Moses2013

Sure but what about the boyfriend? I don't know about the job but is it really worth it and it's not as if you're "overpaid" for that location. Again it comes down to work to live or live to work and your priorities but sometimes careers can be overrated too. Just because you're driven doesn't mean it has to be a career. You could start your own small side business or grow your own veg etc. Wasting time can often be a good thing too. If you think about it most people work hard all their life to eventually have time to waste. Our generation has just forgotten that looking out to sea or sitting under a tree with a cup of tea can be a good thing.

neurotic

I know what you mean and I do appreciate the sea and I certainly do not take my quiet life for granted, that's why I want to take it with me (and even the boyfriend too if it becomes a longer journey).

The thing is with having too much time is that you spend it worrying about useless things and it can lead you to being neurotic like me When I was busy studying and working at the same time, I just loved being so busy that I didn't have the time to think or worry about anything but the moment, it felt so stimulating. Besides, a lot of people in my field are either self-employed or freelancers, struggling to make ends meet, or just work elsewhere to earn more money so when a full-time job comes up, you have to grab it with both hands, so yeah it is definitely, 100% worth it.

Just not yet wiling to pay the price of shared living

Red_Wine_Fairy

I would not like to be in your shoes. That is a low salary for Amsterdam because the Netherlands, particularly the Randstad area, is very expensive to live in. It is not minimum wage however. The problem immigrants experience here is that they cannot access the social housing stock: the waiting list for Amsterdam is just too long - upto 10 years for the best areas: 50000 people move to this area each year and there is no space to build new housing stock (even if the will was there). Private rentals are almost unaffordable for singles. Amsterdam is for those who got their names on the housing waiting list very young, young people who flat-share, couples who share, and millionaires. Sharing isn't easy either - my colleague and her housemates recently advertised and had 200 applicants for their empty room.

Housing scams are rife, and even your landlord will be plotting to keep hold of your deposit (fraud is a bit of a game here which is why all Dutch landlords adore expat tenants). You won't be taken seriously either until you're here on the ground - the Dutch are ... unique.. and the estate agents even if you use them are likely to put the phone down on you as a timewaster if you tell them you aren't in the country yet.

Housing associations do offer unfurnished free-sector housing with no waiting list, but you do need to be earning 4 times the monthly rent to qualify, and usually you have to earn more than the upper limit for social housing qualification (Quoted from WoningNet: ''As of January 1, 2017, the maximum annual income (collective income of your household, children not included) that you can respond to in a social housing house is set at € 36,165.'')
Here's an example (you won't need to translate):
Verzamelinkomen Inkomen is minimaal € 33.600,00
Huurprijs Netto huurprijs € 700,

There is always the opportunity to play the lottery Register on the social housing website (woningnet.nl) which costs 50 euros if I remember correctly. You can then apply for two 'normal' social housing units per week (no chance of these because you won't have enough years on the list) but you can also put your name down for two 'lottery' units if there are any suitable ones available (usually in a town, not a city). My son got his studio this way after almost a year on the list.


Your expectations seem low, which is good

As Amsterdam isn't the be-all-and-end-all like all those millennials happy to share for years and years after leaving Uni believe, then there are cheaper commuter towns around. Almere, Hoofddorp, Diemen and if you like living dangerously, Zuid-Oost/Bijlmer. Forget mini-Amsterdam (Haarlem) or expatville (Amstelveen) because they have even less housing stock than Amsterdam.

Your first question needs to be to your future HR department: what are the rules about Travel to work expenses in the company? Most decent companies will pay for your travel pass so you can buy a monthly travel abonnement (is it a 1 year contract? perhaps they will pay up-front for a 1 year ticket) and because it cuts their tax bill, they don't care if you live several cities away. If they are generous, then you can look even further afield like Hilversum or Alkmaar (nice restaurant there with a Scottish owner). All have great rail links to Amsterdam Centraal. But if nightlife is important, then check the routes of the nightbuses to find towns which have a 24 hour bus route from Amsterdam.

Facebook is your friend - there are lots of groups and some aren't actually scams! Other sites include kamernet.nl and even Marktplaats.nl (huizen-en-kamers). Same rules apply: No cash sent to anyone (including to the UK!), only in person to the landlord with a contract that says you can legally register at the property. No signing anything until you've actually viewed inside the property (ideally with a Dutch colleague) and they've proved they're the owner and not just a renter trying to sublet.


This is an excellent site for you to get up to speed; it's like citizens advice dealing only with housing issues. (in English) https://www.wswonen.nl/english/

Good Luck and remember that you'll always have a roof over your head while a Dutchman thinks you have deep pockets

neurotic

Thanks for your reply, it was very comprehensive list of information. I didn't know such a thing existed as the "housing lottery". To be fair, I didn't even consider the social housing as my contract is not even a year long for now (but they might offer renewal).

