Go Back  British Expats > Living & Moving Abroad > Europe > Portugal
Reload this Page >

Another curious "Citizenship" case

Another curious "Citizenship" case

Thread Tools
 
Old Jan 6th 2017, 8:55 am
  #1  
Forum Regular
Thread Starter
 
ah207's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Location: Costa de Caparica: 2007-2010. Then Olivais, Lisboa: 2010-2017. Currently back in Cambridge, UK.
Posts: 291
ah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Another curious "Citizenship" case

Has this always been happening, but simply never reported in national newspapers - or have laws tightened up significantly in the past 6 months ?

In a nutshell: Man born in UK in 1974 (to German parents), with birth certificate, lived all his life (42 years) in the UK, asked by Home Office to apply for residency (and prove he can speak English etc). I'd like to think that this another one of those beauracratic type cases - an oversight on the part of the applicant, rather than outright xenophobia.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ire-life-in-uk
ah207 is offline  
Old Jan 6th 2017, 9:54 am
  #2  
Resident Cynic
 
macliam's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: Suffolk,UK; Alentejo, Portugal
Posts: 14,960
macliam has a reputation beyond reputemacliam has a reputation beyond reputemacliam has a reputation beyond reputemacliam has a reputation beyond reputemacliam has a reputation beyond reputemacliam has a reputation beyond reputemacliam has a reputation beyond reputemacliam has a reputation beyond reputemacliam has a reputation beyond reputemacliam has a reputation beyond reputemacliam has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Another curious "Citizenship" case

Originally Posted by ah207
Has this always been happening, but simply never reported in national newspapers - or have laws tightened up significantly in the past 6 months ?

In a nutshell: Man born in UK in 1974 (to German parents), with birth certificate, lived all his life (42 years) in the UK, asked by Home Office to apply for residency (and prove he can speak English etc). I'd like to think that this another one of those beauracratic type cases - an oversight on the part of the applicant, rather than outright xenophobia.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ire-life-in-uk
No doubt there are those here who will say it's his fault for his parents being johnny foreigners!

I'm sure these cases have occurred before, but impending Brexit has drawn focus on them. However, as I've said before, the problem now is that it's almost impossible to get through the bureaucratic smokescreen to actually talk to someone and resolve it. Pressure of demand, allied to cutbacks, have resulted in a system that has no tolerance for anything but straightforward cases.
macliam is online now  
Old Jan 6th 2017, 11:36 am
  #3  
BE Forum Addict
 
Joined: Aug 2012
Location: Viana do Castelo
Posts: 1,385
Ukkram is a name known to allUkkram is a name known to allUkkram is a name known to allUkkram is a name known to allUkkram is a name known to allUkkram is a name known to allUkkram is a name known to allUkkram is a name known to allUkkram is a name known to allUkkram is a name known to allUkkram is a name known to all
Default Re: Another curious "Citizenship" case

Seems to me that Home Office is targeting some Europeans first to avoid the Muslims shouting "racism".
Ukkram is offline  
Old Jan 7th 2017, 11:49 am
  #4  
 
BritInParis's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Not in Paris
Posts: 18,193
BritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Another curious "Citizenship" case

Originally Posted by ah207
Has this always been happening, but simply never reported in national newspapers - or have laws tightened up significantly in the past 6 months ?

In a nutshell: Man born in UK in 1974 (to German parents), with birth certificate, lived all his life (42 years) in the UK, asked by Home Office to apply for residency (and prove he can speak English etc). I'd like to think that this another one of those beauracratic type cases - an oversight on the part of the applicant, rather than outright xenophobia.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ire-life-in-uk
If Mr Wolf was born in 1974 then he'll be a British citizen by birth automatically unless his parents were foreign diplomats. Since he's 32 he would have been born after 1 January 1983 when absolute jus soli citizenship was ended in the UK by the British Nationality Act 1981. After this date in order to be a British citizen by birth your mother (or father if born in wedlock) would need to be a British citizen or 'settled' in the UK, that is be considered a permanent resident under specified criteria.

Under the rules in force at the time means he would need to demonstrate that his mother, as a citizen of an EEC country, was exercising her Treaty rights in the UK at the time of his birth. If so then he would be a British citizen by birth under Section 1(1)(b) BNA 1981. Not a problem if his parents had bothered to apply for his British passport thirty years ago, more of a problem now.

