Buying holiday let in Portugal
Aug 6th 2015, 3:37 am
#1
Just Joined
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: UK
Posts: 13
Buying holiday let in Portugal
I am thinking about buying 3 properties in Portugal and living in one and using the other 2 as holiday lets. I am looking at properties on or near golf courses.
Is anyone doing anything similar and what advice do you have?
What is the average number of weeks you can rent out a property?
Is property investment in Portugal a good idea?
any advice welcomed
Thanks
Is anyone doing anything similar and what advice do you have?
What is the average number of weeks you can rent out a property?
Is property investment in Portugal a good idea?
any advice welcomed
Thanks
Aug 6th 2015, 8:17 am
#2
Banned
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 26,724
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
I am thinking about buying 3 properties in Portugal and living in one and using the other 2 as holiday lets. I am looking at properties on or near golf courses.
Is anyone doing anything similar and what advice do you have?
What is the average number of weeks you can rent out a property?
Is property investment in Portugal a good idea?
any advice welcomed
Thanks
Is anyone doing anything similar and what advice do you have?
What is the average number of weeks you can rent out a property?
Is property investment in Portugal a good idea?
any advice welcomed
Thanks
Villas in good locations with good marketing etc can produce a gross income of 6% +
On golf courses you will face very high management costs which would really eat into your margins.
Do not base you decision on achieving any significant increase in the property value .
Aug 6th 2015, 9:00 pm
#3
Smokn Joy
Joined: Jan 2015
Location: Wonderful Portugal
Posts: 774
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
We are doing very fine with our apartment only 2km from Benamor Golf Club and 3 minutes walk to the Cabanas promenade already bookings for next year and 10-weeks already booked this summer. Now the winter bookings are coming from golfers and Scandinavians. I think it's not too bad for our first season...solid income.
Some features made a difference for us, so said our guests
2bed-2bath
air con in each room
dishwasher (hot seller this feature)
comfy and attractive furnishings
personal meet and greet
broadband and cable
gift pack bespoke for age and amount of guests, (local wines, Tavia salt, olive oil, olive dish made here in Cabanas) basics like milk, coffee, tea, juice for kids bread and chorizo, bowl of whatever fruit is in season, folks arriving are tired from traveling
and a Welcome Book with a page or two customized for their specific interests in addition to golf ...why not?
Some features made a difference for us, so said our guests
2bed-2bath
air con in each room
dishwasher (hot seller this feature)
comfy and attractive furnishings
personal meet and greet
broadband and cable
gift pack bespoke for age and amount of guests, (local wines, Tavia salt, olive oil, olive dish made here in Cabanas) basics like milk, coffee, tea, juice for kids bread and chorizo, bowl of whatever fruit is in season, folks arriving are tired from traveling
and a Welcome Book with a page or two customized for their specific interests in addition to golf ...why not?
Aug 7th 2015, 9:38 am
#4
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 657
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
We are doing very fine with our apartment only 2km from Benamor Golf Club and 3 minutes walk to the Cabanas promenade already bookings for next year and 10-weeks already booked this summer. Now the winter bookings are coming from golfers and Scandinavians. I think it's not too bad for our first season...solid income.
Some features made a difference for us, so said our guests
2bed-2bath
air con in each room
dishwasher (hot seller this feature)
comfy and attractive furnishings
personal meet and greet
broadband and cable
gift pack bespoke for age and amount of guests, (local wines, Tavia salt, olive oil, olive dish made here in Cabanas) basics like milk, coffee, tea, juice for kids bread and chorizo, bowl of whatever fruit is in season, folks arriving are tired from traveling
and a Welcome Book with a page or two customized for their specific interests in addition to golf ...why not?
Some features made a difference for us, so said our guests
2bed-2bath
air con in each room
dishwasher (hot seller this feature)
comfy and attractive furnishings
personal meet and greet
broadband and cable
gift pack bespoke for age and amount of guests, (local wines, Tavia salt, olive oil, olive dish made here in Cabanas) basics like milk, coffee, tea, juice for kids bread and chorizo, bowl of whatever fruit is in season, folks arriving are tired from traveling
and a Welcome Book with a page or two customized for their specific interests in addition to golf ...why not?
