JamesM

We get it.

You don't like religion.

You bring your hatred it of it into every thread.

Can you give it a rest now????

Zoe Bell

I could not disagree with you more on this point. Try being one of only 4 females on a physics/engineering degree program. Try achieving despite the 10% or so you are marked down every assignment compared to your male peers. Try getting into the research groups that will help you make the connections needed to further your career when none of your professors feel you should be there in the first place.

the discrimination is subtle and is still there even if you don't see it.

For a genuinely interesting watch I'd recommend the documentary Miss Representation to see just exactly how the media portrays women in positions of authority.

I think it was the new CEO of HSBC, who was announced as "<so and so>, Mother of three becomes the new CEO."

when would you every hear a man described in such a fashion with regards to his employment?

Shard

It's relevant to the discussion. Gender equality is at it worst owing to religion. As Jings has just written, the amount of gender inequality in the UK and Canada is negligible (at least it can be argued that). This is not the case in certain religious communities which are set up on misogynist lines. I won't bring it up on a thread about smartphones or cheese, but if the discussion is about women or schooling or other society type issues, I will bring it up.

gryphea

I think this weeks apega salary stats demonstrate this, after all they are grade for grade; they are not stats based on age.

At my work we see younger men taking significant paternity leave and quite a few women have house husbands. I think Jings 5 years off is way off the mark; I know no-one in the workplace who did that.

But I can't believe his views are real and think he is trying to wind me up!

Jingsamichty

Let's take a breath here...

I'm not so naive as to think that no gender discrimination takes place. Of course it does. BUT, in the West, I think it's negligible compared to other everyday discriminations... what school you went to, skin colour, race/cultural, even homophobia.

If you choose to measure gender equality/inequality solely by the workplace or salary as seems to be the case here, then I argue very strongly that young women DO have virtually the same OPPORTUNITY as young men. Life - marriage, children - mean that many women cannot take up those opportunities in the same way that men do, and so end up losing out. But I'll argue all day long that that is not inherent gender discrimination.

Anyway, to go back to my main point, which was the irony of appointing Emma Watson to the role - if you want to select a figurehead for women's equality in the workplace, is a young actress-cum-clothes horse really the best way to do that? Don't you think a fashion/cosmetic model is actually reinforcing gender stereotypes?

Shard

I think most have answered that we don't think Emma Watson is a problematic choice.

Isn't your position slightly ironic? You don't see there being a general inequality in the West but you do see Emma as reinforcing the stereotype?

Oink

I agree with Jingles here. I think she was a poor choice mainly as her tits are too small.

JamesM

Jingsamichty

It's not my position that's ironic. Do you think that a young woman who trades on her physical appearance to sell makeup and frocks is an empowering role model who will encourage more young women take up traditionally male workplace roles like engineering...?

Alan2005

She trades on her fame more than her good looks I think.

Shard

I don't have a people trading on their physical appearance. It's not for everyone though, and it's definitely not for those that have not been blessed with good looks. Plenty of other role models exist for women who want to empower themselves.

Anyway, her main message appears to be that men should stick up for women. I imagine you would agree with that in the end.

jimf

Are you suggesting that outcome measured by salary should be equal between the genders for any occupation to demonstrate equality of opportunity in that occupation?

bats

Discrimination definitely exists. If you are female and work in a hospital people first ask if you are a nurse. If male they ask if you are a doctor. More than once I've been the person in charge working with a junior male trainee and patients direct their questions to him. I'll bet that when Zoe says she is/was a teacher the assumption was that she taught something in the arts.

In professions that are female dominated, such as nursing, it's common for the male nurses to be promoted rather than a female nurse.

Oh and Emma Watson is an actor not an actress, there's no need for a different job title.

Sally Redux

Keep digging.

Women aren't taking up engineering because of makeup and 'frocks'?

Jingsamichty

I said nothing of the sort and you know it.