I'm not sure if my company offers any travel expenses to be honest, but it's worth asking I guess.

Is Haarlem really not a viable option? From what I found on websites, it seems more affordable than Amsterdam and public transport wouldn't need to break the bank either. I got in touch with a relocation agency based there, do you think it's going to be problematic for them to find a tiny studio for me there? It doesn't even need to be fully furnished as long as there's a washing machine, a microwave and a bed lol.

I thought I was savvy that I deliberately try and avoid Amsterdam altogether as a residence option and not even use makelaars from there to maybe get ahead of my competition but I don't know how savvy one can be really without speaking Dutch and still in the UK lol. Argh I'm so anxious!

I've also been looking at Almere and Hoofddorp and Diemen too, I just thought Haarlem had the biggest pool of housing options (largest town of these?) and also one of the cheapest to commute to and from.

I didn't know about the wswonen website either, so yeah, many thanks for all the useful info!

PS: "remember that you'll always have a roof over your head while a Dutchman thinks you have deep pockets" >> This is good advice too, do you think if I can get my partner to write a letter as guarantor, I can negotiate their minimum income requirements?

Red_Wine_Fairy

No. If he's not in the country and the Dutch tax man can't trace him, his word won't mean much.

neurotic

Another comprehensive list of answers, thanks again!

I will ask about the travel costs then, it would mean some help definitely. I only know about the holiday allowance, no 13th month mentioned in the contract, but I guess that's because it's for less than a year?

From the adverts I have seen, Haarlem wasn't that cheap but it didn't seem to be too expensive either (8-900/month) for furnished? Is that likely to be a scam? They were advertised by seemingly legit agencies, with possible registration?

I imagine Almere is like Livingston or Cumbernauld so I'm totally fine with that lol, but where do they advertise? I saw less adverts from these town than from Haarlem. Is it worth signing up with another makelaar agency based in Almere or that? The advice I see a lot is that you only do it with one because they talk to each other, but if one is based in Haarlem and the other in Almere, will I be better off?

Sorry to ask so many questions, you seem to be very clued up!

(Shame about the guarantor thing, I wish I could make them believe somehow that I'd pay the rent even if I don't earn 3 times as much... I really don't want to resort to sharing.)

I'm scared of this whole adventure and I don't know if it's worth wasting all my savings for maybe only 7 months experience at this company to put on the CV but I'm thinking that if I survive, I'll be stronger with all this and more confident with more international contacts in the industry in general. It'll be worth it, it'll be worth it..... aaargh...

dmu

Hi, I missed this post. I think you'll find that all rooms in an appartment are used as bed-sits for each tenant and you would only have "other people around" in the kitchen and bathroom. This is a good way of learning organisation and tolerance of others' shortcomings (and it works all ways!). You draw up charts and time-tables for domestic activities and chores, and if you're easy-going with the others, they'll overlook any possible excessive occupation of the loo! From my daughters' experiences, you can judge more or less how you're going to get on, at the "interview".
One negative thought - we were Guarantors for our student/low-income daughters in all their flat-shares (in France and Berlin), since all tenants were committed to paying the full rent if any one failed to pay their share. This commitment is not for the faint-hearted and your bf would have to provide payslips, etc... to justify his regular income if the minimum income requirement also applies to flatshares in the Netherlands.....
What does your boyfriend think of all this?

neurotic

Learning organisation and tolerance of others' shortcomings, charts and timetables of tasks, is it not for the workplace though, isn't your home meant to be a sacred place of relaxation? I know, I need to cut this attitude down if I want to find my feet alone in a new country but I'm finding it hard to let it go, please don't judge me.

So for now I'm really going to try and dodge having to share, I was thinking to ask this agency if they don't find me anything that I'll take on an unfurnished one if they help me negotiate to keep at least some things from previous tenants etc. The shorter-than-a-year contract is another problem though as I'm looking for longer than a 6 months rental but less than a year. But maybe this agency can help negotiate that too. I don't know if it's wise to trust them this much but I really don't know who else to turn to, I don't want to go to interviews for rooms and all that, I'm honestly petrified.

As for my boyfriend being a guarantor, other people have mentioned already that it's not going to work if the Dutch taxman can't trace him so I don't know what to do. He's a bit apprehensive obviously but he has been the witness of how hard I worked for this career so he's also happy for me, and worried and sad at the same time, just like I am. It's hard!

dmu

I'm not judging you!!
The thought occurred to me that, in France, people wanting a short-term let often go for a furnished gîte and pay in advance, but maybe this concept doesn't exist in the Netherlands? RWF will know!

neurotic

I wouldn't be able to pay for all the 6-7 months in advance though, and I still have to be able to register at an address so I don't know if this is a viable option but thanks for the suggestion though

It seems such a maze from here right now, and there are so many times when I just feel like bursting out sobbing and screaming "what the hell am I doing with my life"

Sorry to be so dramatic haha. I also have another question to @Red Wine Fairy, what did she mean by "living dangerously" in certain areas (e.g. Bijlmer?). Say, if I found something there that was affordable and I wouldn't have to share, would I be safe to take it? I'm a girl on my own, totally panicky and nervous and not trained at martial arts at all, so from that point of view, would it be a risky choice?