The Home Office has made it clear it did not ask him to sit a Life in the UK Test exam or apply for residency so The Grauniad's headline is just more of the clickbait 'fake news' they supposedly rail against.

Originally Posted by macliam
No doubt there are those here who will say it's his fault for his parents being johnny foreigners!

I'm sure these cases have occurred before, but impending Brexit has drawn focus on them. However, as I've said before, the problem now is that it's almost impossible to get through the bureaucratic smokescreen to actually talk to someone and resolve it. Pressure of demand, allied to cutbacks, have resulted in a system that has no tolerance for anything but straightforward cases.
Hardly. Mr Wolf has been told exactly what he needs to provide. It's not HMPO's fault that he's taken 32 years to apply for his first British passport and no longer can obtain the correct paperwork. Shouting betrayal doesn't really wash when he's been quite happy to operate on his German passport until this point. He should be grateful that he has access to any passport - see this thread for someone who was born in the UK to British parents and is having the same problem.

Originally Posted by Ukkram
Seems to me that Home Office is targeting some Europeans first to avoid the Muslims shouting "racism".
BritInParis is offline  
Old Jan 7th 2017, 3:30 pm
  #5  
Forum Regular
Thread Starter
 
ah207's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Location: Costa de Caparica: 2007-2010. Then Olivais, Lisboa: 2010-2017. Currently back in Cambridge, UK.
Posts: 291
ah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond reputeah207 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Another curious "Citizenship" case

Understood. Seems even the broadsheets (or "quality" papers as they used to be called in my time) are not immune to sensationalising stories.
ah207 is offline  
Old Jan 7th 2017, 3:37 pm
  #6  
 
BritInParis's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2012
Location: Not in Paris
Posts: 18,193
BritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond reputeBritInParis has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Another curious "Citizenship" case

Originally Posted by ah207
Understood. Seems even the broadsheets (or "quality" papers as they used to be called in my time) are not immune to sensationalising stories.
The Times is probably the only UK broadsheet left that can be reasonably relied upon.
BritInParis is offline  
Old Jan 9th 2017, 10:48 am
  #7  
Gold-Helmeted Member
 
captainflack's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2004
Location: Setubal-ish
Posts: 688
captainflack has a reputation beyond reputecaptainflack has a reputation beyond reputecaptainflack has a reputation beyond reputecaptainflack has a reputation beyond reputecaptainflack has a reputation beyond reputecaptainflack has a reputation beyond reputecaptainflack has a reputation beyond reputecaptainflack has a reputation beyond reputecaptainflack has a reputation beyond reputecaptainflack has a reputation beyond reputecaptainflack has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Another curious "Citizenship" case

Originally Posted by ah207
Has this always been happening, but simply never reported in national newspapers - or have laws tightened up significantly in the past 6 months ?
The laws haven't changed, the issue is that hardly any EU citizens bothered to get UK citizenship, and many others never bothered to apply for permanent residency, because they simply didn't need to. An EU passport was pretty much the same in terms of being able to live, work, etc. - voting was probably the only thing most could not do, maybe apply for some defence related jobs too.

It's an issue now because of brexit; even those who've lived in the UK all their lives on EU passports now need UK citizenship to be sure they're not going to be kicked out or discriminated against regarding employment and so on, because it is unclear what if any rights they'll retain.
captainflack is offline  
Old Jan 10th 2017, 10:17 am
  #8  
EMR
Banned
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 26,724
EMR has a reputation beyond reputeEMR has a reputation beyond reputeEMR has a reputation beyond reputeEMR has a reputation beyond reputeEMR has a reputation beyond reputeEMR has a reputation beyond reputeEMR has a reputation beyond reputeEMR has a reputation beyond reputeEMR has a reputation beyond reputeEMR has a reputation beyond reputeEMR has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Another curious "Citizenship" case

Originally Posted by Ukkram
Seems to me that Home Office is targeting some Europeans first to avoid the Muslims shouting "racism".
Immigrants from the commonwealth and non EU enter the UK under entirely different regulations.
They are either legal or not, ifillegal then they risk deportation..


Nothiig to do with your peculiar viewpoint.
EMR is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.