Cherrypop

I'm looking ahead to next winter. Having moved to my modern townhouse this January and the only source of heating being a rather hungry wood burner, I'm keen to consider something that will provide background heat where I most need it. The place has been very cold at times since I moved in and the thought of spending an entire winter chilled to the bone isn't appealing.

I've been told about infrared panels. They can be wall or ceiling hung and can simply be plugged into a wall socket if not directly-wired so there are no installation costs. On first look, they seem to be very cost-effective compared to most other forms of heating. I'm keen to keep running costs low (who isn't) so despite the initial outlay I wonder if they could be a viable solution.

I'm thinking mainly background heat in the bedrooms and maybe an additional couple downstairs for when the wood burner isn't lit. Given the rather open-plan design of my house, something that heats the walls and furniture rather than the air sounds perfect.

Has anyone got these installed or have an opinion on how effective they would be?

EMR

There are electric panels sold in the major diy stores , they range from a simple basic one to faux stone .
They do seem very effective.

Cherrypop

Thanks although I'm not sure these are infrared which work in a very different way. I'll check them out to be certain though.

Moses2013

Have them in bathroom and you're best bet would be the ones made in Germany, as not all brands are great. Can recommend welltherm and of course there are others like redwell etc.


The thing is that you have to know the exact size of rooms and they won't be suitable for every home and depends on your insulation.


Taken from website:
The best way to assess the requirements of your property is by providing us the below information via email:

• Type of panels you want to install in each room (Glass Series, Metal Series etc)
• Type of property (groundfloor flat, house, office etc.)
• Age of property
• Floor plan
• Room dimensions (width, length, height)
• Insulation information
• Desired room temperature per room

Now, for properties with poor insulation, higher ceilings than 3.5m, offices, shops and industrial applications, we highly advise you to get in touch with us and provide us with your requirements so that we can carefully assess them and provide you with a detailed infrared heating panel recommendation.

Cherrypop

Thanks I was given a link to look at yesterday with lots of info. I'm curious if anyone already has these installed and what they think of them. The person who gave me the link has only got one in their bathroom but is very impressed. I'd quite like an opinion about keeping a whole house warm and whether they really are as economical to run as they seem to be.

Moses2013

The thing is that any heating system you use, is only really as economical the way an owner uses it and how the insulation in the house is. The good thing about these, is that if you have it on longer, you can feel the walls release the heat slowly next day when you have the heating off, but they still run on electricity while they're on and it just depends how you use and position them. If somebody would have them running constantly due to poor insulation, it would be worse than other heating systems, but because they heat the object and walls, you shouldn't/don't need to have them running 24/7. They also have a great feel, no noise etc.


I am very happy with the two we have, but I don't use them constantly and only heat the bathroom in the evening, or a short time in the morning. Depending on the brand, many people in Germany use them as main heating and they are easy to install etc. There are a lot of benefits, but different heating options will suit different homes and people.

Cherrypop

My place is a modern townhouse - about 12 years old. Apart from double glazing I have no idea if the insulation is up to scratch. There's no access to the roof space to check up there. I have properties either side of me so not hugely exposed to the elements so I'm kind of assuming that insulation overall isn't too bad as such.

I don't want a hot house. I like my bedroom fairly cool although it's nice to wake up to a warm room when it's cold outside. The 2 spare bedrooms would only need heating if I had visitors, which in winter months would be fairly infrequently I imagine. My lounge area is the main place that could do with warmth and it's open plan to the stairs and landing with high ceilings. I'm out a lot during the day so it's not practical having the log burner going until late afternoon / early evening. I'll have to do some calculations to see how much power I'm likely to use to keep it gently warm throughout the winter months.

Moses2013

Sounds like they would work for you. Also getting one for guest room soon.

RichardHenshall

You could consider reverse cycle air conditioning. As well as the comfort benefit in summer, when used for heating they will deliver between two and four times the amount of heat that you pay for.

Cherrypop

I'm trying to avoid having aircon installed because of the expense, both of installation and running costs. They're also another way of heating the air rather than the fabric of the building.

I believe the infra red panels are virtually maintenance-free, there's no noise or air movement and from what I can see, will cost me no more than aircon units to buy. They also heat the building itself rather than the air and all these things appeal to me.

RichardHenshall

Everything (or body) that is not in line of sight of your infra-red heater will remain unheated, except for the much slower conduction and convection (by air movement) of heat from those heated parts to the unheated parts.

I accept and agree with your dislike of the noise (though good ones can be surprisingly quiet) but in a draft-free environment it is the ambient air temperature that largely determines whether you feel warm or cold, unless you've radiant heaters shining at you.

If the cost of installation was similar for aircon and infra-red heaters, I would choose the aircon every time.

Cherrypop

Which is presumably why they are sited high on the wall or on the ceiling.....

I'm still reluctant to go down the aircon route unless I find that the summer heat is so stifling I can't cope without it. I really am not in a position to afford running the blooming things so if they're not there, I can't be tempted. I have stayed regularly with a friend who had some very expensive aircon units installed last year. They're reasonably quiet but still intrusive in my opinion. I also found that when using them for heating, the room got cold very quickly after switching off. I'm looking for something that will provide a gentle background heat to keep the chill off when I'm not there. The wood burner will be regularly used, as it has been since I arrived for the times I'm at home in the evenings.

Tonyj

We have a brand called Heatwafers installed in our townhouse in the living room and main bedroom. They are designed to be left on all the time during the winter months.

They are quite cost-effective but the main benefit is they give off a nice type of heat; very similar to central heating in the UK. I don't like the heat from the aircon which I find too dry.

Welcome | www.heatwafer.com

The cost between 92 and 140 Euros to buy depending on the size. I would suggest going for the largest one for bigger rooms. They are attached to the wall buy plug into a normal socket. The place we bought from in Tavira installed them free of charge.

This page shows their cost over one hour and 24 hours. I think they are cheaper than burning wood. Technical | www.heatwafer.com

MrBife

A lot of the perceived discomfort is due to the air being damp. Reducing it will make a room 'feel' warmer. AC units can operate in dehumidify mode as well as hot and cold so they do offer advantages.

I would suggest you wait until you have experienced a summer in that house before deciding - it sounds like it has zero insulation so you may have some comfort issues of the opposite kind in a few months.

It's always better to spend money on insulation if you are staying in that property - spot heating just creates condensation and wastes a lot of energy.

liveaboard

No, not cheaper than wood.

Whatever label or finish on an electric heater, they are all exactly the same electrically; for every watt of electricity, you get a watt of heat. not more, not less. A watt for a watt.

The exception is the reverse cycle air-conditioners, also referred to as heat pumps. Their efficiency depends on the outside temperature, and drops off when it gets really cold.
Since it rarely gets that cold in southern Portugal, they will save a lot of energy.

However, they're spinning whirring complex machines that make noise and will wear out after a while; life expectancy is 10-20 years.