Red_Wine_Fairy

Most people refer to the holiday money when they talk about 13th month (it's paid out in May or June rather than at the end of the year) - good that you're getting that.

I don't want to make you think that it's impossible to find somewhere just for you, it's just really difficult in this middle price bracket to find something that meets all (legal) requirements. You could drop lucky, but be prepared for a housing market that sees the best properties change hands within hours, because everyone knows someone who knows someone searching for a place.

I advise joining facebook groups (search on Amsterdam and housing or accommodation and you'll find lists of them) such as https://www.facebook.com/groups/amsterdam.apartments/ - perhaps Almere and Hoofddorp have similar. But your best bet is kamernet.nl. I saw some apartments on there for the 700-800 range too - and some are probably genuine! - so please, download the free guide on the wswonen site. Another site is Jaap. If you follow this link, it shows what 500-700 can get you - click on Zoek op Kaart (look on map) to scroll around the areas. There's not a lot of living accommodation (I spotted a nice but miniscule apartment in Halfweg, in between AMS and Haarlem, but via an agency) but there are some gems out there if you spot them quickly.

Edit: the 3x or 4x salary requirement is usually just a housing association requirement -- private landlords don't really care, and will usually take a job contract as proof of income. This brings me to probably the most important thing: ask for a DIPLOMATIC CLAUSE in your rental agreement - this means that if for whatever reason your employer terminates your employment or moves you to a location further than xx kilometres away, you will not be bound to pay the remainder of the contract!!!

I have met people who've skulked off home without a penny to their name, but they didn't really come here for work, but for what they found (to their cost) wasn't a lifestyle that accommodated being broke and stoned 90% of the time, and that *shock* British people aren't that attractive a proposition to employers unless they have a great skill or experience (Dutch students are fluent in English and take up most of the hospitality roles). But - seriously - I have never yet met someone who did come here for work and experience real life here who hated it. It is an amazing city to work in, and travel around in, day and night. You won't regret it, so don't talk yourself out of it

neurotic

Thank you! There's no way I'm talking myself out of it, it is pretty much a dream job (and I really want to prove myself so the aim is absolutely not getting drunk or stoned), it's just obviously a big move and I get panicky. But this is a helpful forum for this type of counselling, so thank you all!

I'm also excited though, I've never even been as a tourist, for some reason flat countries with no hills to climb have just not enjoyed priorities for our Scottish tastes haha. But to think of all the culture and art, I'm really looking forward to it.

I did look on Kamernet but I am aware that if I see it, then I'm probably late lol. I also signed up for RentSlam but it's Amsterdam only unfortunately. I'll speed up the flat search for the week before I'm there because I can arrange viewings for the week after at least, and so far the agency has also been helpful. I told them that I wouldn't like to share and that I'd rather cut out the furniture than the private space so maybe they'll help too... I know I'm not a big fish for them as my monthly rent can't be a huge amount to charge me for but I hope they still want good business.

Red_Wine_Fairy

It's big city lifestyle on a small scale (a little bigger than Edinburgh population-wise). There is something to do every single weekend. I'd recommend following some things like IamExpat.nl and you'll get a good idea what's going on around town. You just missed museum night when the musea open 24 hours for free but the Amsterdam Light Festival will be on until the new year. I'm not sure when the annual ice rink goes up in Leidesplein.


Today is Sint Maarten so tonight we'll have the neighbourhood kids at our door singing nonsense songs for a chocolate or treat (much nicer than trick or treat). Then we're into the Sinterklass, which lasts about 3 weeks until there's a quick change to Christmas decorations. So if you haven't been here even for a visit, it's a great time to come with 2 months of festivities, gluwein, oliebollen, and skating to keep your mind off the cold and damp weather

neurotic

Brilliant, thanks! I imagine it's very beautiful around this time... the plan is to get my boyfriend over for at least a few days for Christmas (provided I've got somewhere to stay myself ), so the happiness will be shared.

I already have a few plans to visit some galleries and museums and maybe travel around a bit later on. I'm not sure how much money I'll be left with but I'd like to shop around too and send some gifts for the family. So yeah, I'll definitely not get bored!

spouse of scouse

You've probably seen this, but it's a great resource https://www.pararius.com/english