite different.

gedscottish

Dramatic stories???? Please tell me more!
About the teachers going on strike,the truth is they should but most of them do not have the courage to do it or unfortunately the public backing. The Portuguese seem to think teachers have a great life, paid a lot, work little and holiday a lot.....which is bulls#it unless your an art or P.E teacher.The only problem the Portuguese education system is the lunatic of an Education minister (originally a primary teacher)
Private schools may be a good idea as the kids tend to get better marks, but employers are well aware of this so it can go against them also, and from what I have heard the private schools do not give the students as good an education,so you have the choice of private with good marks and an easy time(if they fail the exam they get to sit it again) Another thing is the teachers who work at private schools are generally the ones who left university with poorer marks hence the reason they can not get employed by a government school(which they all want) exception being the younger teachers who are finding it difficult to get any employment.
Me, I would only send my kids to the primary private school,but for secondary education the public Portuguese school.

gedscottish

Think I got a bit carried away there with that rant....

cinderellahair

Hi Karen, [

We moved here in 2001 when our daughters were 9 and 11 and they went straight into the portuguese system. They are both DYSLEXIC and the system here has helped them far more than the UK!! I know some people snoot at the state system, yes there are strike days, and sometimes a teacher wont turn up for a particular class, but thats the relaxed life here! Our daughters had extra classes to help learn the language---supplied by the school, they also received extra help for their dyslexia and allowances are made in the tests for this. The system is not as stressful for the child here, not so much pressure early on. The sports facilities are great....and most of all they learn to speak portuguese LIKE the portuguese and not a foreigner speaking rough portuguese!!

All my girls friends are portuguese, and to be honest they are much better girls for it. Now at 16 and 14 they are loving kind and giving, not die hard party animals with a baby at home or on the dope like many of their counter parts in the uk. We have friends with girls at international school, our daughters dont like them very much as they want the lastest Ipod and the boy who's dads got the best car or villa etc. Most of my girls friends families struggle, and the girls have learnt to appreciate things more because of it.

We are very proud of how our girls have turned out, and also our little surprise boy (born here in Faro hospital) who has been in nursery since 3months and is fluent in both languages too.

If I can be of any more help, dont hesitate. I know I might sound biased, but that is my opinion!!!

Regards, Diana xx
QUOTE=KarenE]Hi,

my family are planning on moving to the Algarve next year, my partner has a job already. I have 3 daughters aged, 10, 10 and 9 and wandered if anyone could tell me about their expereinces of schools here. I know about the International schools but wandered if anyone had placed their children in a Portuguese public school and how this worked out.

Many thanks


karen[/QUOTE]

cinderellahair

Couldn't agree more with what you said....although for a child not born here, primary state education is the best way to learn the language, the younger they are the better!!!

As for the teachers, my best friend (Portuguese) is an english teacher here, adores your charges and is adored in return (and they are teenagers!!) State encourages the best teachers because of the benefits and pension, and the less qualified end up private.

3 cheers for your rant....I applaud you!!

Diana xx

Diane_76

Hi,

I am enlightened by your personal experiences, however I wish to draw your attention to some facts about the Portuguese education system which is currently ranked by UNESCO as one of the worst in Europe and indeed one of the worst in the developed world. (www.unesco.com)

"There are also concerns related to the large dropout rates (mostly in the secondary and higher education systems) and the multi generational high functional illiteracy rate, when compared with other developed countries. The education system of Portugal is regulated by the State through the Ministry of Education, and the Ministry of Science and Technology and Higher Education. The public education system is the most popular and well established, but there are also many private schools at all levels of education." (www.wikipedia.com)

"As of the early 1990s, Portugal still had an illiteracy rate that ranged between 14 and 20 percent according to various studies and estimates, although many of those who could not read were older people. Another serious problem was low school enrolment after the primary cycle, especially in rural areas, where many children began work at an early age. As of 1987, 87.4 percent of Portuguese completed less than the upper level of secondary school, a rate that had improved only slightly in recent decades, and was much inferior to the EC average of 54 percent. Facilities and equipment at all levels were often outdated and in short supply. Although the number of school teachers had increased greatly in recent years, teachers were poorly paid, and their overall morale was poor. Many specialists held that the curriculum at the secondary level needed to be revised to make it more relevant in preparing young people for their working lives. In addition to more modern facilities, the universities needed to increase their enrolments and support research more strongly." (www.unesco.com)

I also wish to point out that there seems to be a general misconception as regards under qualified teachers in private schools - the school that I have enrolled my daughter (VVIS International School) has more than 50% of its staff with a Masters qualification or at least 2 undergraduate degrees! You can have a look at their site which actually contains these facts. I am aware that this might not be reflective of all private schools, but it is worth checking these facts with the schools (private and public). Also remember that while the education system in Portugal has a bad record as substantiated by actual facts from UNESCO and not just hearsay, there are some excellent public schools as already mentioned by some bloggers! Remember that every parent has different priorities, so don't take my opinion or anyone else's. Investigate the possibilities and find what is best for your child's educational development.