How are the bookings/reservations looking from Mid September to Mid June 2016 ?
Aug 7th 2015, 10:03 am
#5
Smokn Joy
Joined: Jan 2015
Location: Wonderful Portugal
Posts: 774
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
very well...we are taking our time to select as the rent is reduced to only 30% of high season fee but they pay utilities and and cable many requests are for 2-3 months at at time
Aug 11th 2015, 6:39 pm
#6
Forum Regular
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 151
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
We are doing very fine with our apartment only 2km from Benamor Golf Club and 3 minutes walk to the Cabanas promenade already bookings for next year and 10-weeks already booked this summer. Now the winter bookings are coming from golfers and Scandinavians. I think it's not too bad for our first season...solid income.
Some features made a difference for us, so said our guests
2bed-2bath
air con in each room
dishwasher (hot seller this feature)
comfy and attractive furnishings
personal meet and greet
broadband and cable
gift pack bespoke for age and amount of guests, (local wines, Tavia salt, olive oil, olive dish made here in Cabanas) basics like milk, coffee, tea, juice for kids bread and chorizo, bowl of whatever fruit is in season, folks arriving are tired from traveling
and a Welcome Book with a page or two customized for their specific interests in addition to golf ...why not?
Some features made a difference for us, so said our guests
2bed-2bath
air con in each room
dishwasher (hot seller this feature)
comfy and attractive furnishings
personal meet and greet
broadband and cable
gift pack bespoke for age and amount of guests, (local wines, Tavia salt, olive oil, olive dish made here in Cabanas) basics like milk, coffee, tea, juice for kids bread and chorizo, bowl of whatever fruit is in season, folks arriving are tired from traveling
and a Welcome Book with a page or two customized for their specific interests in addition to golf ...why not?
Last edited by Dal Dy Dir; Aug 11th 2015 at 7:13 pm.
Aug 12th 2015, 9:26 am
#7
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,835
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
The (safety etc) requirements for AL registration are not an obstacle - as they are so minimal that any self-respecting owner will surpass those minimums by quite a margin.
Aug 12th 2015, 9:31 am
#8
Banned
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 26,724
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
Hazard notices around your pool if you have one.
In fact just that you would expect if you were staying in a hotel
Add Personal liability insurance.
Last edited by EMR; Aug 12th 2015 at 9:51 am.
Aug 12th 2015, 10:35 am
#9
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,835
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
This is what I meant, as it would apply to a typical owner offering their own house for AL, as detailed by CM Lisboa:
as badly translated by Google:
Requisitos dos estabelecimentos de alojamento local
Requisitos gerais
Os estabelecimentos de alojamento local devem:
• Apresentar adequadas condições de conservação e funcionamento das instalações e equipamentos;
• Estar ligados à rede pública de abastecimento de água ou dotados de um sistema privativo de abastecimento de água, com origem devidamente controlada;
• Estar ligados à rede pública de esgotos ou dotados de fossas sépticas dimensionadas para a capacidade máxima do estabelecimento;
• Estar dotados de água corrente quente e fria;
• Reunir sempre condições de higiene e limpeza.
As unidades de alojamento dos estabelecimentos de alojamento local devem:
• Ter uma janela ou sacada com comunicação direta para o exterior, que assegure as adequadas condições de ventilação e arejamento;
• Estar dotadas de mobiliário, equipamento e utensílios adequados;
• Dispor de um sistema que permita vedar a entrada de luz exterior;
• Dispor de portas equipadas com um sistema de segurança que assegure a privacidade dos utentes.
As instalações sanitárias dos estabelecimentos de alojamento local devem dispor de um sistema de segurança que garanta privacidade.
[...]
Requisitos de segurança
[...]
Os estabelecimentos de alojamento local, com capacidade igual ou inferior a dez utentes, devem cumprir os seguintes requisitos de segurança:
• Possuir extintor e manta de incêndio acessíveis aos utentes;
• Possuir equipamento de primeiros socorros acessível aos utentes;
• Afixar, em local visível aos utentes, o número nacional de emergência (112).
