AliceCaroline

The UK position that it could be anytime between article 50 and our exit two years later will hopefully be unacceptable to the EU team, hopefully they will insist that it is our leaving date.

The UK will be worried that there will be a mad rush of EU citizens arriving before the cut off date.

I'd head to Portugal tomorrow if I could.

AliceCaroline

Point 49) is good news, again this may depend on the Specific Date for us....

Example case study: UK nationals currently residing in another EU Member State with UK-insured healthcare
Sarah is a UK national who retired to Spain in 2005. She is drawing a UK state pension and has a UK S1 form registered in Spain. The S1 form is a standard EU certificate which demonstrates an individual’s entitlement to healthcare in their country of residence. Individuals are required to register the S1 document in their new EU Member State of residence. This means that the UK reimburses Spain the cost of providing medical treatment to her.

Sarah has a UK issued EHIC, which she can use if needed during temporary visits to another EU country (not the UK).

After the UK leaves the EU, we want to secure Sarah’s current healthcare entitlements so that they will continue on the same basis.

AllanB

Keep up with your plans, everything will be fine, all that will happen is there will be a form to fill in. Once that crooked piece of crap Junker has been put in his place and the EU leaders realise which side their bread is buttered, we will all be left with one extra form, although knowing Portugal that may be two.

The other possibility is that the EU will break up before any of this happens, EFTA will return and Germany and France will merge to form a new state called Deutschlandastan.

Either way don't let these remaoners get you down.

nogard

Good post. Roll on the breakup of the EU!

Rosemary

In previous threads you have all been asked not to make any of your posts about the future of people living or planning to move to Portugal an opportunity to cause unrest between those who voted in or those who voted out. If this thread even slightly starts to become a war zone it will be promptly closed.

Please do not become trolls on the subject.

The truth is that NO-ONE knows what is to happen at this stage in the process. Posters may speculate and voice their opinion provided that it is not barbed and liable to incite others.

Rosemary

AllanB

I hear what you say Rosemary, but we do need to project some optimism, when there is a certain amount of uncertainty. Nothing is life threatening, just a bit of red tape on the horizon.

These people are planning a future here and should hear what a great place this is, we are new here and so far we like what we see. To a newbe all this doom and gloom can sometime become a self fulfilling prophecy, I have seen it before, where people go home without good reason.

So, if there is nothing to worry about, don't worry, life is too short.

Diddion

Yes, Rosemary. I also am keen that this thread remains a source of informed speculation and of actual information. Whatever one's views, there can be no doubt that we are all entering a period of change and uncertainty, and there are bound to be individual gains and losses. It is the future which should, I believe, exercise us now, not the rights and wrongs of past decisions, and it is the future which this thread is all about. Personally, I have found most of the posts and all of the links immensely interesting and useful.

Diddion

Good points, AllanB. I don't see this as a doom and gloom situation, though, and whatever the oucome of talks - or even no outcome, as May once threatened, Portugal will become our new home. After all, people have relocated to the Continent before the EU was thought of, and will continue even if the EU were to collapse. But the conditions we are and will be subject to are of real significance.

macliam

Well said - whatever the outcome of Brexit, it may be an inconvenience to people who are used to the way it is now and it may be slightly more complicated, but if non-EU citizens can come here now, settle and have a good life, it won't be impossible.

Once all the huff and puff is over, countries with a significant expat community will likely make arrangements to accommodate them, just as they have bilateral agreements with other countries. As Portugal has a significant number of its citizens living in the UK, this is even more likely. The scope of such agreements may be limited by an overall EU policy, but not the detail.

Diddion

Despite recent pronouncements an 'conversion' of approaches between EU and UK, the picture remains muddy, and the agreements could, anyway, be discarded if negotiations fail. Well, unless the UK contingent begin to understand the limitations of their negotiating power, failure remains clearly on the cards,

The current position is for existing expats, on exit day, to have continued healthcare. However, the date of exit is not agreed, with the EU requiring the actual date of exit, and the UK proposing some unspecified date between the trigger of article 50 and the actual exit date. It is not clear what will happen to the rights of those who choose to emigrate after the exit date.

There seems to be less uncertainty about pensions, which should be uprated for everyone.

Does anyone have any furher thoughts or additional intelligence on the picture?

peterfc

Hi All

As I run a business here I perhaps should worry but I'm enjoying life to much to be bothered to worry about anything.

I would say move and enjoy life things can only get better.

Peter

EMR

Intelligence is something lacking in those we are trusting to resolve this mess.

AliceCaroline

The date of withdrawal is March 2019, isn't that the same as the exit date?
I thought that the as yet unspecified "specified date" is referred to as the Specified date, or cut off date, not the exit date.

Have you seen this government document released after the last talks?

https://www.gov.uk/government/upload..._Cion_V2.2.pdf

The bit on healthcare (personal) made me feel better, IF I read it right and we will get our healthcare tab picked up by the UK once of state pension age. The chart "indicates convergence"

EU position: Persons whose competent state is the UK and are in the EU27 on exit day (and vice versa) – whether on a temporary stay or resident - continue to be eligible for healthcare reimbursement, including under the EHIC scheme, as long as that position continues.

UK position: Persons whose competent state is the UK and are in the EU27 on exit day (and vice versa) – whether on a temporary stay or resident - continue to be eligible for healthcare reimbursement, including under the EHIC scheme, as long as that position continues. This includes, for instance, EU27 citizens working in the UK on exit day (and vice versa for UK nationals in the EU27); EU27 pensioners living in the UK on exit day (and vice versa); and EU27 nationals studying in the UK on exit day (and vice versa).

....the UK won't want a load of old pensioners retuning to the UK and putting extra strain on the NHS.

Diddion

I have really worded things badly, here! It is of course the cut-off date that is relevant, with the question being whether or not it precedes the exit date.

AliceCaroline

I hate the uncertainty but I'm quietly confident that the UK won't get away with a cut off date before the exit date.

I think the UK goverment of just trying to stop a last minute rush of EU immigration so are going to keep us hanging for as long as they can get away with.

But the healthcare points in that chart do say "exit day" not "Specified date" - whether that is an error or they really mean to say exit day is another matter.