Opening the Can of Worms Thread
Oct 28th 2017, 3:37 pm
#1
Listen to the Music
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Joined: Mar 2013
Location: Fraser Valley BC
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Opening the Can of Worms Thread
No doubt many of you out there have already known this but I chanced across this piece today: Ontario First Nations seek to raise Canada’s rent from current $4 per year | CTV News.
Now I'm a dumb SOB but it seems to me on the face of it that the First Nations have been taken to the cleaners over this one.
If found in the First Nation's favour, I hesitate to think what the accrual over the last century might amount to. But it's a pipe dream in the short term, there'll be half the lawyers on the country rubbing their hands and forcing open their piggy banks in expectation of taking both First Nations and Ontario to the place where they keep their gold.
Anyone know the rights and wrongs of this case?
Now I'm a dumb SOB but it seems to me on the face of it that the First Nations have been taken to the cleaners over this one.
If found in the First Nation's favour, I hesitate to think what the accrual over the last century might amount to. But it's a pipe dream in the short term, there'll be half the lawyers on the country rubbing their hands and forcing open their piggy banks in expectation of taking both First Nations and Ontario to the place where they keep their gold.
Anyone know the rights and wrongs of this case?
Oct 28th 2017, 4:29 pm
#2
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: South of Calgary
Posts: 13,375
Re: Opening the Can of Worms Thread
One assumes that the monies received from the provincial and federal governments "from the land" is the tax that is paid to them from which, I understand, First Nations receive a share of.
I guess I am missing something here.
There will also be limitation arguments that can be made.
I guess I am missing something here.
There will also be limitation arguments that can be made.
Oct 28th 2017, 6:32 pm
#3
Listen to the Music
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Joined: Mar 2013
Location: Fraser Valley BC
Posts: 4,725
Re: Opening the Can of Worms Thread
I've just had a look at the treaty and the relevant section states:
"The said William Benjamin Robinson, on behalf of Her Majesty, who desires to deal liberally and justly with all her subjects, further promises and agrees, that should the Territory hereby ceded by the parties of the second part at any future period produce such an amount as will enable the Government of this Province, without incurring loss, to increase the annuity hereby secured to them, then and in that case the same shall be augmented from time to time, provided that the amount paid to each individual shall not exceed the sum of one pound Provincial Currency in any one year, or such further sum as Her Majesty may be graciously pleased to order; and provided further that the number of Indians entitled to the benefit of this treaty shall amount to two-thirds of their present number, which is fourteen hundred and twenty-two, to entitle them to claim the full benefit thereof. And should they not at any future period amount to two-thirds of fourteen hundred and twenty-two, then the said annuity shall be diminished in proportion to their actual numbers."
The date of the treaty is 1850 and I gather that in 1874 the annuity payment increased to 4 pound pa and has not increased since. I'm no legal brain but the treaty states that 'Her Majesty, who desires to deal liberally and justly' seems to bind the government to liberal and just treatment of the first nations. I suppose the question the courts will have to consider is whether they consider the provinsial government has behaved in a liberal and just manner.
I understand that some would argue that the treaty is no longer alive but if payments are still being made under this treaty, even at such a lowly sum, then it must surely remain alive.
"The said William Benjamin Robinson, on behalf of Her Majesty, who desires to deal liberally and justly with all her subjects, further promises and agrees, that should the Territory hereby ceded by the parties of the second part at any future period produce such an amount as will enable the Government of this Province, without incurring loss, to increase the annuity hereby secured to them, then and in that case the same shall be augmented from time to time, provided that the amount paid to each individual shall not exceed the sum of one pound Provincial Currency in any one year, or such further sum as Her Majesty may be graciously pleased to order; and provided further that the number of Indians entitled to the benefit of this treaty shall amount to two-thirds of their present number, which is fourteen hundred and twenty-two, to entitle them to claim the full benefit thereof. And should they not at any future period amount to two-thirds of fourteen hundred and twenty-two, then the said annuity shall be diminished in proportion to their actual numbers."
The date of the treaty is 1850 and I gather that in 1874 the annuity payment increased to 4 pound pa and has not increased since. I'm no legal brain but the treaty states that 'Her Majesty, who desires to deal liberally and justly' seems to bind the government to liberal and just treatment of the first nations. I suppose the question the courts will have to consider is whether they consider the provinsial government has behaved in a liberal and just manner.
I understand that some would argue that the treaty is no longer alive but if payments are still being made under this treaty, even at such a lowly sum, then it must surely remain alive.