Requisitos gerais
Os estabelecimentos de alojamento local devem:
• Apresentar adequadas condições de conservação e funcionamento das instalações e equipamentos;
• Estar ligados à rede pública de abastecimento de água ou dotados de um sistema privativo de abastecimento de água, com origem devidamente controlada;
• Estar ligados à rede pública de esgotos ou dotados de fossas sépticas dimensionadas para a capacidade máxima do estabelecimento;
• Estar dotados de água corrente quente e fria;
• Reunir sempre condições de higiene e limpeza.
As unidades de alojamento dos estabelecimentos de alojamento local devem:
• Ter uma janela ou sacada com comunicação direta para o exterior, que assegure as adequadas condições de ventilação e arejamento;
• Estar dotadas de mobiliário, equipamento e utensílios adequados;
• Dispor de um sistema que permita vedar a entrada de luz exterior;
• Dispor de portas equipadas com um sistema de segurança que assegure a privacidade dos utentes.
As instalações sanitárias dos estabelecimentos de alojamento local devem dispor de um sistema de segurança que garanta privacidade.
[...]
Requisitos de segurança
[...]
Os estabelecimentos de alojamento local, com capacidade igual ou inferior a dez utentes, devem cumprir os seguintes requisitos de segurança:
• Possuir extintor e manta de incêndio acessíveis aos utentes;
• Possuir equipamento de primeiros socorros acessível aos utentes;
• Afixar, em local visível aos utentes, o número nacional de emergência (112).
The local accommodation establishments requirements
General Requirements
Local accommodation establishments must:
• Present properly stored and operating conditions of facilities and equipment;
• Be connected to the public water supply or having a private system of water supply, with properly controlled origin;
• Be connected to the public sewerage system or having septic tanks sized for the maximum capacity of the establishment;
• Be equipped with hot and cold running water;
• Always Gather cleaning and hygiene conditions.
Housing units of local accommodation establishments are:
• Have a window or balcony with direct communication to the outside, to ensure the right conditions for ventilation and aeration;
• Be equipped with furniture, equipment and appropriate utensils;
• Have a system to seal the entry of outside light;
• Arrange doors equipped with a security system to ensure the privacy of users.
Sanitary facilities of the local accommodation establishments shall have a security system that ensures privacy.
[...]
Safety requirements
[...]
The local accommodation establishments with a capacity less than or equal to ten users, must meet the following safety requirements:
• Have fire extinguisher and fire blanket accessible to users;
• Have first aid equipment accessible to users;
• Post, visible to users in local, national emergency number (112).
General Requirements
Local accommodation establishments must:
• Present properly stored and operating conditions of facilities and equipment;
• Be connected to the public water supply or having a private system of water supply, with properly controlled origin;
• Be connected to the public sewerage system or having septic tanks sized for the maximum capacity of the establishment;
• Be equipped with hot and cold running water;
• Always Gather cleaning and hygiene conditions.
Housing units of local accommodation establishments are:
• Have a window or balcony with direct communication to the outside, to ensure the right conditions for ventilation and aeration;
• Be equipped with furniture, equipment and appropriate utensils;
• Have a system to seal the entry of outside light;
• Arrange doors equipped with a security system to ensure the privacy of users.
Sanitary facilities of the local accommodation establishments shall have a security system that ensures privacy.
[...]
Safety requirements
[...]
The local accommodation establishments with a capacity less than or equal to ten users, must meet the following safety requirements:
• Have fire extinguisher and fire blanket accessible to users;
• Have first aid equipment accessible to users;
• Post, visible to users in local, national emergency number (112).
Aug 12th 2015, 3:44 pm
#10
Smokn Joy
Joined: Jan 2015
Location: Wonderful Portugal
Posts: 774
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
This is all pretty bog-standard stuff, you wouldn't rent a property without these things.
We also run through what to do in emergencies IE fire, robbery etc.,. How to exit the property, how get the children if in another bedroom. Designate who gets the children and who calls for help and how to call for help. But that's just us...