Diane

cinderellahair

Am confused? UNESCO and the link you provided is a website for office accessories, import/export, am i missing something??!!

Each to their own regarding education, time is the best test, and our daughters have flourished, been educated above and beyond the call of duty due to their dyslexia, and are happy. It works for us, no peer pressure, no hassle. But if i may point out, pamplets and advertising is all very well, but the proof is in the pudding, and there are many that have jumped from the private ship to the public, and that always makes me think.

Each parent always knows best for their child, and the children rely on us to make the best decisions for them. Fortunately our daughters are very sociable,and were not fazed at entering a school 6 years ago where they didn't speak the language, some children might, some find it a culture shock, others just want the security of their own language. Parents will place their charges where they are most suited, educationally and personally.

..........

Nomad_H

Try this www.unesco.org


Regards

Nomad

cinderellahair

Thanks for the correct link!

Had a look at the literacy results for 2000-2004 97.2% to 99.4 isn't bad! But each school is different, as in england, some are better than others. Blinding people with too much science is very confusing, ask around for the best local schools recommended by other ex pats or local portuguese.

I still stand by the fact that if this is your chosen country of residence, the children should learn portuguese correctly, if at public or private portuguese school. International schools (english side) learn portuguese as we learnt French, so if you want pigeon speaking kids then fine!!

So apart from all the opinions on here, you know your children karen, and will do the best for them.

xxxx

TouristTrap

I agree with putting them in a Port. school for at least a couple of years in order to develop their language. They will pick it up within 3 months or so.

gedscottish

If you have an older kid i.e 14+ then maybe the international school is the best bet, its unfair to expect a teenager to learn the language in time and do well in subjects.

Back to whats best teaching wise (state v private) some valid facts have been mentioned and its true many older Portuguese were not educated. But times have changed a lot since then.
In a private school pupils are often offered more one to one tuition although if a student is struggling in the state schools they will also get one to one(if there is a chance they will fail the year).
I said before that "all" teachers here want to work in a state school for the obvious conditions (pension etc) but it should also be noted that in state schools the teacher's "teach" for 20-22 hours per week and in a private around 32 hours is the norm! So it leaves you to think the private ones do not have the time or the will to prepare their lessons well at home.
The moral of the story is.... there are benefits with both...

weepeep50

My daughter, her husband and two children moved out to Albufeira two years ago. They opted to send the children to a brand new state primary school. The older of the two, now 9, is doing very well at school and has picked up the language. The younger, now 7, is not doing so well, her teacher absolutely refuses to speak to her in English and she does not give her any one to one tuition whatsoever. I came across this site while trying to find out if there were any steps my daughter could take to get the education her child needs. They cannot afford to send her to a private school and obviously the state system is not working for my granddaughter. She does speak and understand Portuguese but has problems with reading and writing. She is frustrated that her brother can do these things in both languages and has actually said to him that it is ok for him, as he learned enough in English before moving to Portugal, to be able to carry on with the English side of things, but she is having to learn both at the same time. I know that is very convoluted, but I just can't think of a simpler way of putting it.
Looking at the replies here, it seems that most people find the state system works for their children. Does anyone know of a state school in that area, which might be able to give my granddaughter the attention she needs. If I thought that a private school was the only answer, instead of working at home for my partner, I would try to get a better paid job, so as to pay for it myself

gedscottish

As I first read your post I thought your grand daughter was maybe just being a little Madam and that she was being difficult, but really what she said to her brother makes sense, if she did not have a full grasp of English beforehand then it must be quite a a confusion for her now. Would it not be a better idea to get her private one to one lessons after school or at the weekend than take her out of the state school?! I'm pretty sure she is in the best situation where she is to learn Portuguese(at least the speaking part) but obviously she needs to catch up on the other kids in her class who have learned spoken Portuguese from birth and I would think at 7 years old she has only missed out on one year of Portuguese schooling?! So....I'm sure she will soon catch up!! Portuguese should be first and foremost for her but obviously you want her to have the best opportunity's in life so English is also essential for her.
There are plenty of private lessons available from teachers looking for some extra cash and also many private institutions, I know its a bit different but when I 1st came here I got some private lessons at one one, it was "Clifford College" I'm pretty sure your daughter could find something similar in her area(considering I live in pretty rural area of the north). I paid 7.50 euros per hour for one to one, but from what I understand that was very cheap so maybe expect to pay 15-25 euros per hour. As an adult 1 hour 3 times a week is already a lot for our minds to take it all in but as a child's brain takes in a lot more she could cope with more hours of learning(if need be)
Good luck......Ged

TouristTrap

I'm sorry she hasn't picked it up. Does she have many Portuguese friends? And how about asking the 9 year old to speak only Portuguese to his sister and have her speak English to you?

I'm sure she'll get the hang of it. Some children go through 'language confusion' but it sorts itself out within no time.

I would go with the tutoring bit to catch up.