lipstickladybirds

Hi,

My name is Nicole, and both myself and my husband are looking to move to Europe, most likely the Netherlands, with our young son.

We have family and friends who themselves have emigrated in the past, and have some understanding of what legal requirements we would need to move over, but I'm looking for more advice, and hopefully to make some new friends, as we start to prepare for our new adventure.

We have visited some countries in Europe, and have really fallen in love with the way of life, however, we have still yet to visit the Netherlands, where we want to call home. We are hoping to scout places very soon, once we have fulfilled some work and personal commitments back home, but if there is anything anyone would like us to be aware of, or would like to share their own stories of moving to the Netherlands and the rest of Europe, please get in touch.

Also, if there are any mums who have moved, especially to places where English isn't a first language, please let me know how you got on, and if you have any tips for helping young children learn new languages.

Looking forward to hearing from you all soon.

Nicole

scot47

"Europe" is a big place and very diverse. You need to narrow down. Where you are going and then do intensive research. What are your reasons for moving ? Will your or your partner work ?

lipstickladybirds

Hi Scot,

Thanks for replying.

Sorry, I should have put that my husband has been to the Netherlands before, but I haven't as of yet. Out of all the places we have travelled in Europe, he happens to love the place that I haven't been yet

We run our own company, developing ecommerce websites, but most of our clients are based in the UK, Netherlands, Germany and Switzerland. We have had several clients suggest we give moving to Europe a go, and we are quite interested in the culture and the way of life there. We also really like the commutability into Brussels etc, so it means we can see more of our clients face to face.

I think, as we all do when wanting to live abroad, it starts with an idea, and we have the means to go over comfortably, so why not?

We haven't planned to move forever, so we are hoping to initially rent for around 2 years and then go from there. We have settled on Amsterdam, probably towards the south, and have seen some likeable property in places like Amstelveen.

GeniB

Hi Lipstick Well you have certainly given yourself a challenge.Of all the European countries to move to I would say that NL is probably one of the most controlled and difficult to get in to.I lived there for 30 yrs and brought up two girls within the system.Not easy.How are you with languages? The Dutch will insist you learn Dutch(not only your children)on average they give you 18 months before you start getting asked THAT question (how long have you lived here? why don't you speak Dutch) Quite right in my eyes by the way. but can annoy some foreigners.? why?The red tape can also drive you mad.Then there is the very high tax's.the hidden costs of living.I could go on.On the question of tax you might consider Belgium as the better option.Their healthcare was also considered superior.not to mention their food,shopping,and chocolate lol. For me if I could have lived in Antwerp I would have been in heaven.You only find out these things though after living in a country for awhile.My advice would be if your set on NL.(a) Visit for goodness sake!! even the smell of a country can put people off.(it did me in the beginning)(b) take a holiday there .you get the sound of the language and the style of the people.over a period of time (c) If your still keen .RENT for at least the first 5 yrs. As ex-pats you will be entitled to the 35% tax for (I think?) 10 yrs.After that it makes much more sense to buy.Life in the north (Amsterdam)is excessively busy but ex-pats are more accepted.Life in the south is quieter,better climate,but your chances of getting a job would be less.However you say you have your own business,check that out throughly before you move.You will need to register with the KVK.Ex-pats never realise just how much paperwork needs to be done to move countries (never having had to do it at home,registered at birth)Don't underestimate the Dutch they are super efficient.Having said all that ,it remains one of the best countries to bring up independent well-rounded kids.good luck

lipstickladybirds

Hi GeniB

Thanks for your reply.

Your advice has given us a little bit more to think about, so thank you I have started learing some Dutch over the past couple of weeks, and I am also apart of a language exchange programme in which I offer skills in English to a native Dutch speaker and vice versa. I am quite good with picking up some aspects of language. My husband has also started to learn Dutch and we have also been teaching some words to our son, who is enjoying it.

We have explored some of our tax options and are comfortable with the arrangement in Netherlands, but we will look into it a some more for the business side, and I will definitely have a look at KVK.

We have looked at Belgium as an option too, but one of our priorities is h low we bring up our son, and I agree with you, I think the Dutch attitude to parenting really does help bring out a great side to their kids.

What was your experience bringing up your girls? What was the education like? Are you still living in NL?

