lardyl

Frankly, I'm a rather left leaning, but I've learned that poverty in the OECD is essentially a relative measure and nothing to do with having enough to eat/wear as an absolute. So as the UK incomes have historically been higher than in NZ of course if you have kids in a household with the same absolute income then more will be "in poverty" in the UK. It's all about income distribution.
I'd be surprised if the lowest earning families in NZ were better off financially than those in the UK, and the state of how people live in the areas I've worked in here is more hand to mouth than it ever was in the comparable areas I worked in over in the UK. That's based on a small sample though, about 20 or 30 homes a year. But I'd be very surprised that the rose tinted views of life in NZ being banded about by ex-pat Kiwis and those who need to make sure their decisions to move here or pong and ping about are/were/will be the right ones are going to shake many of us out of they views we have come to after living here for a while.
But we could be wrong.

ExKiwilass

I agree things have gone downhill in NZ as far as rich/poor gap goes, but I also see that here. I blame the economic policies of the past 20 years. The NZ I remember as a child had more income redistribution and was, imo, a better place.

Genesis

So it appears. I was so taken aback by the Labour advert last night that I have decided I am going to vote for the left if only for the poverty issue and as an aside the stance Labour is taking with NZ's economy long term. A brave (some might say stupid) move. My mate said "you can't vote for him, dull as", I replied "its about policy not personality".

whitesand

Not all folks who live in council houses are on the dole. In fact, at one time. the newl-built council houses were preferable to the older building stock. What was different then is that the poeple in them had jobs, there was little dole and no drugs. As society has changed so too has the standard in those council houses. Man;y folks paid little rent and had more income to spend. Therefore, they were much more cash rich than many who struggled with mortages.

They also had access to much better shops and choice of goods than you would get say, here in NZ. As the standard of those council houses has decreased and the price of houses increased much faster than the average wage in the UK then you now get more poverty. It's the house prices that are making paupers of most folks. And, to add to that the food prices are also rising faster than ever now. But, you still have more choice in the UK than here.

DC10

it's called SCHOOL DINNERS, and half the country is on them!

i don't know enough about the specific shoes point to comment

but i did know plenty of kiwi social workers, teachers and psych nurses when in london, and working there was a huge eye-opener for them.

Bo-Jangles

For the poorer and poorer and poorest people here it is not so obvious as the in your face multi-storey blocks of council flats, eh?

I know plenty of people that live in council and housing association property, people who have bought their ex-council flats and houses also and surprise surprise they're certainly not in poverty, not on benefits and in work; having quite a nice life thank you.

Here there is not any kind of poverty line or 'standard' living conditions. In the UK, welfare would certainly step in if three generations of the same family, ten adults and god knows how many kids were all living in the one three bedroom house, or if kids were housed in the garage or separate 'sleep-outs' consisting of a homemade shed, an old bus or caravan at the bottom of the garden.

There's more people living here in appalling conditions than meets the eye at those cute picket fenced old villas: with rain water collected off of manky old roofs, being stored in minging old water tanks and with no proper sewerage systems in place. Whilst undoubtedly some expats might consider this 'living the dream' and find this quaint to be all self-sufficient and green, no doubt you'll have the latest and greatest environmentally wonderful system, serviced and checked on a regular basis - most real Kiwis wouldn't dream of it and there's certainly no generally accepted levels of basic sanitation or heath and safety in that respect.

whitesand

That's true, only the non-kiwis like those dainty white wooden houses with picket fences that Devonport has so many of. They know from experience to keep well away from them as they are ice boxes in the winter.

Made that mistake once myself and rented one and managed to leave before we had permanent frostbite on the limbs. What an experience, I've never been so cold in my life.

Addictedtosushi

I bet all the people who lived there wore the latest designer gear had flat screen tvs and blackberry phones though!!

sheene

I was born in Liverpool and raised / lived in the Manchester area - you are right that there are some very 'bad' areas. But you know what - I would happily trade 10 people from the north of England for the whole of the NZ population. Fantastic characters, friendly, funny, talented, generous and honorable. We have a very rich heritage of producing the best musicians, the best actors, the best artists - in the world - from a population not much bigger than NZ.

lardyl

half the country? school dinners?
you mean the things that you can't get in NZ? unless you order out.

you can also pay for those school dinners you know......of course you do.......

DC10

Yep - I worked in a school in Deptford for a few weeks. I think there were 5 kids who paid for their meals and the other 200 were provided free (because their parents could not afford to feed them, which was where this tangent of argument began)

Stormer999

Reported on TV the schools are now doing the same with breakfasts for the under privileged as well as dinners..

sheene

Exactly, definitely something to be proud of. There will always be the poor and unfortunates of this world - the defining key is how they are looked after. Well done the UK.

Bo-Jangles

I actually don't believe you!!

Not one of them went home, or had a packed lunch or were given money to go to the shop for Coke and crisps, the cafe, pie and mash shop or McDonalds?

DC10

There were about 500 kids, and around 200 were entitled to free school dinners. A handful elected to pay for school dinners and the rest, presumably, did as you suggest.

Not saying school dinners are a bad thing. But the fact that they are pretty widespread suggests that there are indeed plenty of parents in the UK who cannot (be trusted to?) feed their kids