We also run through what to do in emergencies IE fire, robbery etc.,. How to exit the property, how get the children if in another bedroom. Designate who gets the children and who calls for help and how to call for help. But that's just us...
Aug 14th 2015, 9:53 am
#11
Forum Regular
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 151
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
This is all pretty bog-standard stuff, you wouldn't rent a property without these things.
We also run through what to do in emergencies IE fire, robbery etc.,. How to exit the property, how get the children if in another bedroom. Designate who gets the children and who calls for help and how to call for help. But that's just us...
We also run through what to do in emergencies IE fire, robbery etc.,. How to exit the property, how get the children if in another bedroom. Designate who gets the children and who calls for help and how to call for help. But that's just us...
Aug 14th 2015, 10:40 am
#12
Banned
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 26,724
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
Just looking at the feasibility of letting, what is the cost of the license, the cost of annual equipment checks (I presume you need them on gas / electrical appliances as per UK letting rules and what is the rate of Income tax to pay (I presume as the income is generated in Portugal it is paid in same country)
There are very few allowable deductions
With Iva if etc etc, you need to find a good accountant.
Aug 14th 2015, 11:09 am
#13
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,835
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
Typically tax is also due in your country of residence, though you will usually get an allowance for the Portuguese tax already paid, so your effective tax rate will be approximately your marginal tax rate wherever you live.
Aug 14th 2015, 12:09 pm
#14
Forum Regular
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 151
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
EMR, Richard,
As always good factual answers, thank you for that.
I suppose I am being naive in assuming everybody has all the checks and balances in place, I feel sure there will be many who adopt the "It won't happen to me / I won't get caught policy"
However it only takes one incident like the children on holiday in Corfu with the faulty boiler and there would be no way back both emotionally and financially from that.
Also here in the UK there are reports that the Inland Revenue are now actively targeting small ads, plumbers, man with a van, lettings etc to chase unpaid tax, I feel sure with the Portuguese governments desire for tax raising they wouldn't be behind the door at adopting the same practices.
As always good factual answers, thank you for that.
I suppose I am being naive in assuming everybody has all the checks and balances in place, I feel sure there will be many who adopt the "It won't happen to me / I won't get caught policy"
However it only takes one incident like the children on holiday in Corfu with the faulty boiler and there would be no way back both emotionally and financially from that.
Also here in the UK there are reports that the Inland Revenue are now actively targeting small ads, plumbers, man with a van, lettings etc to chase unpaid tax, I feel sure with the Portuguese governments desire for tax raising they wouldn't be behind the door at adopting the same practices.
Aug 19th 2015, 12:06 pm
#15
Just Joined
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 3
Re: Buying holiday let in Portugal
EMR, Richard,
As always good factual answers, thank you for that.
I suppose I am being naive in assuming everybody has all the checks and balances in place, I feel sure there will be many who adopt the "It won't happen to me / I won't get caught policy"
However it only takes one incident like the children on holiday in Corfu with the faulty boiler and there would be no way back both emotionally and financially from that.
Also here in the UK there are reports that the Inland Revenue are now actively targeting small ads, plumbers, man with a van, lettings etc to chase unpaid tax, I feel sure with the Portuguese governments desire for tax raising they wouldn't be behind the door at adopting the same practices.
As always good factual answers, thank you for that.
I suppose I am being naive in assuming everybody has all the checks and balances in place, I feel sure there will be many who adopt the "It won't happen to me / I won't get caught policy"
However it only takes one incident like the children on holiday in Corfu with the faulty boiler and there would be no way back both emotionally and financially from that.
Also here in the UK there are reports that the Inland Revenue are now actively targeting small ads, plumbers, man with a van, lettings etc to chase unpaid tax, I feel sure with the Portuguese governments desire for tax raising they wouldn't be behind the door at adopting the same practices.
Him and his team would go to a small town. Sit in a cafe all morning and make a list of local tradesmen and services from shop windows and the inky papers. Call them that afternoon to come and give a quote then prosecute those that they could. The rest got a thorough tax overhaul.