Nicole

GeniB

Hi Lipstick...We were headhunted to go over to NL by a totally Dutch company (altho they did have a brief fling with an American one when OH was recruited,part of the lure was speaking English at work.That stopped abruptly three weeks after we arrived and they left ) My situation was entirely different to yours in that I was not employed Actually had not realised that women were NOT employed in NL after marriage ( yes really! in 1983) I therefore found it very hard to settle.Living in a tiny village in the south where there were no foreigners.It was as if I had flown to Mars.You literally have to start your life from scratch again.Most important thing was getting out there.Meeting other mums if your child attends a local school.Going completely Dutch though can be incredible lonely until you master the language. You have to be prepared for that period of being thrown together as a family without support. As you will be working from home as well that can be an added pressure. Primary Education in a Dutch school is great. The problems arise when you have to decide if you staying or going when it comes to senior school.It doesn't really matter hugely before then.The crunch comes between choosing English Education (International School) or Dutch local school Or even sending your child away to boarding school as some have done.It's not easy. It's hard to have a foot in both camps.If you choose Dutch education and local life the Dutch will expect you to fully participate and thats your path for life in NL .Likewise if you choose International School and ex-pat life you will find you become completely immersed in that as they rely on a lot of help from the parents,plus the social life revolves a lot around the schools.little chance then of interacting with the locals . We chose International schools simple because we never anticipated staying longer than two/three yrs..My OH's incredible( read unheard of) rise in the company to Board Member by the time he was 40yrs had not been foreseen by me.(or him)To tell you the truth I was pretty dismayed by that for a number of yrs as it anchored us in NL whilst he travelled the world. I had intended to return to the UK at some point to re-train.Not something that was really open to me in NL in the area and situation I found myself in.ie often a one parent family for weeks / months or even towards the end of OH's career- two yrs .Holding the fort as it were. I found a lot of satisfaction however in joining clubs Badminton,Squash, The International Women's Club ( a great source of help with many nationalities in the same boat as you)I started an Art class.learned a lot of different skills over the yrs. including of course Dutch My daughters enjoyed their school years,learn't to be very independent.However I have to be honest and say that going back to the UK to university was a naive mistake on our part.They were simple not English anymore and suffered the consequences. being treated as International students, they constantly fell between the stools so to speak.To be fair we had been warned about this right at the beginning .Thats why I am saying it to you.You will have a very few yrs in which to make a choice for yourself but above all for your child.International Education where we lived was so/so better than the UK in many ways but not always consistent. There's the rub again.You will constantly want to compare and you can't reasonable do so.It is always going to be a compromise .However being a small school (then) they got into good Uni's in the UK and the school had above average Oxbridge entries.There was however no support for any child with leaning difficulties.My ED was only diagnosed as Dyslexic when she was 15 yrs old!! It had been consistently ignored by the English teachers.Only when A Spanish teacher arrived at the school was it flagged up.Way too late for her of course That wasn't unusual then..but it's a question you must ask of any school you choose ,even today. These are the things that come unexpectedly of course.Neither of my D's could find employment in NL once they left Uni .Again something you must think about if you stay the course and you haven't followed Dutch Education.They are sticklers for protocol and rules.If you haven't got a certain Dutch certificate then they can't employ you.Ironically if you are brought in from outside the country..that's not a problem..My D's both gave up after 12 months trying.ED now lives and works in the USA. YD got a job within a week of returning to the UK,joining many Dutch members of her class who had had no such problem the other way around. Each country has it's own more hidden rules perhaps?. We no longer live in NL. We moved to Portugal 5 yrs ago and totally love it. NL was a place to work for OH and further his career,he was very successful.For me it was more of an endurance test.not a place I would have willingly chosen,living there prevented me from having a career.On the other hand it opened up a lot of other doors for me I would never have experienced in the UK.I think I grew as a person,became a European in fact.My D's knowing no different thought every child cycled to school,skated on frozen ponds,spoke three/four languages/ had fairgrounds in their village street/watched St Nicholas arrive on his white horse with his Zwarte Piets on Dec 5th and then also had christmas and Father christmas.went away to camps at the Beginning of the school term..etc etc.In other words.a magical childhood.
A LOT to think about (and of course everyone has a different experience. Lip ).PM me if you want to know anything more

calman014

If you decide to settle in NL, send me a PM. I can help you with a lot of questions regarding setting up your business so you don't end up wasting time or money. I owned my own company for 20 years here. Good Luck.

NB: please don't underestimate the competition in the IT sector in NL, although your customers can be global of course..